Best shape for a 105L board?

I need some advice on what shape would work best for me and my style of surfing.  I’m 6’5" tall and weigh 230-250 lbs (depending on how frequently we get waves).  I’ve got very broad shoulders and long arms.  I tend to keep my feet in place and use the rails to turn rather than walk up and down the board.  I started with short boards when I was younger, but now ride a 123L 11’ epoxy board.  The waves here in North Carolina are much wimpier than back in Hawaii, so that big board has become my go-to board for everything from ankle knockers to hand high overhead.  I’m looking to move to a shorter board that will turn and carve more easily, yet keep as much of the floatation and ease of paddling of the 11 footer as I can.  My other board, a 9’6" had 77L of floatation, which worked great back in Hawaii, but here in NC I’m having a hard time catching waves with it and what waves I did catch my take-offs were often late.

I’m thinking that board dimensions of 8’9" to 9’4" length, 25.5" to 26" wide and 3.75" to 4.5" thick might work best for me.  I tried paddling my wife’s SUP which is 28" wide and my 11’ is 25.75" wide, so I can easily paddle a 26" wide board, that won’t be an issue.  What I’m not sure about is the outline, rocker and fin setup.  I plan on working with one of the local shapers to build it, but since this sort of size is out of the norm for most shapers, I thought I’d get some opinions and ideas here.  One idea I have is to go with something like a “rocket fish” outline:  wide, with soft double wings and a swallow tail, pretty flat rockered and quad fins.  But that’s mostly because I think those shapes are pretty.  Any other ideas / suggestions?  Another thought was to just buy a small SUP.  But most come with deck pads glued on already and I’d rather have something in the 26" width range rather than 28"+.

…:::…

My youngest son is your size.  He’s been surfing early 60’s style pigs for the last couple years.  Those pick up the wave sooner and turn better in the pocket than the noseriders.  Less walking and more trimming.  He’s also got an 8-4 Simmons type board coming from a friend of ours (swapped a car for it).  Those things carry a lot of volume for their length.  That board is somewhat similar to what you’ve got going there except that they carry a hip and the wide point forward of the fins and a more parallel rail line forward of that.      

 

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very funny!  (don't let Laird see that thing!)

@jebediah - LOL :slight_smile:  Can’t tell you how many times I wish I had one of those things.

Why do you call yourself "Kahuna"? Do you even know what it means?

I do, and no I’m not a Hawaiian “kahuna”.  But at 6’5" and 250 lbs, I’ve probably got more gross tonnage than most everyone else in the lineup.  I’m also old enough to remember the original “big kahuna”, Cliff Robertson, in the movie “Gidget”.  But what does that have to do with anything?

Just finished this shape for a guy your weight (he's a bit shorter).  9'9" x 4.25" Th.

 23" wide, thumb tail.  For west coast waves.  The logic is to keep the board

a bit narrower than a SUP to keep it reasonable to turn without pivoting on a paddleblade. 

 Also, he's not a noserider so the nose is foiled and narrowed to keep the swing weight down. 

Volume  is the same as his old 10'8" x 3 1/8".  Wide point is dead center.  PM me if you

 would like to see the file.

 

@surfteach - That looks a lot like a 9’6" I had while living in S. California (can’t remember who shaped it, but it had the “Encinitas” logo on it).  I loved that board in the surf in Carlsbad.  Any idea what the volume for that board works out to be?

Thanks for the input guys.

Maybe it's me. Just struck me oddly. People don't normally throw words like, Priest or Rabbi around much. And no, it doesn't have anything to do with size, Sandra, or Sally.

tblank - You’re making this way too personal.  There have been dozens, possibly hundreds of companies, products, etc. etc. named “big kahuna”.  Starting with the character Cliff Robertson portrayed in the 60’s, there’s a radio station that claims they’re the “big kahuna” in Hawaii, a hamburger that’s called the “big kahuna” in Waikiki, and the list goes on and on.  I’ve been using this username for years and there’s at least one other user here that uses a variation of the same name.  For jeesh sake, dude, it’s just a username.  Get over it.

The board you remember was probably a Hansen.

The board I pictured has a volume of 4.1 cubic feet or

115 liters.  I got a Surfblanks yellow foam SUP blank and

it was as light as a 2 pound EPS board before painting.

Waiting to see how it glasses out, will post pics on the

"what are you making thread".  Hope this helps!

