Power tool choice

For a rotating sander type tool, there are “orbiting sanders” and “angle grinders/sanders” …the only time ive used an angle grinder was to chop a bit of frame off of an old motorcycle of mine and do other heavy duty weld type grinding…that seems a bit over powered for surfboards to me…

so the question is first off…is there much of a difference between the two, and what is the more commonly used type of sander?

You’ll want lower speeds than an angle grinder. More like a sander/polisher with a 7 to 9 inch disk.

Brands vary as do prices:

low end is China, variable speed usually less than $50

high end is German, variable speed, vacuum upwards of $700

middle of the road is Milwaukee, DeWalt, Makita, PorterCable, etc. Expect around $200.

What’s your budget?

and,

How much work do you plan to do (for the next year or so)?

Do you guys use the high speed orbital sanders? I use a Ryobi 1/4 sheet palm sander for wood working and would not be without it. They are only about $50. With 50 grit paper you can make some serious sawdust, and with 150 grit a fine finish. And with the speed, your work does not float off the horses, even if it is not clamped, like it would with old orbital sanders. Just curious since shaping surfboards is a lot different than working with wood.

Lorin

We’ve tried orbitals and random disc orbitals but for production and super-accuracy we haven’t found anything better than the spinning disc. We are very careful about which discs to use. Our sander is one of the best in the business and he can sand a board to perfection in about 25 minutes. That’s down to 320 grit and with a special burnish we do…

Trouble is,

starting out sanding with the aggressive disc sander is like learning to drive in a forumula race car. Some s!*t is gonna get wrecked. This was especially true for those of us who sanded in the “pre-variable speed” days (more like variable finger). I see it as quite possible to learn accuracy and precision with a variable disc sander; just keep it on low. To produce perfectly level work will require high speeds, upwards of 5,000 rpm however…

sanding is my least favorite part of the board building process,i always seem to sand to much,its comes out a bit uneven ,if i gloss coat it magnifys my mistakes!Im using a milwuakee,any back to basic advice or tips?

Thanks,

joe

Howzit haubush, A lot of builders don’t like to sand but it’s 1 of the most important steps. Personally I feel impowered when I sand. The more you do it the easier it gets and the easier it gets the more you’ll like it. Aloha,Kokua

I couldn’t live without my trusty electric 1/3 sheet sander and my belt sander, they are a real pleasure to use and like Kokua, I love sanding, it gives me the greatest satisfaction running my fingers along the board knowing its smooth as a babies bum.

It really depends on how you use your tools, I can use the flat section, the edges, the nose and the tail of both machines to accomplish what I need.

Laminating gives me the least amount of pleasure, even with epoxy…

what sort of grit sequence do you follow when sanding?

Probably get hauled over the coals for this by the experts out there but…

I generally start with 60 to get any major lumps out then go down to 180 for the rest, I only use epoxy so I try to finish with a nice gloss coat so I dont have to sand any more.

If I can’t feel anything with my fingers the job is done, the epoxy gloss will fill and level flat…

Hicksy!!! c’mon man! 60?!!! Last week we rode a board across the parking lot, doing run-and-jumps; that’s about 60 grit. (okay, consider yourself raked now;)

Our lams are super clean and so are the hotcoats. Many visitors comment how they look surfable as-hotcoated. We start with 150 and use 6 papers in three subsequent grits. We then burnish with a half-sheet vibrating sander using a special scouring pad.

Our Sander has 1 angle grinder (11,000 rpm) to knock down hardware, 1 variable sander (6,000 rpm), 2 variable sander/polishers (2300 rpm) and a half-sheet shaker all on the table. The cord management is pretty impressive.

As I said before discs are super important.

im not really shopping persay, i just wanted to know what people perfer in general because ive heard of people using all kinds of different ones…and i kinda thought that a grinder would be a bit much for a surfboard…thanks for the replies! great info!

Quote:

Hicksy!!! c’mon man! 60?!!! Last week we rode a board across the parking lot, doing run-and-jumps; that’s about 60 grit. (okay, consider yourself raked now;)

Well, it’s not that bad in an orbital or even a random orbit, but… Me, I use a lot of 80 in the variable speed Milwaukee, for sanding away munched stuff in dings and grinding away paint on boat work.

Quote:

We start with 150 and use 6 papers in three subsequent grits. We then burnish with a half-sheet vibrating sander using a special scouring pad.

You have me curious about that- are we talking about something like the 3M pads? Buddy of mine uses that stuff on a 10,000 RPM grinder and one of those neat little 1" belt pneumatic sanders for prettying up stainless welds. Works slick.

I’ll bet such a setup on a half-sheet sander would be the cookies for all kinds of jobs…

Quote:

Our Sander has 1 angle grinder (11,000 rpm) to knock down hardware, 1 variable sander (6,000 rpm), 2 variable sander/polishers (2300 rpm) and a half-sheet shaker all on the table. The cord management is pretty impressive.

As I said before discs are super important.

Yeah, I can just imagine. How you keep from reinventing macrame with all those cords- that would be pretty tricky.

