Pistol grip for camerahousing

Uhmmm - still thinking about this, because it's interesting. And therefore fun......

Using it with the pistol grip all the time, yes, it makes a lot more sense to make it one-piece. Though some fabrication problems might be a little more difficult (drilling holes for the pushrod assembly comes to mind) , maybe doing your forming and laminations in stages....or laminating around a tube for the pushrod, let us say...would simplify it again.

If you made your trigger with two return springs, one shorter than the other, that might give you the 'button feel' nicely. Pulling the trigger would initially just press against the longer spring and engage the autofocus only. Once that had gone to a certain point, you'd start pushing against the second spring (which, pushing against both springs, would require more effort)  and in that range you would be triggering the shutter. If you were able to use that with something like this gizmo ( http://shop.usa.canon.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_10051_10051_171307_-1 ) set in the 'main body' I think you'd have it.

Uhmmm... would you be using the 'continuous'/3 shot burst mode for this?

doc...

Glad to have you on this case Doc!

Yes I think I'll have my camera in continous shooting mode most of the time. There are some things to consider about the trigger setup. First off, those remote trigger gizmos are not well made, even the canon original ones. They offer poor feeling as to when the shutter is released. Rigging  it up with a pushrod/lever with springs would work but the feeling of snapping the shutter would be lost. I know that in most peoples opinion I'm going way overkill on this but I believe the feel you get from your equipment has great effect on the overall performance and result. It's the same as with a well shaped and tuned surfboard you know. Saw a guy who had build his own housing with a canon remote on the outside of the housing. He had just put some glue around the hole where the wire whent out from the housing and then he had wrapped up the remote inside a condom. Even saw some guy online who wrapped his whole camera in a condom. He had ordered special ones without lube but he had troubbles because those without lube where powdered instead and he got unsharp pictures HAHAH!

I'm only using the wire and the plug wich connects into the camera and replacing the actual button mechanism with electric switches. Something like what I posted earlier only not those cheepo switches that I used in the picture just as an example. There's something called microgap sensors wich I think will be perf. Rigging up two of those so that the lever/pushrod thingy first hits the one and then the second. Havent quite figured out how to build in the "triggerfeeling" in there. Doubble springs would work but I'm trying to figure out something that will have a more or less fluent springback feel with a distinct stop half way where you need to apply some more preassure to make it click and release the shutter. I have been disecting ballpoint pens (the ballograf kind). They have mechanic similar to what I have in mind. Needs to be small to, to fit inside the handle.

Hey Bramburg,

I used a water housing for a Bell & Howell 16mm wind up movie camera in the late 70’s. The housing was similar to the ewa marine housings. But this one had a heavy rubber glove on one side. The front part had a big ground glass port that the camera would fit into and then the seal was built around that. There was an option to add some weights to get neutral buoyancy.

I think Yuri Farrant may have used this housing back in the day. He was friends with the guy I rented it from. 

Just thought about it. I don’t know if that is something you could work into your design.

Hey, Bramberg -

Yeah, I thought continuous mode would be a good way to go for something like this, as it's at arm's length and all. Shutter priority at a fast shutter speed too, I'd think, as there's no way you could hold it as steady as you would with a normal grip on the camera.

Uhmmm- you have me thinking that while it would be nice to replicate the 'feel' of the shutter button, maybe what's needed is something that would be positive and definite, especially as you might be wearing gloves often? And let me give you an odd idea: what about a rocker trigger? That is, something that would pivot, pull one side and you have autofocus, pull the other side and you have shutter. Or, possibly, a separate button for autofocus that could be operated by your thumb?

anyhow, a couple of ideas to perhaps think about

doc....

Wow that's awesome. Not many people go in the water with 16mm anymore. It's a shame really. But there are some film cameras, like the RED wich deliver really top quality. Not that same feel as real film though.

It hink i get the idea aboout the glove and i have tried something similar. It was a sort of bag you but the camera in and them put your hand in a glove wich held around the camera handle inside the housing/bag.

Sounds like you were around in the old days aswell. Check out the link.

http://www.divingmachines.com/camhousing.html

Continous is the way to go. There's really no reason not to. Continous shooting and camera set to AV/aperture priority. ISO value suitable for the lighting of the day. That's what I usually do. Most times I use ISO 200 or 400.

