Ok…First let me say this: MANY people have tried to talk me out of this already, but it just isntn’t gonna happen. I’ve shaped a few boards before, but if I could glass them I would be TOTALLY satisfied. No clear coat, I need TINT. SO…tonight I practiced on a couple “half” old boards that I stripped and re-sanded. Applying the lam coat with even color was no problem. Clean lap lines were no problem. BUT, and this is going to sound super “newbie-ish”, but after taping off the deck, cutting my laps to wrap around the deck, laminating the botom and laps, and cutting (with a razor) the excess lap/tape off, should I then tape off the bottom “rail lap” to be the same as the top and repeat the process or should I tape off the where the lap on the deck ends and try to butt up to that? It makes sense to do the former (so the bottom and deck would have the same layer of glass, and the rails would be darker because they’re “double lapped”)??? I currently own a BEAUTIFUL Cooperfish and am interested in going with that look…no clear coat or anything. thanks for any suggestions. The above scenario would be if there was one layer of cloth on each side…I understand that with more layers, the first deck layer would be butted up to the deck lap, and then so on and so on…Thanks again. Gene- Your boards RULE.
Tenover:
Your first thought is correct, tinted lam on bottom, cutlap to tape line. Clean up the cutlap and glass the deck with rail lap to tape line on bottom. Your overlapped rails will be darker. Depending on your choice of tint color you will run into various degrees of difficulty getting an even tint job. Yellow is one of the more forgiving colors, blues/greens and reds are more challenging. It’s a good idea to save a small cup of your final tinted resin before adding catalyst for touchups after your laminate and cut your laps. Have a rough plan before you start and measure twice and cut once.
You also want to run the tinted resin that you have mixed up through a filter. Also make sure you mix up enough resin to do both sides. Split it up before you add the MEKP, and cover the unused pot with Alum foil. Here is another trick that is used. Volan glass seems to pick up the tint better. Do your bottom first then the deck. After you are thought don’t bast the bottom lap, instead lay a 4 oz over the bottom making sure you push the glass down into the butted area of the lap you want to MAKE SURE YOU USE HOT COAT RESIN, no tint. Now hot coat the deck. When you sand don’t worry about cutting through the 4 oz. on the bottom infact you want to sand away almost all of the 4 oz. just don’t get into the Volan. Make sure you leave the 4 oz that covers the lap. This will make you board a lot stronger then basting, and you end up with a nice clean line.
Thanks for the help guys, much appreciated. Bagman- that sounds pretty complicated, but I’ll keep reading it over until I understand ;)…So let me ask you guys this: When I make RC gliders and have to cover wingtips and such, I need to make a ton of relief cuts in the covering (glass or otherwise) so that it won’t wrinkle or crease on the wrap, do you guys do that on board as well? I know to make the cuts at nose and tail, but say you were laying the first lam coat on the bottom of the board on a longboard with a really round nose…When you’re pulling the laps up underneath, say from a few feew behind the nose all the way to the tip, wouldn’t the glass “bunch” up around the bend and look like crapola? Not only would there be wrinkles (I would think), but in every wrinkle, the tint would be darker also because of the multiple layers in the wrinkle, no? Oh yeah, I would LOVE to cover the few boards I’m making in Volan, but I thought I read somewhere on here that you can’t get it any more…Any truth to that? I’m in San Diego, so I’d think that if it’s still available, I’d be able to pick it up somwhere local. Anyone know of anywhere?
If I might bumble into this…
Don’t worry about wrinkles too much, you can wrack/distort the cloth so it sits smoothly on the curve and bends, being as it’s kinda loosely woven. The relief cuts are at nose and the corners of the tail, generally, done so they lap over each other for continuity.
The bend, not being as abrupt as you’d get in a RC aircraft wing going from, say, top to bottom, isn’t so critical. Also, dunno if the weave you’re using in the very lightweight cloths isn’t a lot stiffer, being as they may use smaller yarns woven closer together or a different weave.
