Chipper told me our local supplier has some, knows nothing about it as he’s a poly guy…
Anyone know about this stuff???
East coast guys???
Sounds better than the Araldite mix I’ve been using…
hey hicksy have you tried west systems with a slow hardener
its a good resin and reasonably inexpensive
and also easy to get
the marine shops usually supply a good range of epoxy resin
dont believe all the anti west sentiment
they a make good epoxy
and its used in thousands of boats ships and yachts worldwide
it does tend to yellow a bit though in the sun
so you dhould spray a uv resist acrylic over the top
i found west system to be a little harsh …
generates heaps of heat …
and it tends to foam a lot while working it …
yes burfords do sell epoxy …
its the fiberglass hawaii brand …
found a new one recently …
unbelievable !!!
nice to work with , pleasant smell , water clear , so water clear i couldnt believe it was even a resin …
i would put it right next to resin research as the best resins around …
its a new ATL formula specifically developed for surfboards ??..
been around for about 6 months …
i would swear i was looking at resin research when using it …
even the hardener was identical with a few quirky things it does when you leave it exposed to air …
if i hadnt seen the label , i would swear i was using RR …
kind of weird , coz the guy who mixes RR down here , worked at ATL prior …
could be the biggest coincidence ever that a new formula developed came out exactly the same as RR , it even has the same really odd mix ratio by weight and they make the same claims about its uv properties …
anyway …
cheers to the industrial spy if it wasnt a coincidence …
coz now we got the RR standard in a locally made resin …
regards
BERT
yeah its not as good to use as some others
i agree with you bert about its working characteristics
but in a pinch. if i run out of resin or hardener
i sometimes nip down the marine shop for some west
also it doesnt need post curing
all the room temp resins ive tried seem to be a bit crappier than the post cure ones
sounds good on the ATL resin
maybe the technology just developed in parallel?
funny thing is i have been using atl stuff and doing some testing with it from 12 months ago. had sanding problems to start with. showed them sways and rr, then it improved outa site… now its good
sorry hicksy… yes burfords do have an epoxy. its fibreglass hawaiis mix, it has a fast and a slow hardener. they also have and additive f equivilent. fgi have a relativly new epoxy too called surfset. with a fast (3:1) and and a slow hardener(5:1). we have found that to be good also.
Just in regards to the ATL resin, does it come with something like additive f to make it more sandable? Or have you tried mixing some additive f to ATL’s surfboard epoxy? Just curious as it sounds like it adding some would be no trouble.
what about systemthree epoxies?
seem a little more poisonous and little more on the expensive side
but it gives us the longest work time when bagging here in Hawaii than anything else I’ve seen
doesn’t start kicking for a hour or so…
also Ned Mcmahon was indicating that they(homeblown) had a new bio-epoxy they were having success with along with their new bio-foam… They were also using a new bamboo composite cloth.
Alot of folks in Hawaii swear by the 2-1 FGH stuff even after doing boards side by side against RR and they make their own surfacing agent similar to additive F which I consider more of a surface relaxing agent than one used to produce a sanding surface.
And how come no one ever talks about the AST? stuff even though Javier has been using it for awhile with his XPS boards.
Bert,
Is that the Kinetix epoxy?
http://www.atlcomposites.com/products/epoxy-resins/laminating/index.htm
http://www.atlcomposites.com/pdf/KINETIX_R104_surfboard.pdf
They only do a min kit of 5kg which i thought would be a bit much to splurge on a first attempt at a board.
Is it possible to get RR in Aus (Gold Coast)? If so where?
scot
great to see you here bert !
yep ,
the resin sets ? really quickly according to the label on the hardener , 45 minutes for the ‘slow’ , and 10 minutes [?!] for the fast … i can’t l;aminate that fast .
maybe a 3: 1 mix may be better
it sure IS water clear …
yea scot ,thats the stuff…
im in currumbin now , if you wanna bring some jars up , i will decant a liter or 2 off for you , then i can quiz you on how you wanna use it , coz using epoxy doesnt mean you will get better results in some cases …
pm me and i will give you my mobile …
about the sanding additive …
im with oneula …
i ended up formulating my own additive a few years back , when i told greg how i did it , he said i was pretty close to the mark …
then when i started using additive f , i actually found it wasnt as easy to sand as the stuff i had made myself …
even tho stuff i made weakens the resin , because most of it gets sanded away , its no comprimise …
after working with the range of RR resins in a number of different enviroments and settings , we ended up having to reformulate the additive F to better suit some climates ,working conditions and systems …
so im not sure if greg will run those as stock formulas , or whether they will remain exclusive to firewire because it was developed in house …
either way , im sure if additive f isnt quite doing what you want , greg will tweak it to suit whatever your doing with it …
yea dave , i figured , one way or another the atl guys were influenced by RR …
i remember some of there early attempts at developing a surfboard laminating epoxy ??? but this one now is on another level …
reckon greg will have to get lab coat out and make sure he stays ahead of the pack …
regards
BERT
Quote:
sorry hicksy… yes burfords do have an epoxy. its fibreglass hawaiis mix, it has a fast and a slow hardener. they also have and additive f equivilent. fgi have a relativly new epoxy too called surfset. with a fast (3:1) and and a slow hardener(5:1). we have found that to be good also.
Hi Dave,
Have you had any problems with the banana peel affect when using poly filler over FGI’s Surfset?
I found when setting the plugs I got a bit of seperation unless I sanded the lam coat before the filler. According to the literature the surfset hardener was developed so you could finish with poly resin.
Apart from that I really like the FGI R180 epoxy, water clear and wets out great. Sands easy too.
Regards
Daren
HI mate. no i havent had any probs becuase i only finish epoxy boards with epoxy resins and finish coat them with epoxy too… its like trying to get coffee and tea mixed together to taste nice…
i think the FH additive is pretty much xylene and parafin. what ive been given works with any epoxy ive used
maybe my old factory would have been useful after all bert! actually with the atl you can juggle the two hardeners to get the time you want… chris who was doing the formulation at atl is quite good guy to explain stuff to! see you soon… as ive got a couple things to thru with you
no worries Dave , got a hectic day on tommorow , still plenty of stuff to organise …
you in your shop on saturday ??
if so i will drop by …
regards
BERT
yep… later is better on sat. dont rush it its not urgent
With all due respect, ATL has something decent. But do they offer different speeds in UV stable … NO. Do they offer resins with different flex modulas … no. Do they offer an additive F … NO. Do they have an X-55 … no. One resin and one hardener. WOW!
West and Systems Three? Please. These are old systems based on old aliphatic formulations. West is getting slammed all over the net because so many people have gotten sick. TETA, phenol and formadahyde!!! Read the MSDS.
There’s a new one going around CA right now being given away by the gallon. Yellows like crazy and the glass shops are using it anyway. Some people just don’t care. Had one of the top shapers call me asking WTF. I had to tell him that it’s not ours. He was PISSED! Another one of the big distributers in CA has had some stuff out for a few months. Turns brown. Made by Systems Three. Like West, based on aliphatic chemistry. Crap.
No one beats our product, no one beats our price. What’s everyone searching for?
Quote:
What’s everyone searching for?
Can’t get it here for some reason…
a better, cheaper, mouse trap.?