@surfteach - My old board definitely wasn’t a Hansen, I couldn’t afford one of those.  I picked it up at Longboard Grotto during the 90’s and it came from the “Encinitas Surf Shop” originally.  I don’t remember who the shaper was, but it definitely wasn’t Hansen (that, I would have remembered).  It had wood nose and tail blocks and 3 stringers.  Really pretty board and loved riding it at Terra Mar in Carlsbad back when I was living there.  I beat the heck out of that board and ended up selling it when I moved back to Hawaii and got an epoxy instead.

Your SUP is a really pretty shape.  That’s going to come out really nicely.

Mr. Atlantic Beach, not trying to make this personal nor taking it that way though there are those that do. I know the term has been bastardized by Hollywood and the media but it is a part of people's faith. No attack meant.

Kinda reminds me of what our parents used to ask: "If all your friends jump off the bridge, does it mean you would too?

Maybe this will add some clarity so we can get back to the subject at hand.  Joe Blair atjblairsurf.com has some real ideas about shapes that work for

larger individuals.  Check out his website...he sure makes a purty board.

 

**What Is A Kahuna?  by Serge Kahili King**

There is still a lot of misunderstanding about Hawaiian kahunas, so I'm writing this to bring some clarity to the subject.

According to Lorrin Andrews, author of the first Hawaiian dictionary published in 1865, "kahuna" is a contraction of "kahu" (to cook, especially in an earth oven) and "ana" (a particle that adds "ing" to a word). So the base meaning by this idea is "a cooking." This doesn't make much sense until you learn that "kahu" also means "to tend an oven, or to take care of the cooking." Ancient Hawaiian thought, from our point of view, was very symbolic or figurative and a word for one type of activity or experience could be applied to other symbolically related activities or experiences. So "kahu," originally referring to taking care of an oven, became a general word for taking care of anything. Another possible origin for the word "kahuna," however, is that it is simply a combination of "kahu" (to take care of) and "na" (a particle that makes words into nouns). In that case, a basic translation of "kahuna" would be "a caretaker."

Over time languages change and at some point "kahu" and "kahuna" both became nouns with somewhat different meanings. The word "kahu" came to refer not only to caretakers, but to what are now known as "care-givers," as well as to administrators, regents, pastors, masters and mistresses of households, dog-owners, and leaders of clubs, associations, orders and other groups. The word "kahuna," according to J.S. Emerson, an early observer of Hawaiian culture, "suggests more of the professional relation of the priest to the community."

Andrews, mentioned above, defines a "kahuna" as "a general name applied to such persons as have a trade, an art, or who practice some profession." He says that some qualifying term is generally added, such as "kahuna lapa'au, a physician; kahuna pule, a priest; kahuna kalai la'au, a carpenter; kahuna kala, a silversmith." He also notes that "the word kahuna without any qualifying term (generally) refers to the priest or the person who offers sacrifices." Pukui and Elbert, authors of the modern standard Hawaiian dictionary, define a kahuna as a "priest, sorcerer, magician, wizard, minister, expert in any profession (whether male of female)." They add that under the 1845 laws of the Hawaiian kingdom doctors, surgeons and dentists were called kahuna.

David Malo, author of Hawaiian Antiquities , writes only about kahunas as priests and healers without going into a lot of detail about their organization. Samuel Kamakau, in The People of Old , goes into quite a bit of detail about the classes of sorcerers and healers, priests and prophets, and also mentions kahuna geologists, geomancers, psychics, martial artists, spear-throwers, "and many other classes besides." In Ruling Chiefs of Hawaii Kamakau describes a kahuna, Paka'a, who was a master of geology, psychic perception, and navigation. He also describes many kahuna craftsmen who were chosen by Kamehameha the Great to be in charge of canoe-making, surf-board making, bowl-making, dyeing, navigation, and many other crafts. In addition, Kamakau briefly describes the rules followed by boys who were in training to become kahunas. John Papa I'i, writing from 1866 to 1870, gives a fair amount of detail about the priestly kahunas and the practices of the medical kahunas of the time.

