Using the “garage floor cinder block” method—
It’s 20" just need to add a couple of small sticks to bring the width to 23 1/2"
It’s spot glued, The plan is to rough shape, take apart and then chamber.
Bill ---------------what are using to spot glue and at what intrevals? Lowel
Anywhere from three to seven spots depending on how much warp there was in the individual sticks. Used Elmer’s white glue.
Never did it this way before but I’m trying this method developed by Diff and perfected by Jim the Genius (although when Jimmy sees my cinder block method he’ll probably have a conniption).
Here’s one that Jim made for me:
It came out to 25 lbs. and it inspired me to try one myself.
Although I’ve done some chambereing before (pre chambering and rough shaping and cutting apart then adding stringers to get the width back) I’ve never tried Jimmy’s method before. But I was sitting around on Saturday afternoon with nothing to do and a few extra balsa sticks in the garage and the next thing I knew I was glueing this up.
…hello Balsa Bill,
you say “…pre chambering and rough shaping and cutting apart then adding stringers to get the width back”
and then talk about Jim method
but Im not perceive a difference
or are you talking about attention to details, etc?
thanks
What Bill’s talking about is no pre-chambering, just spot-glueing the thing together, doing most of the shaping, then popping it apart to do a very precise chamber job. I saw Jim Phillips do this almost 30 years ago, and God knows how long he’d already been doing it back then. He also used to do it on Clark blanks, and helped me to do a few in foam, but that’s another story. If Jim wants to talk about it he’ll get on here…
Hey Bill, maybe I’ll get by to see this one. Hope you have access to a drill-press to make the work easier, safer, and more precise.
So Mike and Bill. I assuming the other method would be to glue it all up. Draw a template/outline on it Resaw it at the interval that you want the stringers. Say a center stringer and two offsets. Chamber it out on a drill press. Re-glue with stringers, cut outline and shape. Right /wrong? Close? Lowel
…ohh, I understand
few months ago I asked J Phillips for some enlighten in that process…
like you know
the pre chambering is easier but to be safety the shaper should be precise and have a foil template similar to the finished shape
thanks
I’ve cut rough shaped blanks apart before and chambered them. It’s lot of work and I said I’d never do it again. This is the first time I’ve ever used Jimmy’s spot glue method. I’ve no idea if I used too much glue or not. If It won’t come apart and I have to cut it i’m ready to do that and I’ve got some stringers ready to go.
Bill and Mike -------I’ve heard thru the years of both methods. I never met Diff, but used to deliver blanks for another boardbuilder to Chanin’s shop when it was in Del Mar and heard stories. Diff’s Balsas around that time were a common topic of discussion amongst “peripherial surfer low life” like myself. Primarily because they were “chambered” and therefore comprable in weight to our still at that time volan glassed downrailers and eggs. I actually saw the “man” trying to get into a surf movie one night around that time. The guy at the door had no idea who he was and asked Diff if he worked at a surf shop?; To which Diff repied with a thin and sly moustached smile “Yeah”!
I’ve done 'em both ways, and they both have their merits, but the spot-glue and pop method is a lot easier to pull off if you don’t have access to a good cabinet shop or their tools.
hey Cahivet,
I remember in the past you mentioned trapezoidal chambers being the best way to get the weight down but still maintain strength. is that correct?
Im about to start a paulownia longboard with the above method and would like to get the weight down as much as possible.
could you elaborate on that technique?
This is how I do it.
Lee - I remember seeing some photos of Yater, or Diffenderfer using the bones left over from the clean plan shape cut out as clamp blocks after chambering.
I used the bones on the orginal tack-together. They wouldn’t work on the final go-round as I had changed the shape so much from the original cuts. They just slipped off.
If I had anything to do over; put your stringers in at the tack-up stage and shape it to a gnats eyelash before you bust it up for chambering…
Thanks for the tip Mike. The first one I chambered about 15 years ago I used a saber saw and a pocket knife. (It was some really soft light balsa). The guy is still riding it. I just saw him the other day. I repaired it for him once when he put his heel through the deck and into the chamber. I’d really like to buy the board back and burn it though. Not real pretty. But really light.
I don’t have a drill press but once, a few years ago I subbed out some chambering work to a (well known local) surfing trim carpenter who had one. Despite explicit instructions, he virtually ruined the blank.
I was hogging the rough blank out yesterday and who should stop by but Cecil Lear. Founder of the ESA and current president of the EC Surfing HOF www.eastcoastsurfinghalloffame.com
Bill ------I appreciate what you and Jim share on this site. The pictures and description of the process are food for thought. Wood may be the “old school” way, but I think you can see by the response that alot of people are very much interested in the process. I don’t know what Jim’s thoughts are on passing along “secrets” and I would not dare speak for him. Still there must be some pride in knowing these methods, trade secrets, the board building process etc. will continue long after we “old guys” are gone and the people doing it will be just as fired up about it as we’ve been Lowel
to keep the planks in alighnment you can use a couple short dowels in each plank (use dowel centers to get them to line up. or you can use # 10 biscuits. You can use glue blocks held in place with double stick tape so they dont slip off while clamping or just wrap inner tube strips around for clamping. the biscuits or dowels keep everything from sliding around when glueing.
What I never stop being amazed at is, after drawing the rocker on the stick and actually cutting it out is, the rocker can moved in about a gazillion directions all at once. I watched Pat Curren and Velzy slathering glue on all the pieces at once and trying to corral together and keep the sticks flush with each other.
I went to Homo Depot and bought the straightest 2x6’s, sawed the rocker into them and then jointed the flattest sides, these are my strongbacks and I use them to apply an even gluing pressure and keep from crushing the wood.
Also, I usually don’t try to glue more than 2 sticks at a time, this way I can keep the rockers that have gone astray in the saw out in check with each other, it takes me longer, but in the end, I don’t wind up with teeth marks in my ass.
As I glue the sticks progressively together, I keep drawing the outline, this way I can keep my spot glues about 4-6 inches away from the edge of the planshape, a glue spot too close to the edge and it will be very easy to snap off the end of the stick while breaking it apart.
I watched another wood blank builder get the glue spots too close to the deck and when it went on the machine, the crown of the deck cut away the spot glues and the blank fell apart while cutting.
There are so many things to keep track of when building a wood blank, I used to lay bowed wood curve touching center first, but the ends are under tension to pull away, now I spot glue those with the tips touching and add another spot or 2 near the center of the blank where there is more meat and less chance of breaking something.
I have had close to 50 percent of wood blanks come apart somewhere while doing the initial rough shape, most times it is snap that seam and re-glue, I had one on a rails banding it and put too much pressure in the center of the rail, close to half the blank snapped off, fell on the metal gusset of my shaping stand and meat cleaved the edge of the rail.
Nothing else to do but, get a mouth full of spit and force feed it to the offending gash in the rail, the next morning the wood had plumped back out, it had broken fibers, but was back to flush. When I finished banding the rails, nearly all of the gash was gone and what was still there looked like a natural marking of the wood.
I have a 10’11" Hanalei pintail gun, I am about to start breaking it apart, so I will take some shots of it leading up to the break apart, lay out and chambering.
Bill------------- I was wondering about your blank? Howzit progressing?
Jim -----Was also wondering about your Hanalei Gun? Making any progress? Would love to see a few pics. Lowel