One of the most regretful things that ever happened to my surfing life was the switch from single to tri. Before the tri was developed I sailed to Maui. Before I sailed to Hawaii I had been making all my single fin boards. But once on Maui I did not have a place or time to make them right off. My first tri was an 6’8" Ole. Down the line the board went great. But I had the hardest time cutting back and redirecting. So I put that under a house and ordered a Maui Tropics, same thing, so that went under the house too. Then a friend who grew up on Kauai suggested a Progressive Expression, two of them, same thing. Then I started having Lloyd Ishimine shape me boards and that got better, but it was still at a point when Lloyd was just starting out and learning. But I stuck when him for 4 years or so. But during this time I tried a board of a friends that was made by Glenn Minami and this board just rocked. I could not figure it out, so I measured the fins and looked at the toe-in. What I found was that this 6’ 8" Minami had 5/16th toe. So I went and checked the old board I had stuck under the house. Almost all of them had little to no toe-in, mostly 1/8", a couple had 3/16th maybe.
I think the problem was that many of these guys were eyeing the toe-in in the early days of the tri. It seemed that I remember hearing that they pointed the fin at the nose or something.
I really feel that I suffered for nearly 7 years of my twelve on Maui because of incorrect fin setup. Luckily my last 5 years on Maui I surfed only Minami’s and Andrus boards, all of which worked fantastic. And all had good ammounts of toe-in.
Now I am riding boards by Patterson and all have been pretty good. I just wish I’d had not had to suffer during the tri learning curve. The kids these days are sooooo lucky to have the boards that they have.
I’ve stated this at least twice here and at least 4 times on surfer rag…
Tow in… half the distance to the nose…automatically adjusts for bigger faster waves (longer boards) and shorter, quicker, turns (under 6’ boards). Simple.
Wide boards, more toe-in…narrow guns, less tow in.
You’re kidding? Half the distance to the nose? I think that’s what I had the first go around with the speedfins, and I had to rout the things out and start over. Now they point to the nose, more or less, and I can at least ride the board now.
rKelly’s an engineer, so maybe he ought to be working out the unified theory of fin function. I’d like to see spring loaded fins that adjusted automatically to conditions within one ride. Think about it, you don’t turn an airplane by leaning, you adjust the ailerons and rudder. A shark sees me nearby, it twists a pectoral fin to come over and get a better look. What do we do? Lean the board over. Even a skateboard has more responsive behavior because the trucks move in such a way as to shorten the turning radius. Come on rKelly, you could be a millionaire.
leedd ? i actually do the complete opposite …more toe on bigger wave boards,more toe gives the fins a more favourable angle of attack ,so they tolerate a heavier load,higher speed turn without spinning out,its your inside and tail fins doing most of the work on high speed rail turns , even tho you do get more drag , that drag is a controling influence in large fast waves …
but it also depends on what your trying to achieve ,sometimes turning isnt really one of your options ,getting out of trouble is what counts ,so less toe ,full pin for hold ,flater rockered tail, get the hell out of there,but a single fin ,i feel is the best option for those type of waves …
Have you ever watched an expert skimboarder ride out towards a large incoming shorebreak wave, crank a radical turn at the top of the wave, sheet of spray a mile high and come down just in time for the sand barrel?
All done WITHOUT FINS
hmmmm…
There are very few secrets…surfboard fins are all about CONTROL. Thrusters offer many control benefits in a very simple configuration. Thats the beauty of it.
My toe-in is about 1.5 inches out from the stringer.
Simple check is to look at Oahu made semi guns and full gun tri fins. Those toe barely to midpoint between fin and stringer.
For you smaller, weaker waves, more toe in = quicker, easier turning.
My spot is OB, very similar in speed and power to some Hawaii waves, much faster than your typical SoCal, EC, or Texas waves, so I need more drop in speed, down the line distance, and pure top speed than you guys.
I’ve ridden over 20 twinfins with NO toe-in AND 7.5" side fins, and they work really well. Taken to Malibu, it’s be as stiff as a 10 single fin log.
Here is one way that works for me.Take a clean sheet of paper and write down the length,width,and thickness at center point.After you have recorded those numbers measure the rocker at 6 inch intervals using a straight edge.Now…measure the base of the fin and write that down.Add all of the numbers and then divide by 4.25.Record this number and it will give you the base line theory in decimals.Put a big circle around the afforementioned numbers.Now go to the bottom of the sheet of paper and draw a nice rendition of Jennifer Lopez’s butt.This will look just like like an apple if done correctly.Finally take the paper and transfer it carefully into the trash can.Now you are free to put the fins wherever you want.
Aloha ! your actually spot on with toe theary, Try Edge Fins and you can put this in action by just adjusting your fins with a simple screw and fell the difference it makes in performance for wave conditions…
I think that adjustable fin fystems are definitely the way to go. I’ve made a couple of boards which had the toe in just 1/32" too much - the effect was to turn the boards into super slow hopeless dogs. Once I’d reset them out just a little bit, the boards now fly. I’ll bet there are other boards out there that just don’t go properly, with people attributing their poor performance to rail shape or incorrect rocker or whatever. Toe in really has a super dramatic effect - especially it seems to me with loger based fins.
I think that adjustable fin fystems are definitely the way to go. I’ve made a couple of boards which had the toe in just 1/32" too much - the effect was to turn the boards into super slow hopeless dogs. Once I’d reset them out just a little bit, the boards now fly. I’ll bet there are other boards out there that just don’t go properly, with people attributing their poor performance to rail shape or incorrect rocker or whatever. Toe in really has a super dramatic effect - especially it seems to me with loger based fins.
Ive had the same experience and come to the same conclusion. I think many boards could surf better with a slight adjustment to placement of fins. I think in a production enviorment its very easy to have errors in placement.