In Volume One of Look To The Source by Pukui, Hertig and Lee, kahunas of old Hawaii are discussed in roles of sorcerers, priests and healers, but someone added this footnote on one page: "kahunas intensively trained in the traditional manner no longer exist," which is only a statement about the limited knowledge of whoever wrote that. In Volume Two the word "kahu" is defined as master or expert, with "ana" being added as Andrews suggested. Shortly after there is a quote from Mary Pukui who describes her grandfather as a kahuna canoe-maker, a kahuna fisherman, and a medical kahuna. This is followed by an interesting chapter on medical kahunas with some brief mentions of sorcerers, prophets, and modern fakes or healers and psychics only called kahunas by their clients. Also of interest is a short discussion of payment for services. It says that while some modern Hawaiians believe that medical kahunas did not charge for their services, several quotes are given from early Hawaiian writers who make it clear that, at least sometimes, they did accept offerings of pigs, food or tapa in exchange for their help. And it discusses some kahunas who set fees when a cash economy became prevalent.

Now what can we learn from this very brief historical survey of kahunas?

They were the experts of old Hawaii, experts in religion, health, crafts, science, psychology and magic.
"Kahuna" was a title, like M.D. or Ph.D., and additional descriptive words were used to designate the field of expertise.
Just as the modern use of the word "doctor" by itself is generally taken to mean a medical doctor, so the use of "kahuna" by itself generally designated a priest or healer.
They underwent intensive and extensive training before being recognized as experts in their field, either by their teacher or by the community.
Some kahunas were experts in many fields.
Kahunas could be male or female.
Although it is not explicitly stated above, it is clear from reading the above sources that kahunas of any kind were always attuned to the spiritual side of their expertise as well as to the material side.
Under the Monarchy the term "kahuna" began to be used for foreigners who were recognized experts in their fields, especially for ministers and health professionals.

In Territorial times, when Hawaii became a tourist destination, visitors discovered that the best surfer on the beach was called "kahuna nui he'e nalu," the "principal master surfer." Because of his expertise he was also the leader among the surfers, and they would follow his advice on boards and waves and the skill itself. He was called "kahuna nui" for short, and this soon became the phrase "big kahuna," which took on meanings of "big boss" or even "the biggest and the best" in any area, including hamburgers.

In modern times the word "kahuna" is used and misused in many ways. Some people without any traditional Hawaiian knowledge or training claim to have been "initiated" as kahunas, something which Hawaiians of old would have laughed at or been shocked by. Some Hawaiians fear the word because they automatically relate it to sorcery, and some Hawaiians say that no one can be a kahuna who isn't Hawaiian. Visitors come to Hawaii looking for a "kahuna," which for some means a psychic healer and for others means a shaman.

How do you know if someone is really a kahuna? There are no hard and fast rules, and there never have been. A deep knowledge and understanding of Hawaiian culture would seem to be a must if the word is to have any meaning in a Hawaiian context. In old Hawaii the main test would have been one's level of expertise in a given field of importance to Hawaiians. The teacher is the one who grants the title, so being able to name the teacher would seem to be a factor, too.

I was trained in a traditional way in "kalakupua," or "kupua" for short, a near equivalent to "shamanism," by my Auntie Laka and my Uncle Wana of the Kahili family, who originally came from Kauai. I was hanai'ed into that family as the grandson of Joseph Kahili in 1957. My last teacher, Wana Kahili, granted me the title of "kahuna kupua" in 1975 on Goleta Beach, California, based on the results of more than twenty years of training (including time with my father). Like most who have received a similar honor, I don't have a certificate to "prove" it and, since it was a private ceremony, there aren't any witnesses to attest to it. But I know what I know, and I know how to do what I do. That's enough for me.

However, I don't use that title any more. One aspect of Hawaiian culture I learned is to avoid offending others when you don't have to and some Hawaiians are offended by my use of it. So I am "kahu" to members of my organization who want to call me by a title, "Dr. King" to those who want to acknowledge my doctorate in psychology, and simply "Serge" to the rest of the world. I have Hawaiian names as well, but I honor my birth parents by publicly using the name they gave me.

So, what is a kahuna? Just a title that means what you think it does. If you meet a kahuna, respect the person for what he or she can do, more than for the title.

 

Maybe this info below will add some clarity so we can get back to the subject at hand.  SURFBOARDS! Joe Blair atjblairsurf.com has some real ideas about shapes that work for larger individuals.  Check out his website...he sure makes a purty board.

 

**What Is A Kahuna?  by Serge Kahili King**

There is still a lot of misunderstanding about Hawaiian kahunas, so I'm writing this to bring some clarity to the subject.

