I finally finished my two test longboards. The one with the horizontal stringer came in a little over 9.5 pounds and the one with out the springer came in a little under 9.5 pounds. I’ve made them as close to identical as I could (take into account these are boards #5 and #6) with the only major differences being that one has a horizontal stringer and 5/8" rails and the other has no stringer and 3/4" rails. I could have made the rails exactly the same width but I’ve decided that springers are neither good nor bad so instead I decided to test putting all of the strength at the rails or weakening the rails and letting the middle of the board influence the ride. I made these changes after something Berts said that got me thinking. Now I can’t say for absolute certain whether horizontal stringers are good or bad, but the tradeoff is I am hoping to end up with 2 great boards (only in different ways). As always I’ve added to my list of 1000 ways to not build a board (my wife joked that these boards did not want to be built), but I am by far and away the happiest I’ve ever been with the way they turned out (I might even be able to stop making up lame excuses not to show them to people). I’ve glassed them with 2oz-1/16"balsa-2oz on the bottom and 2oz-1/16"balsa-4oz(Scloth) on the deck. I skipped the hotcoat, but instead put a thin cheater coat over the rails. Next time I will put the cheater coat over the whole board. It doesn’t use much resin and makes a much clear coat. For the clear coat a went with the single pac U-Pol. It doesn’t have the isocyanides and is a little less unhealthy. Its the same stuff that comes in the #1 upol cans but it sooooo much less expensive and goes on soooo much better.
let me know when you want a co-tester so you can get both boards out in the water at the same time. I’d love to surf your creations, checkout your boards and talk compsands. Unfortunately I have not been making progress on my projects.
Really, really, really nice work Dan, and a good experiment to boot. No better way to answer a question than to do the grunt work and build both sides of the argument. Dimensions? Was that 1# or less dense foam?
The 4WFS should be nice on there; let you figure out exactly where you wanna have your fins going forward. Good call.
I’m just working on #5 right now myself and I’m sure it has been an easier process than your undertakings here…that’s alot of wood and alot of pre-prep. Anxious to hear the test results. The question now is; are you a good enough surfer to distinguish between the two, and if not, COULD a really good surfer distinguish them I’d imagine you’re going to need to see some juice to really determine any differences…
What did you use as a vent?
Cheers; you’re gonna have some fun days in the water.
The question now is; are you a good enough surfer to distinguish between the two, and if not, COULD a really good surfer distinguish them
This is exactly the thing that I’ve been thinking. I know excellent surfers can tell the differences that fine tuning produces, but I didn’t think I could tell a difference. Until my last board I completely discounted my ability to tell anything about a board. I just thought that i was a really bad nose rider, but suddenly I was nose riding half the wave. My ability to surf instantly improved and not much else changed except the board. However, I will be fine with not being able to tell the difference.
4est,
Actually, I was kind of hoping to get people to surf both and see if they could tell a difference. I want to surf them a bit to be sure that they don’t fall apart (or sink!), but I would be glad to let you surf them.
The question now is; are you a good enough surfer to distinguish between the two, and if not, COULD a really good surfer distinguish them
This is exactly the thing that I’ve been thinking. I know excellent surfers can tell the differences that fine tuning produces, but I didn’t think I could tell a difference. Until my last board I completely discounted my ability to tell anything about a board. I just thought that i was a really bad nose rider, but suddenly I was nose riding half the wave. My ability to surf instantly improved and not much else changed except the board. However, I will be fine with not being able to tell the difference.
