To add to Jame’s experience with Dale’s mat. 2nd mat session yesterday Conditions; 2-3 ft. clean but weak windswell beachbreak. Quite a few boardsurfers out pretty much wasting their time TRYING to ride anything. Looked dismal. I almost wrote it off but the weather was nice and the water was clear and inviting. So I paddle out to the line-up( 4 longboarders, 2 boogies) and catch a 2 foot mushburger outside expecting disappointment. Before I know it I am angling acrossed a clean little waveface right through the line-up going faster than I thought possible given the conditions, all the way into the close-out at the beach. I was kinda stunned. Never had a sensation like that before waveriding. As some other folks have described it,“like riding on a bubble” very cool. I actually was doing cutbacks and floaters cause of the speed I had. A couple a longboarders asked about the mat and what it rode like, So they noticed!!! Alot of fun.
Back again. Trying to sell myself on matts again. Okay I’ve asked quite a few questions and have some more. Just trying to be thourough, 1) as there is no organized FAQ anywhere 2)Nowhere where I can go to see people ride these,Orange County,CA. 3)I doubt there exists any mpeg’s that would effectivly display the riding characterisics and strengths of these. Although before beginning this thread I had searched Swaylocks prety good but probably not every post or thread. So here goes some more questions: Its been said, that the Matts are ideally suited to longish point break waves ,uncrowded conditions. Which sounds eerily familar to George Greenoughs statements about his Flexible Kneeboards —Velo. Which required uncrowded point conditions to: 1) exploit its speed instead of turning around surfers. 2) was hard to jockey around on for catching waves. 3) couldnt handle or exploit smallish beachbreak most effectively. However, I am located next to mostly non-hollow mushy beachbreak that doesn’t jack up a little on the outside, subside then break. No, its just weak coming in, finally jacks where its going to break, then does its mushy thing. Is there any advantages with the matt in these conditions? Can I strictly assume that where a longboarder can take off in these or any conditions, that I can strictly do the same(following some technique) , or is there some size threshold associated with this ability?? Additionally, could a matt effectively ride a Pipeline or Wedge wave Authoritatively as a hard board or bodyboard or is that just a pipe dream??
HI Hal the inflatable dreams website has an faq I live in orange county and i ride everyday i will useally head out for black ball at the pier occasionally will dawn patrol and double session a day here is a quicktime mov you can see a taste of todays session at salt creek this my 11th session was not quite as good as yesterday at pier but still fairly fun on my very first wave i got my very first tube on a mat it did really well in the tube http://www.rotvideo.com/video/mattcreek.mov the take offs in video are fairly late but i can take off pretty early as well if you are ONLY riding a strictly dumping shorebreak wave maybe a boogie would be the ideal choice I would say from what i have experienced so far you can take off as far out as a longboard remeber only 11 session so limited experience baseing this on i would say useing similar tactics that a very very good bodyboarder could in some cases take off as far out as a longboard i can also tell you that a mat can take off earlier then a boogie take that for what its worth I havent ridden wedge yet but i would say yes a mat could ride pipe or wedge but youd want to be really good before you tryed
Blackball and MAtSurfing; Dont some California Counties and the Lifeguard Service have problems with inflatables out in the surfline??? If so, do you chat up the lifeguard first?
Cool video, James!
Hal, While mats are ideally suited to longer, faster waves, theyre really impressive in less than perfect conditions, i.e. sloppy, flatter, ledgy, twisted walls... in fact, they usually go faster over chop! Your comparison between George Greenoughs kneeboard “Velo” and surfmats is a misunderstanding of their individual functions. George has actually spent many years mat surfing in flatter, B-grade waves. Hes told me numerous times that the main reason for this is simply... less surfers! His choice of surf mats has also been the means to experience many similar sensations, speed and control over a wide range of waves, that his flexible hull kneeboards were only able to provide under specific conditions. Competantly handled, modern surfmats are surprisingly effective in longer, mediocre surf. I dont recommend using a mat in short, suddenly heaving beachbreaks. Its not that they dont work in those kind of waves, but to best appreciate their full potential, you need an adequate runway. I also dont advise using a mat in crowded conditions for the same reason. So if youre limited to short waves, youre better off bodysurfing, using a paipo or a bodyboard. Ive ridden my surf mats in many kinds and sizes of waves, including those which are extremely quick and hollow, unloading into very shallow water. Used in a competant manner, they have the potential for an early entry (sometimes on unbroken swells), as well as excellent control once inside the tube. Dale http://neumaticsurfcraft.homestead.com/NeumaticSurfcraftwebsite.html
matts at the pipeline and wedge? duude your making me feel old. i seen tons of mattress whompers at both those spots. long long ago in a land far far away. the zoo’s the same but the animals have changed. would you believe there was a time when boogies where nonexistant? its not a queestion of can you surf there. its why would you want to? watching george g. streak an empty green one at pipe will change your whole perspective on shit. air matts running the '03 slalom course doesnt interest me in the slightest. got to have a runway if you want to fly.
