Gotta agree with Bert here. He’s building a better product and has a one year waiting list and is not effected by the treat of imports. There will always be the poser influence in a sport so cool to be involved with. You get past the “cool quotent” as your involvment goes deeper through many years and you either become involved in the money or you go the way Bert has. So why haven’t more “soulful” custom builders gone the way of Bert? Because of a lacking in their passion for the sport and/or craft. Building a better product is about as soulful as it gets. To put the hours into the homework takes passion and love. Bottom line is, build better product, love what your doing, do some homework and become involved in raising the level of what we do. The lesson is simple here, raise the level and in the end the Chinese, Thai and Slovakian posers can go f#*K themselves because we will once again be leading the way.
Amen Brother Loehr. Preach! No argument from me on that one.
OK, one more thought. Most glass shops are making money and today basicly build crap. Therefore, if you make money building crap you become a slave to making crap. I’ve had more than one board builder say to me, “yea, but if we made them better we wouldn’t have all the repeat business.” Well in my veiw, continue making the same stuff you’ve been making for years and you won’t have long to worry about your repeat business. Look around, it’s going elsewhere as we speak.
Yeah, The state of the art glass jobs sure are not coming from Channel Islands, Rusty, Lost, or Surf RX. Thats for sure. The chinese glass jobs are every bit as good and the cost is less. I agree with you on raising the bar. Quality will and should make a difference. Unfortunately many of the big name shapers have given the crap credibility now. The kids that buy surfboards sure as hell don’t care or know the diff. if they did care. their parents are footing the bill for most of them anyway. Some of the older surfers should know better.
you have to market crap, quality sells itself…
regards
BERT
ps thanks greg…you gonna start a thread or post on another and give us the run down on your new boards with perimeter stringers???foam and so on ,ive been working on a new foam, looks ugly , but has promise as an inner foam core…
Yeah, The state of the art glass jobs sure are not coming from Channel Islands, Rusty, Lost, or Surf RX. Thats for sure.
I can’t speak about the others but I’ve never had a bad glass job from Channel Islands and I’ve usuallyl had at least one of Al’s boards in my quiver since about 1988 (thrusters, twinners, I even have an old quad floating around here somewhere). And the stuff coming out of Moonlight these days sure looks good to me. Of course I mainly look at the custom stuff so maybe the purely pro model boards are glassed more quickly/poorly? Hmm…
I know there are others but I put some of the glasswork coming out of Cooperfish factory and Joel Tudor’s at the top of the heap. Pricing is relative to quality. You simply can’t crank out flawless glass jobs with all the bells and whistles. Are Cooperfishes or Tudors worth it? Hell yes - try to come close and see how long it takes. How much per hour are you gonna make at 1,000 a pop? How close did you get?
OK, one more thought. Most glass shops are making money and today basicly build crap. Therefore, if you make money building crap you become a slave to making crap. I’ve had more than one board builder say to me, “yea, but if we made them better we wouldn’t have all the repeat business.” Well in my veiw, continue making the same stuff you’ve been making for years and you won’t have long to worry about your repeat business. Look around, it’s going elsewhere as we speak.
Ive heard SEVERAL people tell me those exact words. Ive talked to a few people from shapers to laminators about the benefits of epoxy over polyester they told me “why would we want boards that last longer?” and then they look at me like Im crazy.
ya know, im just a grom, but when you think about it, id say a good deal of money thats being made in the name of surfing isnt being made from boards, specially from the surfshops. Id say most of the money is made in the arena of accesories, clothing, and all the commodifications that the sport has produced. If you make a sweet board that stand the test of time, cool, make some money, but f&^k these companies thats try to sell board, jeans, shirts, shorts, keychains, bags, wax, sandals, sunglasses and all this crap that has little or no place being exploited in the name of Surfing. IMHO, that is of course. I support local shapers, I pursue supporting the things that make surfing better, not more complicated… and thats all i have to say…about that… stay stoked
If most surfboards today are ‘crap’ that may possibly be because that is exactly what they are made of…some of the most toxic crap known to the planet. The ancient Hawaiians made their boards of a living, breathing material. They paid homage to it and observed religious rituals in the making of a surfboard because they realized the significance of what was involved. Does anyone honestly think they would have done the same for some nitty, gritty, throwaway petroleum product responsible for fouling the Earth and it’s Oceans? I kinda doubt it! Get real here. Remember, ‘Plastic is spastic. Wood is good!’
This is an interesting thread.
I dont pretend to be a good surfer and am certainly not a good shaper but I have certainly paid for some poor glass jobs in the past. That is what lead me to start building my own boards, that and I just like building things.
Anyway, I agree with some of what everyone says. I would just like to point out, if noone else has noticed, that alot of the reason that there are so many popouts available right now is that there is a demand for them. there are alot of new surfers around right now. Some will fall in love with the sport and some will fall away.
Has anyone noticed how many more images of surfing there are in mainstream media recently. Surfing is shown in adds selling everything form cholesterol medicine to cars. The simple fact is that surfing is somehow in vogue right now in mainstream media. Trust me, it wont always be this way and the number of people coming to the sport will taper off after surfing is no longer the new and hot thing. Very few people are willing to paddle out in 50 degree water for 1-2ft slop. Surfers will always be willing to do that to feel the glide. Those that want to be perceived as surfers will fall away when the next cool thing comes along.
As far as the surf clothing industry is concerned, I dont begrudge them their money. They are only responding to the market. Right now the market is there so they are huge. IMHO they wont always have the luxury of being media darlings like they do now.
I’ll stop rambling and say, Do it because you love it and everything else will shake out in the end. Terry
how can u guys say that board shops dont mark up their boards alot. I know my local shop shapes thier own boards(family company) and they easily mark their boards up easily 200 dollars. Its not even like their struggling bc fact is that they have been there for the last 40 yrs. making custom boards.
You call $200.00 high mark up? If you were buying a carving the exact same size as a surfboard you would be paying $2000.00 Not $500.00. If a longboard size you might pay as much as $5000.00 for a wood carving. The same amount of work goes into building a surfboard, but greedy retailers have been hassling shapers (who for some reason take it) for years to lower their prices. Because anyone can go to clark foam or any other foam company and buy blanks and pretend to be a surfboard builder and charge much less than the guys who have paid their dues surfboards have stayed very low priced. Now you have these popouts which cost less to produce yet retailers are asking more, not less and shapers have handed them the support and credability. What a world what a world. At least the good shapers can now command higher prices, but it’s still not what they should get for a hand carved work of art.
Wood is Good? Is that like, “A small pod of California Log sliders?”
On surf clothing companies: They are simply benifiting from something now in vouge. They have created the ridiculous hype of the industry. These guys in their current form have been around 30 years. The modern snake oil salesmen. Go to a trade show sometime and tell me if it’s does not feel a like a bazarre in Bagdad.
I’m with you there, brother. The disposable foam board industry is a toxic scam.
Regarding the ‘hand carved work of art’ theory, I think that it only applies to foam boards which are built to last. How can anyone be expected to pay a lot for diposable hand crafted works of art?