According to Lorrin Andrews, author of the first Hawaiian dictionary published in 1865, "kahuna" is a contraction of "kahu" (to cook, especially in an earth oven) and "ana" (a particle that adds "ing" to a word). So the base meaning by this idea is "a cooking." This doesn't make much sense until you learn that "kahu" also means "to tend an oven, or to take care of the cooking." Ancient Hawaiian thought, from our point of view, was very symbolic or figurative and a word for one type of activity or experience could be applied to other symbolically related activities or experiences. So "kahu," originally referring to taking care of an oven, became a general word for taking care of anything. Another possible origin for the word "kahuna," however, is that it is simply a combination of "kahu" (to take care of) and "na" (a particle that makes words into nouns). In that case, a basic translation of "kahuna" would be "a caretaker."

Over time languages change and at some point "kahu" and "kahuna" both became nouns with somewhat different meanings. The word "kahu" came to refer not only to caretakers, but to what are now known as "care-givers," as well as to administrators, regents, pastors, masters and mistresses of households, dog-owners, and leaders of clubs, associations, orders and other groups. The word "kahuna," according to J.S. Emerson, an early observer of Hawaiian culture, "suggests more of the professional relation of the priest to the community."

Andrews, mentioned above, defines a "kahuna" as "a general name applied to such persons as have a trade, an art, or who practice some profession." He says that some qualifying term is generally added, such as "kahuna lapa'au, a physician; kahuna pule, a priest; kahuna kalai la'au, a carpenter; kahuna kala, a silversmith." He also notes that "the word kahuna without any qualifying term (generally) refers to the priest or the person who offers sacrifices." Pukui and Elbert, authors of the modern standard Hawaiian dictionary, define a kahuna as a "priest, sorcerer, magician, wizard, minister, expert in any profession (whether male of female)." They add that under the 1845 laws of the Hawaiian kingdom doctors, surgeons and dentists were called kahuna.

David Malo, author of Hawaiian Antiquities , writes only about kahunas as priests and healers without going into a lot of detail about their organization. Samuel Kamakau, in The People of Old , goes into quite a bit of detail about the classes of sorcerers and healers, priests and prophets, and also mentions kahuna geologists, geomancers, psychics, martial artists, spear-throwers, "and many other classes besides." In Ruling Chiefs of Hawaii Kamakau describes a kahuna, Paka'a, who was a master of geology, psychic perception, and navigation. He also describes many kahuna craftsmen who were chosen by Kamehameha the Great to be in charge of canoe-making, surf-board making, bowl-making, dyeing, navigation, and many other crafts. In addition, Kamakau briefly describes the rules followed by boys who were in training to become kahunas. John Papa I'i, writing from 1866 to 1870, gives a fair amount of detail about the priestly kahunas and the practices of the medical kahunas of the time.

In Volume One of Look To The Source by Pukui, Hertig and Lee, kahunas of old Hawaii are discussed in roles of sorcerers, priests and healers, but someone added this footnote on one page: "kahunas intensively trained in the traditional manner no longer exist," which is only a statement about the limited knowledge of whoever wrote that. In Volume Two the word "kahu" is defined as master or expert, with "ana" being added as Andrews suggested. Shortly after there is a quote from Mary Pukui who describes her grandfather as a kahuna canoe-maker, a kahuna fisherman, and a medical kahuna. This is followed by an interesting chapter on medical kahunas with some brief mentions of sorcerers, prophets, and modern fakes or healers and psychics only called kahunas by their clients. Also of interest is a short discussion of payment for services. It says that while some modern Hawaiians believe that medical kahunas did not charge for their services, several quotes are given from early Hawaiian writers who make it clear that, at least sometimes, they did accept offerings of pigs, food or tapa in exchange for their help. And it discusses some kahunas who set fees when a cash economy became prevalent.

Now what can we learn from this very brief historical survey of kahunas?

They were the experts of old Hawaii, experts in religion, health, crafts, science, psychology and magic.
"Kahuna" was a title, like M.D. or Ph.D., and additional descriptive words were used to designate the field of expertise.
Just as the modern use of the word "doctor" by itself is generally taken to mean a medical doctor, so the use of "kahuna" by itself generally designated a priest or healer.
They underwent intensive and extensive training before being recognized as experts in their field, either by their teacher or by the community.
Some kahunas were experts in many fields.
Kahunas could be male or female.
Although it is not explicitly stated above, it is clear from reading the above sources that kahunas of any kind were always attuned to the spiritual side of their expertise as well as to the material side.
Under the Monarchy the term "kahuna" began to be used for foreigners who were recognized experts in their fields, especially for ministers and health professionals.

