Hey swaylocks, so this is my first time posting here but I’ve been an avid reader for a long time.
So I have a board I’d like to start but wanted to hear some thoughts from this community in regard to design… I’ll be using paulownia wood so I best know what I’m doing before I mill and start cutting anything.
My background is woodworking and I’ve built 5 surfboards 1 tom Blake fish frame style the rest were using Roy’s parallel pfofile method.
I’m curious to attempt a retro channel rail style plan shape and bottom but with a parallel profile wooden construction. I’ve got some good edeas on how to build it but first I’ll see what you guys say about my design so far. It’s best to talk it out now versus going down a path of slight unknows.
Dimesnsilns are 7’3" x 24" I think I will shoot for around 3 inches thick. I need the volume I weigh in at 210 plus it’s a started short board for myself. I’m too stubborn to buy any more boards seeing how I have lots of wood and tools it’s almost as if making boards just fell into my lap. I have a sweet furniture shop with space to do boards so allot is possible
So here’s a picture of the fish I just made for my brother (partly x mas gift, partly he paid me) we were able to pump it out over about 60 hours during the last month, (not finished yet tho) this is built with Roy’s parallel profile method. It’s an old school fish with a quad and twin set up.
I’m posting up a picture to show what I can attain as far as a parallel profile surfboard goes, this fish has 50/50 rails with 70/30 down rail towards the tail. Single concave.
Just showing this picture to give a sense of what I want out of my concept parallel profile retro shape.
Hey Henry welcome to swaylocks kinds hard for us to say much in response, almost nobody here builds with parallel profile method. I’m not gonna criticize what I haven’t tried, but those boards just aren’t foiled the same as most surfboards. Hence the name parallel profile - it’s a different ballgame. If you’ve built five already I think that makes you the resident expert, you should be telling us no asking lol. You would probably get further on the tree to sea forum, you must be on that forum right? Roy is a regular poster there, and there are a few others I know of who build with that method who could give you more meaningful feedback.
Hi Huck thanks for the response. I do post on tree 2 sea but figured I’d take a discussion here for once. tree 2 sea is great but I figured more people here would have built a retro shape like the one I’m curious about. I guess I’m just not too sure about the plan shape/ bottom contour channel potential coupled with a parallel profile construction, it’s just a big unknown I guess, I haven’t seem anyone do something like it before, I don’t think…
The key word is foil - you could discuss planshape, but the foil of a parallel profile is so radically different it’s like comparing apples to oranges, in my opinion.
Oh yeah I deffinitly understand that the thickness is constant throughout but it’s still rockered almost the same or can be At least I’m pretty sure. So when it comes to the foil which you speak of, which is the thinning of the board which achieves the rocker and volume essentially… The big difference then with parallel pfofile and the typical tapering thickness boards would be buoyancy distribution and rail thickness obviously, am I right with this?
I’m just trying to get a sense on this board I thought up, so sorry if I’m coming off as a green horn of shaping (which I am ! Lol) as a carpenter and builder I gotta think of the crazy challenging ways to expand my own surfing experience and maybe create something worthy along the way…
Hey Henry unlike Huck who doesn’t know that much about surfboards, but is a moderator here, I think you did an outstanding job with that board according to your pictures. I am really impressed and encourage tp keep posting up pics of your boards, and your methods of building them. As far as your theory on buoyancy and rail thickness there is a bit of truth in what you said. Keep thinking and keep building, aloha…
Oh yeah, everyone has an opinion around here, and in my opinion most of those guys are wrong more often that correct.
I was thinking about Roy’s build method and it seems to me that the place to do most of the foiling for the nose and tail would be in the 2 internal layers. If you built the rocker bed to fit the desired result for the internal “torsion box” layers you could add the external layers afterwards and turn your rails from there.
Well having built a board from one of Roy’s kits it seems that the constant rail and the parallel profile allows for my pin tail to ride quite well, obviously it’s ridden from a sweet spot and moves much different than my takayama nose rider but it certainly rides very well. So this is why I wonder what other plan shapes might work nicely with this construction method. Surely the parallel profile fish will ride somewhat like a foam or grain fish.
Having thought of ways to put channels on the bottom and now experimenting with a tapered rail I just really wanna keep exploring what kind of board I could muster up with the parallel profile system.
