So first off let me just thank everyone here for providing me with all the info I could possibly soak up while building my first few surfboards. There’s a lot of seriously smart people and a ridiculous amount of info on this site so it’s definitely been my go-to for any questions I’ve had I just feel bad I haven’t reciprocated anything so before I ask my first question I’m attaching a couple pics of my first boards so I hope it works.
They were both 1# EPS stringerless epoxy. The green one is 5’6’" and the black Jay Adams board is a 6’1". The green one I painted and stenciled myself and the Jay Adams was painted by my buddy.
So for my 3rd board I went for the cutlap. I also went for my first swallow tail and double wings. which turned out trickier than I thought doing them both together because I could not get the laps to cover the deck rails in a couple small spots so I had to go back a patch them. On the tail I left the laps long on the rails so I could pull them across the deck and cover the. middle parts of the tail where the two points meet. I don’t know if that’s correct but it’s the only way I could figure out how to do it so if anyone knows of a better way I would love to know as well. On the double wings the. way they were angled made it possible to get coverage on the top two but not the bottom two so any tips on those would be cool too.
All that was fine until I couldn’t get my tape to stick to lay down my other side. Like at all. On the first two boards I had no problems taping the board at any stage at all, I used west systems epoxy and slow hardener and didn’t go get any special tape at all I just used Kelly Moore white painters tape. This time around I laminated with TAP plastics marine epoxy and medium hardener with TAP plastics pigments and I can’t get even the most highly recommended tape for this application to stick to the lam remotely. It’s like trying to stick paper on it. I tried duct tape just to see if it would even stick and nothing. I have wiped the lam with denatured alcohol and even tried carefully wiping water and dish soap on it in one little spot to remove any oils but nothing has worked so far.
The only thing I can think of is to hot coat the bottom with a different epoxy and then lam the deck after that? Any help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!
Moderator’s note: pics too large, here are the links
your pics at 2448 x 3264 pixels are huge. 600 - 800 pixels for the largest dimension is usually plenty for posting on the forum. No need for pictures to be any bigger than they appear in the post.
some occasional paragraph breaks make it easier to read too, just sayin’
Oh sorry about that they look normal size on my phone. Is it possible to resize them on iphone or do you need to do it on the computer? But yea sorry for my one giant paragraph I guess that does suck for reading
Hey Blake, don’t have a definitive answer, but the question was addressed toward the end of that thread I linked for you (on page 2).
I had a feeling you were posting from a phone - I do that a lot too, and it does have some differences from posting from computer.
Here’s the same post, broken up
So first off let me just thank everyone here for providing me with all the info I could possibly soak up while building my first few surfboards. There’s a lot of seriously smart people and a ridiculous amount of info on this site so it’s definitely been my go-to for any questions I’ve had
I just feel bad I haven’t reciprocated anything so before I ask my first question I’m attaching a couple pics of my first boards so I hope it works. They were both 1# EPS stringerless epoxy. The green one is 5’6’" and the black Jay Adams board is a 6’1". The green one I painted and stenciled myself and the Jay Adams was painted by my buddy.
So for my 3rd board I went for the cutlap. I also went for my first swallow tail and double wings. which turned out trickier than I thought doing them both together because I could not get the laps to cover the deck rails in a couple small spots so I had to go back a patch them. On the tail I left the laps long on the rails so I could pull them across the deck and cover the. middle parts of the tail where the two points meet. I don’t know if that’s correct but it’s the only way I could figure out how to do it so if anyone knows of a better way I would love to know as well.
On the double wings the way they were angled made it possible to get coverage on the top two but not the bottom two so any tips on those would be cool too. But all that was fine until I couldn’t get my tape to stick to lay down my other side. Like at all. On the first two boards I had no problems taping the board at any stage at all, I used west systems epoxy and slow hardener and didn’t go get any special tape at all I just used Kelly Moore white painters tape.
This time around I laminated with TAP plastics marine epoxy and medium hardener with TAP plastics pigments and I can’t get even the most highly recommended tape for this application to stick to the lam remotely. It’s like trying to stick paper on it. I tried duct tape just to see if it would even stick and nothing. I have wiped the lam with denatured alcohol and even tried carefully wiping water and dish soap on it in one little spot to remove any oils but nothing has worked so far.
The only thing I can think of is to hot coat the bottom with a different epoxy and then lam the deck after that? Any help would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks for that. I edited the original with spaces and tried resizing using some app but not sure if it worked. They still look the same size on my phone though
Make sure the tape and board surface is fairly warm. If its cold it will never stick. After the tape is down, go back over it with a finger or palm of hand and rub it down until it gets warm…rub and push it into the waffle weave of the cloth.
