usually when i mow the crust off a board and take it down to thickness and adjust the rocker as needed, i have some grooves left over from the planer cuts... usually i just take these down with a surform to level out the bottom of the board before i begin adding contours and rails. ive often contemplated using a grinder for this step because it would save time and in my mind it might even be more precise. i know all the stuff about how fast it takes off foam and how careful i have to be, ive heard this from tons of guys before. but i think it could reduce the variation i have from board to board if i learn how to use it correctly and could also save me alot of time.
for anybody with experience on this:
what kind of power pad? soft? medium? hard? something besides a power pad? soft pad would be my first bet, but i just wanna be sure
what grit? i tend to use around 120-200 on poly. so i assume this would be the same?
"Reducing the variation'' is going to come from using a tool that takes off a measurable amount of foam in each pass, in my experience. That tool is your planer. The super-soft pads are great for an almost final clean up, but you don't want to be removing lots of foam with them because they are not very precise. After you get a really good touch with the machines (sand a few thousand hc, or dings, etc.) it gets easier. At first you can destroy a blank with a slip of the wrist. Hell, even the pros catch one and fling it off the rack sometimes.....
I've seen some people use discs to cut rail bands, and other nonsense, but IMO that's not good technique. The hard disc on the deckside nose is an exception.
You can make your own squishy pad by glueing 1.5''-2'' of upholstery foam onto an old powerpad, then glue a piece of 60-80 grit onto that. It'll last for thousands of boards if you only use it only on foam, and use a very slow and/or speed-control machine.
Hey SCBoy, I usually use the surform and a 50 grit hand sanding pad to even things up on my blanks. A grinder on foam can get away from you easily but it can be and is done all the time by some guys. Depends on how comfortable you are with the tools. I gotta agree with M. D. and use the planer more. I can’t imagine using a grinder to turn rails but there are those people that are experts with one. Charlie Walker on Oahu is a artist with one but he’s a pros pro and has been doing it for YEARS. I’ve never seen better. If you choose this route, Harbor Freight has a cheapie speed control for tools. This will be invaluable in use and prove to come in handy with lots of other tools. When that one breaks go to : woodworker.com and get a good one. They sell for 50-60 bucks. Try the cheapie first to see if it is useful. Good Luck Bud.
thanks to everybody for the tips. if you get where im coming from, sometimes i have lines after mowing the crust, and when i take them away with the surform i just end up getting a bottom thats not flat and i have to spend alot of time evening it out. i guess i should be using my 25" sanding block more often and just stroking it down the bottom to really tune it in. its just tedious. better spend time than flip a blank off the racks by accidentally losing the grinder.
i think im going to try playing with the grinder on one of those seven dollar eps sheets from home depot. if i like it i will use it on my normal blanks. if not, back to the old fashioned way
Started using a sander/polisher about four years ago when Clark quit. The influx of Aussie blanks put me in a situation wherein I had to slow the planer down and therefore my production was also slowed considerably. All that hand sanding on those hard Aussie foams was wearin' me out. I don't like the super soft pad because the edge can roll under and catch your blank and gouge it. I use a medium and use it primarilry on the flats at a very slow RPM. I use the sander in place of what I used to do with the Surform. On Surfblanks, Bennets etc. I try not to use a Surform at all. US Blanks though harder than the old Clarks are in my opinion pretty much the same. Whenever I shape a US Blank I fall back on the old technique I used on Clarks. You can muck up a blank with a Surform easier than you can with any other tool. I agree with the above comments about perfecting your planer skills. Get to the point where you can clean up your planer marks, ridges etc. with the PLANER. Then you'll be able to go straight to your sanding block with little or no Surform. As Mike stated the sander is great for taking down and thinning out the nose on rockered blanks, shortboards etc. For that application I do switch to a soft 5" pad. It conforms better to the rocker. Be careful, go slow; but it's doable. Lowel PS--Alot of guys use them but don't want to fess up to it.
Congratulations, you've figured out that the surform doesn't really yield a true surface. The planer trails are normal but can be minimized with experience and better control of baseplate/shoe pressure. In the meantime, block out the trails instead of using the surform. Start trying to use the squishy pad to clean up block scratches if you want, but be read to re-block the first few times until you get the hang of it.
EPS will melt if you use a fast machine or hard disc/pad. Maybe try the grinder or sander on a raw PU blank, somewhere outside the outline, before you cut the template.
By the way: I watched Wayne Rich clean up his planer trails like a master at Sacred Craft. Unbelievable. Straight to the sanding block and then screen. I didn't watch his whole process. but I have heard he uses a sander on occasion as well.
yeah i have been using 120 sand paper on my 25" block and i havent been changing the paper enough. i think if i take it down to 50 grit and change the paper more diligently i will notice a difference in how fast i can take the trails away. i love that block.
lowel are you good with your skil 100? it amazes me to see guys like martin hardly even leave trails with it and yet it is by far and away the biggest and heavest planer i have ever felt. man those guys are good...
On a PU blank I block everything with 40 0r 60 to start. Makes pretty quick work of any trails. I'm no Terry Martin but his level of skill comes with lots of practice. I have more trouble with cleanup when I use my Hitachi. The Skil isn't heavy if the blank is supporting it.
I like my Hitachi, I find it easier to use than a Skil. I prefer the shorter sole plate it seems I have better control. I know a lot of guys when they skin their blank they go full depth. I used to do that and found it easier to go half way with a few more passes. I’m not piece working so the extra time is okay. It makes it quicker in the long run to getting a smooth deck/bottom. In my earlier post, I was talking about mostly pu blanks so the surform works fairly well.
Two factors that will affect what the planer leaves behind are (1) blade sharpness and alignment/adjustment (2) vacuum system. You would be surprised at the number of planers I see where the blades are cocked at one side and/or not both at the same depth. On sharpening, some guys go no more than 10 shapes between sharpening. What keeps many from maintaining the blade sharpness is aligning them. They’re either too lazy (20 mins) or they don’t know how. The vacuum will keep you from going over piles of foam dust which change your cut depth and angle on the flats. The Skil may seem heavy, but you have to remember that your not moving it with your arms, just holding it as you walk. Your racks must be adjusted correctly to your specific height/arm length. Hope this is of some use.
usually when i mow the crust off a board and take it down to thickness and adjust the rocker as needed, i have some grooves left over from the planer cuts... usually i just take these down with a surform to level out the bottom of the board before i begin adding contours and rails. ive often contemplated using a grinder for this step because it would save time and in my mind it might even be more precise. i know all the stuff about how fast it takes off foam and how careful i have to be, ive heard this from tons of guys before. but i think it could reduce the variation i have from board to board if i learn how to use it correctly and could also save me alot of time.
for anybody with experience on this:
what kind of power pad? soft? medium? hard? something besides a power pad? soft pad would be my first bet, but i just wanna be sure
what grit? i tend to use around 120-200 on poly. so i assume this would be the same?
anybody have tips or thoughts?
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I've done it with a Random Orbital Sander. Worked good for getting the crust off, though there were small dips n stuff. For a backyard hack like me, wasn't a big deal. I only did it once though, even though it kills my shoulder, a piece of 3" x 2" with paper glued to it works pretty good.