Nice spoon! Just curious, how is it shaped? Shape the bottom with a regular blank, glass, scoop out the foam, glass? What kind of glass schedule is used? regards, Håvard
Nice spoon!>>> Just curious, how is it shaped? Shape the bottom with a regular blank, > glass, scoop out the foam, glass?>>> What kind of glass schedule is used? What you described is pretty much it. One of the many problems is keeping it stable while glassing the deck. A mold is an easier deal, but you have to make the mold, and then use high density pour foam in the rails. Whichever way you slice it, it’s a royal pain in the ass to do it right, with a moderate failure rate even if you’ve done it before. My glassing schedule: Whenever I run out of excuses, that’s when I glass. Seriously, it depends on the resin and type of cloth used. The spoon in the picture is off-the-shelf laminating polylester with 6 0z. flat weave volan cloth. The layer count ranges from 4 to 22, depending. The pictures indicate the thicker areas. With epoxy and graphite, the number of layers come down to get the same flex. The benefit of graphite is that you can bring the weight down, and also have a flexing structure that doesn’t fatigue over time. Graphite spoons are amazing. They last forever unless they break, and I think we’ve only broken one. And that was a construction error, not a material failure.
Nice spoon!>>> Just curious, how is it shaped? Shape the bottom with a regular blank, > glass, scoop out the foam, glass?>>> What kind of glass schedule is used?>>> regards,>>> Håvard Also, WALKER FOAM is preferable, if a conventional blank is used. Stronger. Better memory. Better bond with cloth and resin. More durability over the long haul under the stress of twisting and bending, and a more pronounced return after bending.
Havard, Your comments about snow boards and the direction of flexible surfboards is right in line with what Greenough concluded back in 1965. He had solid balsa spoons which were wide in the nose and tail…and completely rigid. He wanted to find a way he could keep the rail line flush and flowing with the water, and came up with his glass spoon concept to achieve it. Imagine a snow board or a pair of skis which were rigid, and imagine how bad they would work and feel. That’s what he was facing…in part because his boards were close to parallel. What’s important to remember is that his flexible spoon idea was a step in the evolution of an existing board, rather than a completely new flight of fancy. It seemed incredibly radical to anyone seeing it for the first time, but to him, it was just a logical next step. I think what you said about a wider tail is really important, and something we have to keep in mind as we start to alter existing templates with flex. The outline curves that have crept into board design since the 50’s are in part there to compensate for stiff materials. So, to make a nearly conventional board outline flexible may be redundant, because the curves we need are already there. With Rob’s project, I think we are trying to redefine the entire board at once, and that puts us in a much deeper design hole than George faced in the 60’s. Plus we have bouyancy issues, unlike kneeboards, skis or snow boards.
I think what you said about a wider tail is really important, and > something we have to keep in mind as we start to alter existing templates > with flex. The outline curves that have crept into board design since the > 50’s are in part there to compensate for stiff materials. So, to make a > nearly conventional board outline flexible may be redundant, because the > curves we need are already there. I think your right. Have a look at the very early snowboard, they were very rigid. All approched the same design, parallel edges, setback and a deep swallowtail. That’s the kind of shape that works for a rigid board (works better in powder IMHO). Once the flex and sidecut concepts was excepted a different template was developed and became the norm for all conditions. I’m not saying this template is any good for surfboards nor that the current surfboard templates are bad or wrong. It has arrived at the current designs through a long evolution. But when you change one of the components in the design, new worlds of possibilites open up. Flexible surfcrafts may need a long evolutions as well to develop templates that take advantage of the flex.>>> With Rob’s project, I think we are trying to redefine the entire board at > once, and that puts us in a much deeper design hole than George faced in > the 60’s. Plus we have bouyancy issues, unlike kneeboards, skis or snow > boards. The bouyancy is a real problem, especially since the flex is a function of the thickness of the material. I do believe that these problems can be overcome by using new materials. regards, Håvard
Havard,>>> Your comments about snow boards and the direction of flexible surfboards > is right in line with what Greenough concluded back in 1965. He had solid > balsa spoons which were wide in the nose and tail…and completely rigid. > He wanted to find a way he could keep the rail line flush and flowing with > the water, and came up with his glass spoon concept to achieve it. Imagine > a snow board or a pair of skis which were rigid, and imagine how bad they > would work and feel. That’s what he was facing…in part because his > boards were close to parallel.>>> What’s important to remember is that his flexible spoon idea was a step in > the evolution of an existing board, rather than a completely new flight of > fancy. It seemed incredibly radical to anyone seeing it for the first > time, but to him, it was just a logical next step.>>> I think what you said about a wider tail is really important, and > something we have to keep in mind as we start to alter existing templates > with flex. The outline curves that have crept into board design since the > 50’s are in part there to compensate for stiff materials. So, to make a > nearly conventional board outline flexible may be redundant, because the > curves we need are already there.>>> With Rob’s project, I think we are trying to redefine the entire board at > once, and that puts us in a much deeper design hole than George faced in > the 60’s. Plus we have bouyancy issues, unlike kneeboards, skis or snow > boards. – Ever since you were Associate Editor of Surfer Magazine back in the 1970`s, and began writing, the depth of your knowledge and sensitive insight have been an inspiring breath of fresh air. Thank you Paul… welcome to Swaylocks.
–>>> Ever since you were Associate Editor of Surfer Magazine back in the > 1970`s, and began writing, the depth of your knowledge and sensitive > insight have been an inspiring breath of fresh air. Thank you Paul… > welcome to Swaylocks. i agree.in fact i called Paul the other night to tell him how much more i have learned from him since he started posting here.i knew he had been holding out on us!
i agree.in fact i called Paul the other night to tell him how much more i > have learned from him since he started posting here.i knew he had been > holding out on us! Actually, I’ve been spewing this stuff to Matt on a daily basis for the past ten years. Why all of a sudden now he’s paying attention, I can’t imagine! If you want to see what Matt looks like, go to resource #456. Check out the tre-cool buzz cut. He looks like the gym teacher on Beavis and Butthead.
Ever since you were Associate Editor of Surfer Magazine back in the > 1970`s, and began writing, the depth of your knowledge and sensitive > insight have been an inspiring breath of fresh air. Thank you Paul… > welcome to Swaylocks. I was in Miami once, and Tony Montana told me, “First you work at Surfer Magazine, then you get the money, then you get the power, then you get the women, THEN you post in Swaylocks.”
Paul Gross has made most of my best boards,I dont sell to many .He puts more into one shape than most guys 3or4 boards.As for Matt its his surfers ear.I have clocked alot hours on his boards and want to thank him.He has put up with me for over 20 plus years.
I was in Miami once, and Tony Montana told me, “First you work at > Surfer Magazine, then you get the money, then you get the power, then you > get the women, THEN you post in Swaylocks.” heh-heh! heh-heh! duhhh, you said butt dude.heh-heh!
^He has put up with me for over 20 plus years. 28 years, 8 months, 3 weeks, 4 days, 22 hours and 9 minutes…