4est,
Actually, I was kind of hoping to get people to surf both and see if they could tell a difference. I want to surf them a bit to be sure that they don’t fall apart (or sink!), but I would be glad to let you surf them.
hay Dan…did Oneula tell me you were heading up my way for spring break? I really hope you’re bringing both of those…and we can do a test with the 3rd being my 10’1 with 1/16" balsa and a square tail…
I have some bamboo for ya, fresh from Hawai’i…
They look dynamite. Bert noses & tails & everything. Can’t wait to ride 'em.
five one oh three seven six seven three six three…
I’m stoked to hear the bamboo made it up there. I’ve got a couple ideas how to use it. I was going to pm you but I’m planning to be up in Walnut Creek April 14-17. I hope you’re free! (I’ll call)
Thanks! I’m really happy with the pattern for the deck. I ended up with it because my strips were just a little too narrow so I had to fill some space in the middle. Instead of one thin strip I used all my scrap from the bottom of the board. I put the fin boxes in by surrounding the box with fiberglass then capping the whole thing. I’m not very happy with the way the capping turned out. Even though I cleaned and sanded the whole surface area the glass has been wanting to peal back. I think its just too much surface area. So far I’ve tried futures, fins unlimited, and glass-on. I think I’ll give locbox or fcs a try next time.
Good use of short strips on the herringbone pattern. Also - thanks for explaining the vacuum testing results on the prefab skins with and without the plastic sheet.
I’d say some great info in your posts for anybody considering vacuum process.
Really nice work on both boards Dan! Please keep us posted on horizontal stringer results and what your take is on final ride characteristics.
Thanks John! I actually got to take my boards out for a surf today! All the way down to the beach I was writing my review before I had even surfed them - that I wasn’t good enough to tell the difference. This couldn’t have been further from the truth. Both boards surfed completely differently from each other and both were a lot better than my previous boards. The waves today were only 1-2 feet and very low power. I took the board with the stringer out first. It was love at first paddle. I caught waves much easier than my previous boards, it felt very solid in the water, and lightning fast across the wave. The board turned very smoothly and I felt in complete control. Next I took out the stringerless board and before I even took my first paddle I could tell the difference. As I pushed the board over the waves I could see the nose of the boards move back and forth from the wave hitting the bottom of the board. When I paddled it felt slower (even though it was lighter I would have sworn that it was heavier) and when I arranged myself on the board I could feel the board almost flop. I thought that it was over and the contest was already won. I caught my first wave and I was a little off balance and the board cranked a bottom turn and shot to the lip faster than I could imagine. I thought it was a fluk but the next wave it did even better. I could crank out super sharp turns regardless of having ideal position on the board. The board was transformed - as I paddled out it was a pig and after I was on the wave it was a star.
I think that it is going to take many surfs until I get these boards dialed in. The board with the stringer seems to require more precise foot placement and has a smoother ride while the stringerless board is more forgiving of foot placement, needs much less wave power, and works more for a power/slash style. I am very interested to see how the boards go in bigger, more powerful surf. At this time all I can say for certain is that there really is a significant difference between the boards.
Those look really nice! Enjoyed reading your review of them too.
When I read your first post I found myself thinking “too bad you didn’t do two identical boards, one with a psringer and one without”. That’s just the science training kickinh in, I guess. I’d still take either off your hands in a heartbeat.
Really looking forward to hearing about what else you find with these two over time.
How does the stringerless board noseride? It seems like all my mistakes in that area tend to be due to poor foot placement on the board and If the stringerless is more forgiving in that area I wonder…
Also, if it gets a bit wobbly when you are up front, maybe putting a stringer in the first third of the board would help?
“too bad you didn’t do two identical boards, one with a psringer and one without”
I was talking to my wife about this. If I had made the stringerless one with the 5/8" I’m to sure that it would be able to stand up to the force while if I made the stringered one with thicker rails it would have been too stiff.
U-huh. Like I said, it was the scientist in me talking. I made sure I noted that, didn’t I??
On the less flexy one you could always have gone back and “refinished” by putting more glass on the rails.
Maybe a bigger contribution to “the scientific surf physics community”. Maybe not. We’ll never know until someone does it. And yeah, you may be operating within the same constraints (money) as I am.
Still really eager to hear about everything you find!
To get really scientific, wouldn’t it be interesting for someone else to follow Dan’s exact layup plans, same shape, balsa pattern, glass, etc. and see if the board comes out the same way under a different shaper’s hands. To find out if performance results are duplicable. Or perhaps someone else could make an in-between board with the rails + springer and compare how it goes. … I don’t have space to shape a longboard so don’t look at me