Volan-treated cloth is available in several weights from Fiberglass Supply ( http://www.fiberglasssupply.com/Product_Catalog/Reinforcements/reinforcements.html - see 'boat and tooling fabrics) via mail order and I’d really be surprised if it wasn’t available over the counter close to you, and I’m sure there’s some who will happily turn you on to those local sources.
hope that’s of use
doc…
So for this little 5’10" fish, how much resin should I mix TOTAL for the lam coat. I’d rather mix way too much and toss it later than not have enough. I’ll mix a bunch, get the desired color, the split it into three buckets (1 for bottom, 1 for deck, and a small one for emergencies). Should a gallon of resin be sufficient for the entire board? Too much? Too little? When I did my little area, I had a little problem trying to wet the laps as they hung down off the board…Seems like you have to have tons of resin to get them saturated before wrapping them onto the deck…Which leads me to another question (I have a ton of them):
When laminating from inside the rail out to the rail and down around the laps, when it’s drying/dry, I ended up with some “heavy” resin spots on the rail…Like right where it would drip off the board because of gravity, but was too gelled to do so. What do you do about that, wait until it’s completely dry and sand or cut the pooled resin off? This site is a godsend…Thanks.
Oh- and how fast should my lam coat kick? I must’ve not put enough catalyst in my test, because after drying overnight, it’s still “tacky” to the touch…
as nobody else has gotten to it yet, I’ll take a swing at it…
First, ideally you’d squeegee your lamination so that the weave is a definite texture , all the way around the rails. That way, you don’t have these sorta-solid spots you’re describing. That also gives you a fixed and consistent resin thickness which is how you get color consistency in a tinted lamination - otherwise you’ll get kinda blotchy light and dark spots where the resin thickness is uneven. Keep working 'em around with the resin from the main surface and generally you get it wetted out without going too wild with the resin. I start with a lot in the middle and push it along the cloth, working all the way out gradually and gently so it doesn’t start to froth up any.
A gallon should be more than plenty, with the caveat that experience lets you use resin more efficiently. Far better to have too much than to run short in mid-lamination. Guess how I learned that one… And, coward that I am, I’ll let one of the more experienced glassers tell you how much he’d use.
For those excessive spots - this is in the first lamination, that’ll get another one lapped over it, yes? If so, I’d set the board in the sun to harden the resin as much as it will harden ( see below) and then gently attack it with sandpaper, by hand, maybe 60 grit, and if your lamination even starts to think about loosening up, stop right then and there and live with it. Though that’d be what I’d do, again there’s others here that I’m sure have better ideas on the subject.
Now, lam resin doesn’t kick completely - the reason for that is that it doesn’t contain the surfacing agent ( styrene-based wax, I believe) that allows polyester resin to harden completely that you’ll find in hotcoating and glossing resin. That’s not a bad thing, as it allows the hotcoat to bond very well to the underlying lam resin and once it’s on there the lam resin does harden completely - in other words, don’t sweat it, it’s doing what it’s supposed to do.
hope that’s of use
doc…
Thanks Doc-
I really appreciate your help and advice. After laminating the bottom of the board, how long should I wait to laminate the deck? 24 hours? I cut my lap/tape with a razor last night after about 30 minutes, and while they came out clean, I probably shouldv’e waited longer, as I could see the glass trying to lift up very slightly while cutting…
Well, I’ve been outbid for the second time on Ebay for “Glassing 101”…Does anyone have a copy they’d be willing to loan me for a week, or even sell to me? Thanks.
tenover, damn man I just ordered a batch but they are all aready bought up,
www.surfsource.net sells em the same price I do, they just stock more…
You can borrow my copy. I’m in San Diego, so it shouldn’t be too hard. Where do you surf?
Hey there Tenover.
Good luck on your 5’10 fish. I just finished mine and have never had so much fun in less than epic waves. Re the amount of lam resin i mixed about 1.5 liters for the total job (6oz x double 6oz). 2 liters would be more than enough, leaving you with plenty for later touch ups. I’m a metric man, so I’ll leave it up to you to convert into gallons/oz.
Happy glssing and fishing.
Maz
Keith-
Thanks. I surf Sunset Cliffs, La Jolla, and sometimes Del Mar…If you’re willing to lend me your copy for a week, I’ll drive wherever I need to to pick it up…Let me know. Shoot me an email at tenover@hotmail.com and I’ll get details from you.
I live near Sunset Cliffs and you’re welcome to cruise on by and borrow it for a couple of weeks or whatever. I may be glassing a board tomorrow; I’ll shoot you an email later.