What’s the deal? At fiberglass Supply, the info was saying SB112 epoxy is specificly designed for the surf/windsurf industry. (i.e. clear,uv,resistant, etc.) Here’s my plan for a personal board: use an extruded blank, first coat/glass with SB112, remaining layers Solarez laminating resin & gloss. Any of you try it? Did it delaminate between the epoxy and laminating resin? Can you mix polyurethane resin and SB112? Just thinking out loud. Any thoughts Greg? Thanks you guys!
The problem you may have is the polyester leaking through the epoxy seal coat and melting the foam. Also the blush that you will undoubtedly encounter will have an effect on how well the polyester bonds to the epoxy. It’s no big deal to laminate with epoxy, especially with Additive F and RR fast hardener. No harder than poly. So why laminate with an inferior resin at all? As far as SB 112, it is a reasonably quality product. It has more vapor (toxicity) and is only has one hardener speed, which is rather slow. They also don’t produce an Additive F type material. It was actually quite good back when it was formulated, but things have advanced past it.
…I agree with Greg…I’ve had problems trying to hot coat with poly over epoxy…It will work, but the epoxy lam MUST be cured, or else you’re looking at the pol leakage as Greg described…To be safe, stick with an all epoxy glass job… I’ve used both SB112 and Greg’s Epoxy… They seem IDENTICAL other than the price…SB112 was about $125 for 1.5 gal…Greg was about $85 for 1.5 gal…My ONLY hesitation to get Greg’s is the timeliness of the shipping…I’m in the PNW and have had to wait MUCH too long for resin deliveries…I think that might be resolved with Greg’s move further west…I’ll continue to buy Greg’s resin, but I will ask for a confirmed delivery date… http://www.hollowsurfboards.com
Sorry to interrupt the flow here. I have seen a lot of different boards and building techniques and I must say that your boards are some of the most impressive I’ve seen Paul. I have a question. Since you have all the tooling, and have figured things out, would it be possible and you willing to create a kit for one of those boards. For myself, building one of those would be as much of a rush as riding but all the early figuring, templating, and tools would discourage me; I can imagine how much went into “dialing in” your techniques. Again, very impressive.
We are open in Arizona and shipping to the west coast is no longer what it was. We usually get orders out within 24 hours and shipping rates are much better and deliveries are no longer than three days.
…I have full size templates for a 7’4 and a 10’4, soon I’ll have a sub-6’ Lis Fish template set… I could put together a materials list, and possibly assemble a whole board kit, minus the resin and glass… If your serious e-mail might work something out… Paul http://www.hollowsurfboards.com
Greg, I bet you wish you had a nickel for every time the poly over epoxy topic came up. Someone once told me that epoxies off-gas or expell chemicals as they cure, and that’s what forces off the poly. I haven’t read anything to verify that. I’ve read about nonyl phenol additives, and how sometimes they can be excessive. But do they become part of the epoxy, or are they expelled? Nothing in Swaylock’s archives about nonyl phenol. I’ve also read that epoxy resin shrinks 2 percent during cure and poly shrinks 8 percent. So is that part of the poly over epoxy problem? Trying to shrink your poly by 8 percent onto a relatively unyielding epoxy lam coat? The only time I’ve mixed the materials was when I epoxied a fin on a board, and then glassed around it with poly resin. I could see some of the excess epoxy when I was done. It was silvery like an air bubble or separation.
I think Greg Loehr should chime in on this but from everything that I have read epoxy is superior in every category that matters.
Does speed count? If so, UV cure takes the cake.
Epoxy is today used in every high performance composite application ACCEPT surfboards. There is a simple reason why. Given the right epoxy formulation, epoxies are better across the board in the finished product. It’s sometimes difficult to listen to all the excuses the surfboard industry has when we produce a resin that is stronger, lighter, clearer, has better UV stability better elongation and less shrinkage than any polyester resin made. It isn’t any harder or more expensive to use and has 1/50th the vapor of surfboard polyesters. This makes it infinatly nicer to use for workers and environmentally it has NO VOC’s. Soap and water clean up eliminates acetone and toxic waste. It is vastly better when using advanced composite fabrics were it saturates the fiber bundles more effectively and more completely than polyesters. It also has vastly better adhiesive properties, allowing for lower resin ratios in the laminates giving better strength to weight ratios. Finally it can be used with and foam and , because it is solvent free, it eliminates solvent seepage into the blank and trapped solvents in the blank. Sorry if this sounds like spam… well… you asked.
Epoxy is the best thing to happen to surfboards since the fin…Grow some balls get rid of that polyester crap and set your self free…Epoxy can be use on all kinds of foam,so don’t say you don’t like the foam. ET