You are a fantastic artist…but not so much a surfboard builder yet. Keep at it, and foil and thin those rails.
Thanks resinhead yesterday was kinda cold today I’ll turn the space heater on in my garage and give it a go. But yea they all came out with a little thicker rails than I wanted . I’m a little more satisfied with with the rails on the orange one but they are still too thick…
Hey Huck---- I want to say thanks for the work you have been doing in resizing and reposting all the pics in this thread and various others. It’s a big help. Hopefully we’ll all learn to do it correctly and things will smooth out. Mahalo, Lowel
As RH said; warm it up. Tape won’t stick to anything cold. 233 usually sticks good, so it’s probably the cold. As a last resort and if you really think it has something to do with the Tap Resin; You could baste some West sytems lam resin over the area where your tape will be. Let it set and then see if your tape will stick to that. Also— It has been my experience that most tapes have a tough time sticking to pigmented fabric. I’m not saying they won’t stick; but they sometimes require more effort. Especially if the pigment is heavy or opaque. Lowel PS- You can thin the deck on EPS and foil the rails into it. Yes you will be losing volumne. So your board will be thinner. Always start with a blank that will give you the thickness you want. You could start with a thicker blank and thin/foil the rails up into the deck and still net the thickness/volumne you need or want. It all starts with the right blank. I suggest you buy a close tolerance blank next time and try that. A Marko or a US Blanks EPS. It will give you a feel for what to do or not do on a slab blank. by the way; Have you checked those “stringerless” boards for symmetry? I was wondering how with only a couple of boards under you belt you were able to center-point referance your blank?? Also; How do you stabilize the rocker in a stringerless blank without a table or vaccum bag? After you’ve glassed one side; Does it alter your rocker??
Well you guys were right I heated my garage with my space heater and the tape stuck to it really well so thank you both for the quick reply!
I would like to get a real blank with a stringer I think that would help for sure. I know they are not perfectly symmetrical because I could tell a little by looking after shaping each one. It isn’t super noticeable but I know one side not exactly the same as the other on any of them but they’re close enough for the first few. I read somewhere it’s easy to overshape your first one or something so I just try to not do that.
The process I used on them all is just hope depot insulation foam glued together and then I put weight in the middle to set the rocker while the glue dries then I draw a centerline and trace my outline around that. I do that on the deck side then saw out the rough shape with a hand saw
then I start planing the bottom first taking most of the thickness away on the bottom and doing the rocker and concave. Then I put the board on the side and plane just down to the sharpie line on the top. Then once I have the outline I do the top and blend the rails in. So basically I guess I just keep the sharpie centerline and outline on the foam as long as I can.
Does close tolerance just mean a blank that is already the rough shape of the board?
Hi Lowel - Thanks, I actually have a volunteer willing to help rewrite the html code to eliminate the problem. I have forwarded the offer to Mike Paler, and am hoping for the best. At the very least, a note on the upload menu to size photos close to the size they will appear would be a big help. Or something like a limit of 150 KB, or 1000 pixels widest dimension. As it is, there is no clue on the upload menu, so how would you know? I just keep plugging holes in the dike, lol.
…150Kb is not so much in some situations; you should go for the size not for the resolution; I have lots of photos that are less than 900 pixels but are more than 150kb and fit perfectly well everywhere in internet.
As a resuilt, one member has volunteered to help rewrite the code so that the problem no longer exists. I have forwarded the offer to site owner Mike Paler. Meanwhile for now all we have to do is resize pics to approximate size they appear in post. EAsy peazy, anyone can do it. But will be mo betta if the upload feature will do it for us. Let’s hope.
Consider splitting your blank and glue it back together with glue or pigmented Epoxy resinn. This will give you a center line to focus on when shaping. The blank is still considered stringerless. You can glue a slab blank easily with cheap bar clamps. I bought mine at Haror Freight. Lowel
That’s a good idea what glue would you use? I use gorilla glue to glue the sheets together but not good for sanding and sometimes tears the foam on the 1# eps. I tried like two bottles of Elmer’s glue on one but the next day it wasn’t very strong at all so I just ended up using gorilla glue again.
Pigmented Epoxy is probably best. Then you can see the line easily. But -Gorilla-Glue makes a white glue that works really well. The foamy brown Gorilla Glue stays soft and pulls foam.
