Alright this board has been a nightmare from the get go!! Taped the rails. Blew off deck with airhose. Took a lightly dampened paper towel with acetone and lightly, lightly wiped deck of board down. Wiped second time with dry paper towel. Mixed a batch of finishing resin (1 Qt) and added 30cc catalyst. 64 degree room. Used same resin brush always have used. Did the belly the day before with gloss and turned out beautifully perfect. SO==== Brush everything on like usual and 10min into the drying almost all the pinlines are running out over the rail!!!!!!!! WTF!!!! This has never happened before! Now I have to resand it down and do all my decorative and intricate pin lines in resin all over. Any info would be outstanding!!! Also I have alot drying problems with this gloss resin. 30cc is alot of catalyst? It still takes about 40min or more to set off enough to pull the tape? Thnx Confused
How much and how thick is the pigment you are using? The deeper the tone the slower it will go off. On a pinline 30cc for a QUART isn't alot. A quart sounds like alot of resin for a simple pinline. In fact it sounds like a waste of resin. I could do at least a dozen boards with that amount of resin. Twenty or thirty cc's for a Dixie cup full would be more like it.
Sounds like too much hardener if you only used a small dixie cup. Do you know what kind of resin you have? A lot of suppliers repackage resin so you never know. I like Reichold…it has a brownish to purple color. SIlmar tends to be clear with avery light tan tint. It takes a long time to dry. I have had trouble with silmar when doing resin pins. Also putting the pin on to thin will keep the wax from rising and it will bleed. My pins usually gel within ten minutes. Hope that helps.
I think you guys are missing neptunes post
looks like he was shooting a gloss coat and his posca pen pinlines washed out
I have had this happen and heres what Neptune did wrong
1 64 deg is too cold for shooting a good gloss on the deck, the bottoms flat so it came out ok and cat % no matter how high just aint gonna kick it fast enough
2 Neptune probly had to do some extra brushing of the gloss to stop the slabing of the resin due to cold temp and that , along with the slow kick time desolved the pinlines, could maybe have pulled it off with resin pinlines
3 if your gonna flirt with the devil ,,, he will win every time
I did this twice before I wized up
I read it as he did “intricate” resin pinlines. Assuming I was correct… another problem may be with the pigment itself. Some of the pigment that comes in squeeze tubes is low grade and watery. It can bleed. I have done resin pins a lot of different ways but I always go back to my old tried and true formula which was taught to me by the glossers from the 1950’s and 60’s. Note…“glosser” is a generic term. Glossers of yore did the color work and the clear coats.
Some of these guys are virtually unknown and I think it’s time to give them some recognition .Sam Cody and Billy Brummett come to mind but there were more. I may start a new string about this.
OK, I read the info you guys give and this is what I think happend. First--- I used sanding resin for the pin lines that I put on a few days earlier. They came out perfect. I lightly sanded them to get the wax and shinies out. However I think even though I could sand them I used to much pigment and they werent completely hardened. Second---- Before I gloss coated the deck I wiped everything down with a damp acetone paper towel--ie-- gelled up the pinlines!! Third--- When I put the gloss coat on, the resin was pooling and sagging all over the rails because of slow drying time. So I kept brushing it out to clean it up and this with the gelled pin lines contributed to the pins running?.
With all these things and the room being 64 degrees, it sounds like the problem!!! Sound right? I used 30cc in one 1qt of gloss resin and it took 1.5 hours to set off. Does that sound right even in a 64 degree garage?
Also the pigments are the same ones I have used the last 6 or so years and have never had a problem. They come in a little glass bottle. I got a lime green recently from Foam EZ and its the same manufacture as my present stock. R
xxx.
get a small brush and run a precoat of clear over the pinline before glossing. use sanding resin. kick fast at about 5 to 6 percent. this way gives a bit extra prevent any chance of burning through gloss into pin and also you running the brush down the pinline instead of across as with glossing. especially helpful when using acrylics for pinlines. a careful coat lengthwize along the pin will prevent any potential bleeding.
if you using loads of pigment, curetime can be problem . using a few drops of cobalt dryers will help it kick. if you got it right you can peel the tape in a few minutes. you can peel the tape before it cures maybe just at gell time and any bleed if they arise with a razor blade
do your resin pinlines with gloss resin instead… skip the acetone wipe… and a quart of gloss resin is Way Too Much.
My apologies,, it did say resin pin lines
but
the temp issue was definetly a contributor
I have had a gloss take over an hour with 2% + cat and low temp just to gell up
I didn’t see where the pins were Posca, but wiping them with actetone would erase them, I never wipe down with any thing but my hands, am very leery about blowing off sanded boards with the compressor, it only takes one drop of oil.
Rule of thumb, one strainer full of resin per side, it’s all you need, if the pins were resin, add alittle bit of wax solution and a couple of drop of cobalt, this will help compensate for the addition of pigment, some pigments totally kill the catylization, while others will promote the gel time.
On my Billabong board, I boosted the living crap out of the amount of pigment in the gloss resin, todays reds are so weak that you have to go heavy for coverage, I added coablt and a shit pile of catalyst and it was off to the races, I got to the finish line first !
Oh yeah, I have blown a gazillion boards with bleeding pins lines, you can tape off from the line up and sand only from there to the middle of the rail, it takes a lot of work, but you got that in store for you no matter what you choose.
If you’ve done pins and have doubts about them, sand them and tape away about a 64th" on each side, shoot a hot clear coat over them and that seals them up, there isn’t enough room for the resin to flow and bleed
Thanks for all the advise. This is the first time this has happened so I was a little bit confused. I do resin pin lines exclusively becuase I like the look. This is 13th board and my first problem. I know I have to cut down on the amount of gloss, I just had a bad experience with not enough lam resin on one board and it screwed my glass job up big time.
I sanded down the whole deck this evening and will retape the pin lines. I will try the cheater coat and see how that works. I guess Im real hesitant because I did double pin lines on the belly last week the exact same way and the gloss turned out excellent. Thanks again for all the help. I will post pics when Im done. R
Howzit Jim, When I did resin pinlines I used a process I was taught that Mr. Clean (R.B.) is familar with and I am sure you are too. That is to tape off the pinlines and the rails for the gloss, then do the resin pinlines and about 20 minutes after they have kicked, shoot the gloss job. It is one of the real tricks of the trade and there probably aren't 10 glossers who know how to do them that way in this day and age.Aloha,Kokua
When Roger and I would go down to Inter-Island, their glosser, Chris Green, had boards taped around the rail for the clear coat, and length wise tapes for panels of color. We watched in amazement as he shot the panels, whipped off the tapes like they were bull whips, went over to the drum of gloss and pumped out his clear coat.
As soon as the wax had risen enough to scar, he catalyzed and shot on the top coat right over the now curing color.
But, it takes a good sand job and good tape to have the color edges not fuzz out, you have to be sure of yourself and burn the color on, if it sits too long, that’s where the trouble starts
Howzit Jim, Yep it's all in the timing and I don't like to sand pinlines. Aloha,Kokua
The thickness of the resin on the tape plays a big role too, too thin and the wax won’t rise, too thick and the lines haves the tendency to creep and fuzz out, it all comes with years of experience and that God awful realization that you’re gonna get bit on the ass when you peel up the tape
Howzit Jim, Yes I agree about that and it would probably be a little harder to pull off thee days since the pigments are not the same as when we were doing them in the 60's and early 70's. I think the reason I got into doing them was that Gary Thernagle taught me and I always made sure I was really paying attention when working with him. These days I like using India ink for pins. Aloha,Kokua