HWS Project

General Discussion
1

I’m going to start my next project now. I was going to build a chambered long board, but the lack of supply and the high price of balsa have put the kibosh on that idea. I’m now thinking HWS. I have been thinking about it a lot actually, and have come up with what I think is a new technique. I’ll provide the details on that later (I’m still working things out).

The APS/AKU software does not do what I need, so I have been creating my own templates using mathematical formulas, Excel, and Perl. Here is what I have designed so far…

Note: All measurements are in feet.

I tried limiting the shape to a second order polynomial (parabola), but it just didn’t look right. I don’t think that the name “fourth order polynomial rails” will catch on like “parabolic rails”. What do you think? :slight_smile:


2

Hi Swied,

Looks great so far.

Looking forward to the progress - if it’s half as good as your first thread, should be great!

-Cam

3

So you consort with ultra-terrorist elements of Al Jebra, eh?

4

I think a pencil and brown paper work as well, or better than computer generated templates…

Why make it rocket science…???..

KISS…

You asked…

5
Quote:

I think a pencil and brown paper work as well, or better than computer generated templates…

Why make it rocket science…???..

My goal is to make a design that requires a minimum amount of time to assemble. I’m working out all the math up front, and eventually I’ll have a Perl script that will automatically generate all the necessary templates. In the future, to create the templates for a new board, I’ll just enter a few measurements into the program and be ready to print.

I don’t want to go into too much detail yet, because my plans are still in a state of flux. I have seen a lot of people post their “new” ideas on this site, only to have someone point out that someone else did it that way back in '64. That may be the case with my idea. I’ll work on it over the next few days, and post everything before I start building.

BTW Paul: I have read up on a lot of your posts here on Swaylock’s regarding hollow surfboard construction. You’re work is what has inspired me to tackle this project. Also, seeing you and your boards the other week at the Sacred Craft event in San Diego was awesome.

6

Very exciting. Will this one be glassed?

–BCo

7
Quote:

Very exciting. Will this one be glassed?

That is a good question. As you know, I am partial to varnish. I think that I’ll have to make that decision at the end. If the finished board feels solid enough, then I might consider sticking with varnish. Either way, I’m going to skip the vent plug. I don’t plan on leaving it in a hot car. I would probably be more likely to forget to seal the plug, and it would get water logged.

8

I’m interested…I like what you have done in the past…I don’t design by computer but that’s OK…

Let’s say some wanker like me wants to make a wood board some time in the future. Would you be willing to run some stuff through your thickness planner for me? I’ll buy you a 12 pack of Coke or pick up some micro brew for you. Just thinking…a friend just gave me a disc with plans to make a HWS and I can’t shell out the money for a planner because my compressor just died…

Keep up the good work

Love our threads

Ray

9

There is a great forum with all the info you need on HWS building and design. Offered for free on the site is a plug-in for the AKU shaper program that converts a board design into a set of templates for the spine and ribs. I designed a HWS SUP board that I’m currently building, using the techniques detailed there.

http://www.grainsurf.com/forum/

Also, plans and kits are available from Grain Surfoards (no affiliation with the forum). Good guys, and great boards. I’ve ridden their longboards and they go!

http://www.grainsurfboards.com/

10

Ah, varnish. You are one crazy hombre. Keep up the good work. And the craziness.

–Ben

11

I’d be interested to see what you come up with, but as Paul said, keep it simple…

I use french curves on graph paper and then transpose the details to pieces of newspaper taped together to form a half template…

That worked well for me…

Good luck with your project…

12

Hi Scott,

Since I’m using APS for design work, I’m wondering what you think it doesn’t do. You gotta love the way it smoothes those lines. Then again Corel Draw does that too. hmm… I think I figured out what you’re missing with APS. Sections in the X & Z axis where ever you want them?

13
Quote:

I’d be interested to see what you come up with, but as Paul said, keep it simple…

Einstein Quote: “Everything should be made as simple as possible, but not simpler.”