In Territorial times, when Hawaii became a tourist destination, visitors discovered that the best surfer on the beach was called "kahuna nui he'e nalu," the "principal master surfer." Because of his expertise he was also the leader among the surfers, and they would follow his advice on boards and waves and the skill itself. He was called "kahuna nui" for short, and this soon became the phrase "big kahuna," which took on meanings of "big boss" or even "the biggest and the best" in any area, including hamburgers.

In modern times the word "kahuna" is used and misused in many ways. Some people without any traditional Hawaiian knowledge or training claim to have been "initiated" as kahunas, something which Hawaiians of old would have laughed at or been shocked by. Some Hawaiians fear the word because they automatically relate it to sorcery, and some Hawaiians say that no one can be a kahuna who isn't Hawaiian. Visitors come to Hawaii looking for a "kahuna," which for some means a psychic healer and for others means a shaman.

How do you know if someone is really a kahuna? There are no hard and fast rules, and there never have been. A deep knowledge and understanding of Hawaiian culture would seem to be a must if the word is to have any meaning in a Hawaiian context. In old Hawaii the main test would have been one's level of expertise in a given field of importance to Hawaiians. The teacher is the one who grants the title, so being able to name the teacher would seem to be a factor, too.

I was trained in a traditional way in "kalakupua," or "kupua" for short, a near equivalent to "shamanism," by my Auntie Laka and my Uncle Wana of the Kahili family, who originally came from Kauai. I was hanai'ed into that family as the grandson of Joseph Kahili in 1957. My last teacher, Wana Kahili, granted me the title of "kahuna kupua" in 1975 on Goleta Beach, California, based on the results of more than twenty years of training (including time with my father). Like most who have received a similar honor, I don't have a certificate to "prove" it and, since it was a private ceremony, there aren't any witnesses to attest to it. But I know what I know, and I know how to do what I do. That's enough for me.

However, I don't use that title any more. One aspect of Hawaiian culture I learned is to avoid offending others when you don't have to and some Hawaiians are offended by my use of it. So I am "kahu" to members of my organization who want to call me by a title, "Dr. King" to those who want to acknowledge my doctorate in psychology, and simply "Serge" to the rest of the world. I have Hawaiian names as well, but I honor my birth parents by publicly using the name they gave me.

So, what is a kahuna? Just a title that means what you think it does. If you meet a kahuna, respect the person for what he or she can do, more than for the title.

 

Thank you for the edification, Tomp. Guess it's more than just a hamburger joint huh?

Aloha.

thanks for the education!

BK- I am 76" and weigh 220lbs. A 20 pound fluctuation in weight makes things hard for a dialed in shape for you. I have surfed NC waves from 80-85 and a firing Duct or Nags Head jetty is really fun.

 

I think you need to rethink your decision on a 105L board. That is just way to friggin big, unless you are considering resale value on a used SUP when you sell it.

You should be able to SUP on a 105 liter board at 230lbs, even at 26" wide.

 

I recommend at 26" wide x 2 3/4 inch 9’2" high performance long board. Please believe, it  will work. It won’t catch a non breaking wave but you will be ripping in the pocket with this thing.

 

 

 

my 9’2" x 23" x 2 1/2" is a wave catching machine. It rips like a short board too. When sitting in the water, water level is just above my naval.

 

My 6’8" x 24" x 3 1/8" that I made from a Mr J/P. Cannon design floats me better than the above long board. My junk gets wet and I am about 3" higher in the water than my long board. Catching waves in the same outside spot I normally sit with my long board. I can catch any wave I go for on both boards.

 

I know you think I am full of sh@t and you are going to do what you are going top do. Let me please encourage you when you make your too large 105L SUP to surf on that you keep the thick foam in the chest area and leave the working end of your board thinned out so it will at least surf with some performance. I have the privilege to contract work from two SUP shapers who have opposing views concerning tail thickness with SUP’s. I have worked on both and ridden both and the thinned tailed surfs much better in my opinion.

 

9’4" x 27" x 4 1/8"  will catch non breaking waves.

 

 

 

 

PS  They call me Haole and sometimes with the adjective F(&king.