adhesion problems with klearlam epoxy

General Discussion
1

hi guys I was wondering if any of you kiwi guys are using klearlam from adhesive tech in auckland.

I have glassed a few timber boards with it and have been having issues with bonding.

It is meant to be very much like kenitics epoxy and you can use polyester resin over it.

 on all the board the lams have gone well and bonded nicely to the timber or blanks but on the fill coats I have had mixed results. The first few boards I did the lam in kearlam  let it cure for  a week in my roof  and then sanded the whole lam with 80grit to give the poly fill coat a surface to key to this worked well but the poly would still chip of if you knocked it hard enough ( ie rocks etc when surfing ).

this time round I used epoxy to do the lam and fill coat and had a major issue as you will see in the photo. I wanted to fill coat as soon as possable after the lam to avoid contamation to the lam and to help the lam and the fill coat chemically bond. so heres what i did

1 lam as normal ( all mixing ratios bang on all new clean mixing pots )

2 let cure for 45mins at 24 deg c ( resin was still soft and tacky )

3 cut lap ( did not flip board so as not to contamanate the lam)

4 masked for fill coat ( with gloves on all the time  )

5 brushed on fill coat ( looked good no fish eyes etc)

6 cured whole board for 2 day

7 sanded .....

and as i was dusting board of i noticed the fill coat lifting. so I gave it a pick with a knife and the whole fill coat started lifting in big bits!!

both the lam and the fill coat had fully cure and were hard but no bond together!

what did i do wrong any ideas guys? I am planning to peel the fill coat off and try again but I do not want a repeat of this again

and ideas?

cheers antony

 

 

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2

Hey Huie

Do you mean the Ultra-White (R110/H110) Kinetix, or have they reformulated the standard R104/H125? Or is there another one? I was going to give RR a shot this summer, but then decided that since Kinetix works so well for me, why change!

Cheers
Paul

3

Hey Dean

These guys were selling it in 2011, not sure if they still are: http://www2.swaylocks.com/forums/latest-resin-research-formulas-oz

Cheers
Paul

4

Thanks Paul.

5

Is there someone selling RR in Oz?

6

and another pic

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7

hey stump

pm me and i will give you a few tips

 

 

** cheers huie
**

8

dunno man i just did one and am about to sand it ill let you know how it goes. i was hoady as with regards to taking care. it was cured for a few days before i fill coated it. i have a feeling that this epoxy might blush tho. it is nothing like kinetics imo

9

thank huie I will pm you tonight

I be keen to know how you get on paul. I fill coated only 2 hours after doing the lam

are you sanding the lam before you fill coated and are you doing fill coat with klearlam or poly?

cheers antony

 

10

hey antony i used clearlam for the lam and fill coat and waited a couple of days before fill coat and didnt touch anything.

so i started sanding the deck and it started happening so i switched to hand sanding and it didnt seem to happen after that . so no peeling on the bottom and a bit on the deck. rail fully peeled off but they sanded/blended in ok. the board is a personal board so ill surf the shit out of it and see how it goes. i have a feeling the problem may be Heat from sanding

11

but posibly blushing. it kicks off fast . 2hours is probably enough for blushing. it may need a water scrub. the other resin they sell doesnt have any problems like this and niether did the kinetics i tried. see what huie rekons… also it doesnt really sand as nice as kinetics. if i was gunna fill coat it it would be 20 mintues after. or as soon as it kicks/gells

12

it is bloody clear tho. never seen a board as white as this one

13

cheers paul thanks for the imput.

I pretty sure it was not heat from sanding as I was super slow on the sander as I did not want any burn throughs and i did a good bit of it by hand.

I PM'ed huie and hopefully he will have some anwers. Its odd as I thought that it would bond not problems as the lam was still soft as It was only just cured enough to do the cut lap when i did the fill coat.

I am abit un schooled in epoxy so how would you discribe blushing? I was thinking it was a whitey hase on the surface caused from humidity/ mostiure etc  an i way off on that?

anyway hope you get some good surf in i just got in from a fun surf at raglan nice dawny 2ft wave so on a high

 

antony

14

the big delam looks like there is no adehsion and the heat from the sander has lifted it?

 

this is the shizle big time’

**the 125 hardner is fast and works great with the old r 104   i only buy 6 litres so i have it fresh
**

‘’‘’'the rest check your e mails

 

**cheers huie
**

15

cheers bro

my local supplier is looking at bring in kinetic resin in the next few months. I have used the R 104 before and liked it

cheers antony

16

cheers bro

my local supplier is looking at bring in kinetic resin in the next few months. I have used the R 104 before and liked it

cheers antony

17

cheers bro

my local supplier is looking at bring in kinetic resin in the next few months. I have used the R 104 before and liked it

cheers antony

18

hey huie me old mate . did you email me.

19

hey paul I got hold of the rep from adhesive tech and he said that he thinks it was humidity  and not washing the lam that was my problem.

 he said that I must wash the lam with water and scotch brite it before the fill coat even with a klearlam  fill coat.

I was washing and scotch briting with a poly fill coat but it pretty shit having to do it with an epoxy one too. I really not that keen on wetting the lam

what your thoughts

thanks again also huie

antony

20

wont be a problem to wash it, i shuda done it but havent had the same problems with the other resins they sold