To me, the computer allows my thoughts to become organized, and in a sense simplified. My design is actually quite simple. The profile has five measurement points, and so does the rocker. I’m fitting the curves around these points, which is kind of what a French curve does on paper.

I worked on the rail bands tonight. Here’s a graphical illustration.

731×235 19.2 KB

14

first of all

my deer paul

it it oblivious that this fellow has no chance

of opperating this rockette

holding it this way.

with a little practice as a jung man

he would know intuitivly

witch is the bussiness end,

as to the brown paper

sir von mc Tovarich

was seen to use newspaper.

the mastery[batery]

of the xputer is sacrocynct.

the pencil is not fast enough…

when and only when your

line generating is based on an emense

computer backround and pencil deprivation

or shaprie denied xistance.[sharpie works well with newspaper.]

the satisfaction of line generating

comparing keyboard to Pencil

starts with Having a pencil

or Having electricity as an option.

the cyber world is very comfortable

taking for granted there is a comfortaable

chair.

Standing with a pencil, squeege ,saw ,etc is tiresome.

the computa as a simplificating toole is the finest reason for saking

[sacking] the pencil of the neanderathals.

surfboards built from the sitting position

have a special mystique.

UP THE REVOLUTION

when you guys get back

I’ll be standing here

working on a couple new boards…

if I can just find that pencil

i put it down around here someplace…

I dint leave this room It has got to be here someplace…

…ambrose…

15

Hmmm, here is where depending on computer programming might hurt ya…a little. I’m guessing you are adjusting the coefficients in your fourth-order polynomial to obtain the rail band outlines. But at the square tail, this process blows up a bit. If you are building a square tail, then the rail bands should taper off at the tail to keep a flat cross section. What you have in the tail, as shown in your computer graphic, is a vee shaped end with a peak in the center. I’m not sure if this is your top or bottom contour, but a vee on top is a bit odd - I guess you could be building a scooped tail. If this is a bottom contour, then I guess a vee tail seems do-able.

Yes, please post your new HWS ideas when you have worked them out. This site is great for encouraging new and interesting ideas for surfboards…

16
Quote:

What you have in the tail, as shown in your computer graphic, is a vee shaped end with a peak in the center. I’m not sure if this is your top or bottom contour, but a vee on top is a bit odd - I guess you could be building a scooped tail. If this is a bottom contour, then I guess a vee tail seems do-able.

You a looking at the graph wrong. It isn’t a contour plot. Think of each colored line as a slice to be bent around the rails. The slices that I have drawn out are 1/2" think. I think I’m going to adjust this down to 1/4" slices. I think they will bend easier. Also, I’m going to be using nose and tail blocks. You can ignore all the funky convergence that is going on in the tail.

I’ll try to work on the next step tonight, after our baby goes to sleep. I think you will get a better idea of my purpose after my next post.

17

Uh-OK. Just keep in mind that your board is getting thinner at the nose and tail. Soooo, as you approach the nose or tail, you might not be able to get all the 1/2" or 1/4" rail slices that you sketched there on Excel.

Good luck.

18

If you went with 1/2" you might be able to bend it if you make yourself a wood steaming rig (PVC pipe reinforced so it doesn’t warp, hook it up to a tea kettle with a radiator hose). Never done it, but been reading about it…always dangerous.

–BCo

19

I didn’t get much time to work on the design tonight, but I did make some progress. The following image is a scale template that I generated from a Perl script that I wrote. The black image on top is the actual rocker profile. The red image below is the template of the outer rail before bending it around the outline of the board. If you look at the colorful graph that I posted yesterday, this corresponds with the red curve on that graph.

20

Hi swied,

What your doing there is awesome, i would love to know more about how it works and if it’s something anyone could use?

I think that your right, once it is all sorted it would make profiling a new template and rocker much easier and faster.

Good job dude!