 

As for the trigger, positive and definite is what would work! The problem is just how to make this. A rockered type of mechanism could definately be a good solution, and it's a great idea. I've joined at the surf photographers united site. Thanks for that great tip by the way. Haven't had time to read up on their forum but I would be surprised if this is not one of their most posted topics since controls are the most difficult thing to make for a waterhousing. And yes, I use gloves. Three fingered 5mm all year round except a few sunny days in summer.

Oh yeah- it's not like you're paying to have that extra film developed with continuous mode, or having to go into the beach to put in a new roll when you burn through one. And yes, if you have enough light, aperture priority would work fine rather than shutter priority. Heh- I still have my Nikonos II, so I envy you.

I imagine the water never warms up a lot there, no more than 10 degrees most of the time. So something that could be used with thick gloves is a must. The three finger gloves really must make life ....interesting. I might consider painting the grip with some sort of rubber coating, for a better grip. And that makes controls with 'strong' feedback neccessary.

Controls - gah. Having seen some of the high end diving digital camera housings, with enough controls on the cast-aluminum body that you start to think of a pomegranate or something, the trick is keeping it a simple as possible. I don't know about you, but after getting a relatively good point-and shoot ( Fujifilm S-5100, the European version is the S-5500 ) I concluded that leaving it to the camera is the way to go, rather than trying to be a better photographer than the computer inside the thing. So more controls than the shutter/autofocus really are not that useful.

 

 

Nah, I still use some film though. I love slides and also B&W. I use film for special occasions only though since it takes alot of work to do anything with the pictures that way. Reading on the surf photographers united, i have come to the conclusion that dome ports are not the best way to go if you dont need because of extreme wideangles (under 18mm) or fisheyes. Most of the time I will be using a 17-40 zoom and tape the zoom ring at 17-20mm for close up shooting. Will also use 50mm and 85mm alot. A really big domeport can be useful in situations when you wanna shoot split images (half under and half over the surface). I haven't abandoned trying to blow domes out of plexiglass. I'm actually quite anxious to try it just for the cause of great experimenting. But for starters, and that's where I'm still at, is figuring the trigger out.

Underwtarhousings made for diving gizmonic of the worst kind. I want some controls and might build in a few more than just the trigger. Maybe one control for the shutterspeed and one for the aperture dial so that I can shoot in full Manual mode. But I'm trying to keep it as simple as possible, to keep weight down and risk of faliure/leaks.

I paid around 2000$ U.S for my camera and it doessen't have any photographer inside. I have to do all the hard work myself. That's not fair.

I don't really remember how it feels to surf without the three fingered 5mm gloves. It's cold here. But I guess it's something you gotta get used to. I actually like them as long as there are no holes in them. Hands are almost dry, they are not like waterballoons, and you get a good grip paddeling with those. Almost like those webbed gloves. This time of year it's 2 degres. Summertime can get around 10-15 but then it's flat like a pancake for three moths. I did a stunt and paddled out at the regular spot in just short's and a rash and caught a wave just for the triumph. That felt i assure you! Other than that, last time without 6mm wetsuit was two months in Indo 2004. Getting a wierd feeling thinking about that now..

Were you ever able to figure this prolblem out? I am attempting to build a housing for my Canon 40D.

 

Cheers.

Hi Rhino.

 

Yes i did sort out all the technical stuff on how to built it except for the part where I wanted to build in a distinct click-feeling into the trigger. A good way of doing a pistol grip trigger would be to strip the wires from a remote control, hook it up to a suitable switch and built that into the handle. Another way would be to built the entire remote into the handle and use a watertight pushbutton to trigger it inside the handle. APM hexseal has many different good models. I didn't built the pistol grip for this housing because it takes so much time to do all this stuff and I get the shots I want without the pistol grip. I did blow the acryllic dome myself though. It took two weks of experimenting before I got it right with temperatures, preassure technique and cooling. The shots come out amazingly sharp! I have two different ports for this housing, dome for fisheye and flat for shooting with lenses over 18mm like the 50mm 1.4.


That does sound like a lot of work. I wonder how to make a remote shutter release waterproof…

 

My plan is to use 6" PVC, use a CNC to cut a plexiglass endcap, then cut a piece to fit flush on the back end with a 1" rim & route a groove for the O ring, then rout a 7" plexiglass circle (again with a groove) and fasten with plastic wing nuts.

 

Do you know if any plexiglass will work, or is there a certian type I can use to minimize fog. I work in a plastic shop, so hopefully I can order a sample from someone.

 

Cheers.

I’m a long time lurker here on Sway’s and never posted anything, but being a pro surf photog i could have something to add on this thread. I’ve used housings from the most of the manufacturers, commercial or full on backyard custom guys and i have bit of a feeling what works and what doesn’t. 