So I thought of making a retro channel rail with a parallel profile wood construction, maybe taper the rail or even use a constant , seems to work on my pintail. Put some plugs in and really go wild with fin set ups too… I need a short board so might as well dream big. And a short board for me has a ton of volume and it’s about 7 ft lol. I need the volume due to humanly size
Hey Henry I think you did a good job too didn’t say otherwise, just said that a fish with no foil will ride different that one that is foiled. That’s just my opinion hahaha - apparently ghettorat thinks otherwise. I didn’t know he was a fan of parallel profile and heck, looks like he’s gonna tutor you on your next board, so you’re in good hands. I don’t know much about surfboards, so I’m looking forward to seeing what kinda imput he’s gonna have to make your next board a success! He’s a super talented surfer, shaper, glasser, etc. At least he says so, and since he hasn’t yet posted any pics of his work, so we’ll just have to take him at his word, er, opinion
That kinda personalized attention makes me feel all warm and fuzzy inside. Those words wouldn’t make me feel near as good coming from anyone else!
Hahah Huck it’s a good I know your a real person, ghettorat… I have no clue about him but tho. Huck I’ve seen your projects in t2s and I would think you know allot about surfboards actually so anything you say about my build I’ll take as constructive criticism or just a genuine compliment. However ghetto rat thank you for the kind wishes friend. So yes foil, buoyancy distribution, parallel profile vs taper profile… why does it need to taper? I think Roy has proven that it doesn’t need to taper to create a great riding board but like Huck mentioned it will just ride differently. I think I can live with that as a good answer. I built a Malibu shape with parallel profile, and it’s not a great board at all pretty much constructed from kindling except the deck and bottom so that’s cool but a Malibu in PP might not make sense with the design characteristics that come with this construction method.
I think I’m gonna see how this fish goes and use the rider feed back from my recent board to boost my confidence in going forward in the PP big guy retro I want to make. I’ve drawn it mostly so it’s just a matter of making to call to mill up some of my paulownia stash
Now you’re getting to the heart of what I’ve been saying - I’m not saying they ride any worse, just different. Everyone here pretty much foils their boards, so we don’t know in what ways different. Which is why I say you could teach us - you’ve built five of these, what did you observe?
I know Roy builds fishes and other shortboards with that method, so he could probably share insights about the shape, but he doesn’t post here. He does post a lot and is helpful on T2S especially if you’re building parallel profile, his specialty.
So that was the only reason I suggested T2S - not to insult your work in any way. And all kidding aside, I’ll be surprised if several people or even one person joins in the conversation here and really shares insights from their parallel profile boards.
But at any rate, by responding and having this conversation it keeps the topic at the top of the forum, so if there is anyone out there building parallel profile boards, hopefully they’ll chime in and educate us!
Btw, regarding your Malibu longboard- Roy is very vocal about not liking them. All his boards seem to have really narrow pintails - so maybe that compensates for all the thickness back there the rest of us don’t have?
Roy builds fishes, but I haven’t seen any video of them being ridden, so I’m clueless as to how they perform. If anyone knows of video showing a parallel profile fish being ridden, maybe they could post up a link!
Great looking work so far, keep the pics coming. I’m definitely curious to see how this technique translates to some other plan shapes. Here are my thoughts. I feel like foil is important in 70’s era boards (especially singles) here’s why. (but I’m sure people who were actually surfing in the 70’s will be happy to correct me.)
Water sticks to big fat round curves (drag=slow) but releases off of sharp edges (release =speed). Foil reduces the radius of the curves around the tail to create release, and reduce drag and allow the board to go fast(er).
the I’ve always assumed that roys boards compensate for lack of foil in the tail by using extreme pintails. so I’m not certain the technique translates well into other plan shapes. that said, maybe the big chines and the swallow tail will do the trick. maybe better than the pin? who knows? Still, I wonder if it would be worth the experiment to try take the parallel profile technique to the next level.
Sounds like you have the skills and experience to lead the way. Why not figure out how to build foil into it? You could try to estimate how far you would need to cut into each layer and build it accordingly. The last 18" of the board would have to be practically solid so that you could really mow into it with your planer like a regular blank.
Or don’t. Experiments work better one variable at a time. Either way. Keep posting pics.
Profile foil vs parallel profile. My takayama nose rider with convex bottom and my Stuart olo with single concave. Apples and oranges but still sweet long boards. I like Roy’s olos because they speak to the Tom Blake era but are huge improvements from then. Just thought this was a fun picture !