Quote:

Trouble is,

starting out sanding with the aggressive disc sander is like learning to drive in a forumula race car. Some s!*t is gonna get wrecked. This was especially true for those of us who sanded in the “pre-variable speed” days (more like variable finger). I see it as quite possible to learn accuracy and precision with a variable disc sander; just keep it on low. To produce perfectly level work will require high speeds, upwards of 5,000 rpm however…

I’ve said it before- sanders are the Rodney Dangerfields of the business. They don’t get no respect. But a good one can make a board beautiful, a bad one can ruin it in a heartbeat.

I mean, you’re talking about a tool designed originally for grinding welds on steel plate. It’s a heavy mutha. And even with soft backing pads and finer paper, you can eat through a lamination with just a moment’s inattention.

Back in the day, blipping the trigger to keep the revs low, while keeping your disc surface tangent to the curve of the surface you’re sanding, with a tool that weighs ten pounds and up, and doing it all day? Ohhh yeah, that was OODLES of fun. I had even more fun, 'cos I was doing boat hulls, vertical surfaces or upside down. 'Course, The Old Man had his eye on me, and anytime the sound was wrong , not the steady sound of doing the surface but that wee ‘nnch’ sound it made when I caught an edge - I caught hell.

For someone starting out with a real full-on disc sander, I strongly advise lots of practice. On pieces of scrap softwood to start with, to get the feel of it, then graduate to plywood. Work on sanding away one layer, one ply of it, down to the glue and no more, smoothly without gouges or crescent-moon bites here and there, and when you can do that you have it.

As kokua says, when you can master a tool like that, make it do fine work beyond what the maker’s envisioned when they designed the thing - that’s a pretty good feeling.

doc…

i’ve used only two methods: 1) by hand 2) rotating disc sander. By hand takes lots a elbow grease…about 3 hours for a shortie…with the power tool i usually get really bad wheel marks (im very confident in the workshop but using a disc sander has always been a major challenge). so i learned a few tricks: use the right pad, use 150 grit or higher, vary the speed to very slow and keep the pad flat on the board…big difference. Im not doing production so it takes a little longer but so what…no wheel marks is a major accomplishment.

If you want a really good upper body workout that uses the same muscles while paddling, sand by hand for a few hours…you’ll be sore for a couple of days but be fitter when surfing…no lie

If not, Home Depot sells a hitachi variable speed sander for $100…that variable speed feature is awesome…i lower the speed to slow keep the pad flat and no wheel marks…

That is pretty much it Doc. They make Red, Green and Gray (coarse to fine). We start with the coarse and after a sealant is applied we finish with the fine pad by hand… …directional burnishing.

Personally, I preffer angular ones. For beginners, I recommend the polishing types, up to 9.800 rpm. Now, if have more confidence or is trying to masters in sanding, you could try a Makita sander with 5000 rpm and that has a high/low speed control. Let you know that, the average time a good sander spends to sand a hotcoated (short)board is 30 min. Good Luck!!

Haubush,

Kokua said it right. Once the mystique of sanding is understood it actually becomes one of the most satisfying parts of the crafting experience. The hogging, grinding, cutting, and mowing is over and the methodical sequence path of coarse to fine grits brings the finished product to life. Sanding is the time when you can relax and really get to know the subtleties of the finished piece, and mentally plan your finish process.

It took me quite a few years back in the 70s to finally get the fact that it’s not about getting the surface smoother as you go. The smoothness thing is a by-product of simply progressing from one grit to the next with each successive grit taking out the “scratches” of the preceding grit until finally there are no more scratches (and of course it’s also smooth by then). The finer grits you use, the harder it is to see the scratch marks. If getting it perfect matters to you, use hand-held side lighting and look at it from different directions. One of THE most important things to know is that the more gloss finish you get the more the scratches and sand marks will show. Gloss magnifies flaws!! Often, you’ll think they’re gone only to apply your finish gloss and, “oops” there are those sand marks.

I very recently spent days applying a hand-rubbed high-gloss finish to four panels of beautiful quilted maple only to finally begin to recognize in cross lighting there were scratch marks. I had to start all over with 100 grit right through the finish. You never get too old to fall asleep at the wheel. If you fast forward and skip grits to finer it will only take that much longer to sand out the previous coarse grits. This seems to be advice that few actually listen to (myself included) and only experience corrects.

I’ve found aluminum oxide paper is usually the best choice from 60,80,120,180,through 220 and 320 grits, then silicon carbide for 600 + and for sanding the actual finish. Lots depends on your work, how far you want to go, and how much it matters to you.

Choose your weapons and choose your attitude. Bottom line on sanding: Enjoy the ride!

Richard

Put into these words, it appears that sanding belongs to a budism monk universe. I think it’s a more practicing related job. It begins with resin mix balance, pass through a right brush choice, an adequate place to do the dirt work (racks, lightining, and other stuff). Along my life as a board builder, I met several pros in sanding. There are lots of possibilities according to the personal choices of tools and materials, but all of them had something in common: They try never ruin the shaper’s work. I think it’s the path to the perfection.

…Amen…

Howzit haubush, I start with 80 grit to take down the laps then it’s 100 grit, 220grit, 320 grit then a scrubber to blend the sanding marks for a clean finish.Aloha,Kokua

…Kokua, in which way you “hold” a scrubber in the sander?