I like how you’ve progressed with your design from the crude red housing to the last post with a housing w/ dome port. I’ve never built a housing with any controls in it, only housings for remote flashes, but i’ve built few poles to work with Aquatech and SPL housings, which are basically just an extended pistol and same tricks do it for both of them. 

I used cable release just like you have here, but only to get the right plug to attach it to camera. I’m also on Nikon so i can’t help you with right cables, but you figure it out with a bit of a testing. Basically i cut the cable release from a desired length, then peeled all the different cables inside. Not sure how many Canon has, but Nikon’s release has 10 different cords in there. With Nikon you need to find 3 correct ones; earth(trigger), a lightmeter and an af. You don’t need them all just ones which will do these tricks for you. As a switch i’ve used a doorbell, yes, one of those black and white basic ones which trigger as long as you push them. Plug the remote cord in the camera and start to go through the cables one by one and you’ll find your right combo rather fast, shouldn’t be hard at all. You need to make sure that you get them right so lightmeter/af won’t stay on forever after activated, otherwise you’ll burn your battery fast. Even pro housing makers can get this wrong. Or, maybe just copy how the cables have been attached in remote’s trigger, like i said i’m not familiar with Canon’s wiring. 

Shape a pistol from a piece of foam which is suitable for your choice of resin. To be on a safe side, cut it in half and add something like balsa for a stringer ( that’s how a legendary housingmaker Dale Kobetich does it), so you don’t add up too much weight. Some foams can be squeezed in a hand to get a bit of a shape in the pistol, but simple shape won’t hurt your fingers as much when 10’ slab lands on your hand and housing gets ripped off from your deathgrip. Also, think about the final thickness of the pistol because 5mm gloves can feel tricky if pistol is perfect for a bare hand. I just did a trip a month ago to Scotland and i know how different it can feel, with or without gloves. Shape a hole for the doorbell at the desired height and feed the cable out from the top. Glass around it first without stressing out how you’ll attach it to a housing, that part can be done afterwards. Cover the doorbell button (empty filmcanister or similar works fine here) during the glassing just like covering a finbox so when pistol has cured you can remove canister and you have a round hole where doorbell button switch sits nice and tidy. To make switch waterproof i’ve used a rubber trigger from a disposable waterproof camera, it’s only a matter of fitting everything so when pushed, it reaches a doorbell switch. You probably need to fill the gap between the two with something like a tailpad material or similar to make sure that trigger does it every time. If that disposable camera trigger feels too tiny for 5mm gloves, look for something bigger made of rubber with a similar shape. I’ve seen a car rubbermat which would have been a perfect to cut out a trigger cover. Or search for a hardware store selling any marine products, like a kill switch for an engine, those rubber bubbles can make a perfect trigger. 

Story became a bit too long, but i hope it makes any sense. This is really easy thing to pull off and i’m sure you figure it out. Or, if youre willing to drop some cash into it and make sure that thing will work the bite a bullet and just buy a pistol from SPL. 

To cut down the possible leaks, make your pistol dedicated and glass it straight to the housing. Traveling is a bit more painful but that’s why they invented Pelican Cases. Same goes with any other controls, less is more and nobody needs all the bells and whistles in water, to be able to control the exposure is kinda mandatory and back focus button is something to die for. Disable AF from manual trigger in camera’s custom menu so AF will work only from back focus and not from cable release/pistol, this way you’ll be able to shoot above and u/w because focusing is different and you don’t want your fisheye autofocus when someone’s flying down the line deep in a pit. Preview will only help you to get caught inside when you scroll through your images and don’t pay attention how next one is already smoking above your head.

And about fogging, that’s when camera gets too hot and has nothing to do with the choice of the port material. If air temperature is way above water’s then housing can fog when in water but that usually goes away after a while. Housing needs to be closed in dry enviroment and not under a/c or in a jungle in G-Land. A tampon or two placed inside will suck all the moisture, they also can save the camera when minor leak happens so water won’t end up in a wrong place.

Thanks for the info. I’m not sure about the pistol grip, but I am
considering a remote trigger VS an Ikelite shutter release lever.

heres what i have so far…

from left to right:

Port (1/4" rabbit to sit inside 8":pvc)

8" x 7 " pvc

camera tray

routed insert

gasket

backside port

I will glue them up with epoxy, then tap the 1/2" thick insert for plastic bolts or wing nuts. I think 6-8 will work.