why waste mats at places like Wedge or Pipe? their tracks flashed across those blunt faces 30 plus years ago. pre-boogie. pre-rodeo. pre-circus. the wise one observes and asks, “why would you want to?” exactly, grasshopper. those who ride “whompers” only demonstrate their gross ignorance of the humble craft`s true potential. nirvana lies in the opposite direction: “got to have a runway if you want to fly”.
FWIW - during a recent session, I was able to easily cruise over kelp and shallow rocks where surfers were either catching their fin(s) or kicking out. I have a hunch that many spots that are definitely not surfable on a board are easily ridden with a mat.
are you serious? are you really that wishy washy? come on now. i must admit i questioned the return on my initial nuematic mat investment…then i bought a “champion surfmat”…after a session it blew up (at least the seams did)…so i plopped down the 300 bucks…a few weeks later i plopped down another 300 (i was afraid i would never be able to get dale to make me another and 1 was not enough). i have 4 now, plus a 4th gear flyer that i may get around to using one day. dale’s mats are superb. have you ever heard such testimonials? i really enjoyed the thread…not because people were trying to sell you, but because i got to hear more stories. stories i have lived. i ride a variety of boards. all are fun. if i could only have one it would prob be a neu. ride em in anything. they can be repaired. you will never have them 100% wired. travel anywhere with them. and you will prob make at least one friend for life. i hope you were sincere with your questions…the answers obviously were. fella…get yerself a mat. give it a chance. write back in a few months and let us know what you thought. tell ya what…if you are not completely satisfied write to me (i am here often) i will buy it off you. there ya go…you are getting a money back guarantee…FROM A CUSTOMER! good luck hal.
that’s fucked up. I don’t say “duude”. please don’t do that.
Money Back Guarantee, thats sweet. I am 6’6" and 310lbs. which is kind of why I want to move into mats. I’m getting a little too big for anything but longboards. I dont know if you’ll be able to relate to my matt if I dont like it. I figure Dale will have to make it bigger or something. Is this gurantee worth more than the e-paper its written on?
give the mat sufficient time to get used to – just a few sessions will not work – the bigger mat would be fun – plus maybe one day i will grow and put on some weight –
sal - where do you surf? what are the specs of your longboard? any bodysurfing or bodyboarding experience? comfortable wearing swim fins?
Actually I’m not 6’6" and 310lbs, and I will not be taking up Tim Campbells’s generous money back offer. I am 6ft and of normal weight. --Sorry for the tongue in cheek post. Still havent come to terms whether I’m going for the mat or not, --I dont rush decisions, and that has always served me well. However, as this sport is still in its infancy( embrionic stage actually), I am still in the information gathering and mulling over mode. However, I am a current kneeboarder from North Orange County. Certainly familar with fins, and aware of Greenoughs progression. Just trying to sort out whats right for me.
Hal, Tim Campbells offer was serious, as was previous one from Peter Waitkun of Maine... also a kneeboarder. The type of mat surfing that weve been discussing isnt in its infancy or embrionic… actually it predates the shortboard revolution, modern longboards, kneeboards and bodyboards. Prior to 1982, I had long abandoned the use of commercially available rubber and canvas mats for my own custom designs… more supple, durable, lighter synthetics, with the average weight dropping from 7-8 pounds, down to 5 pounds. Each incremental improvement brought gains in handling, speed and sensitivity. While the basis of modern performance-oriented mat surfing had already been in progress for a number of years, the real breakthrough came in 1982 with the advent of ultralight (about 16 ounces) nylon & polyurethane materials, rapidly opening up the next chapter in mat surfing design and performance. http://neumaticsurfcraft.homestead.com/NeumaticSurfcraftwebsite.html
Greenough and friends were throwing down rail turns like this on mats pre-1967. Alby Falzon was one of the witnesses at Lennox Heads. Kinda looks like a long track from Georges famous kneeboard Velo dont it? Amazing what bags of air can do. “he took to the surf on a canvas air mattress, which he could somehow make go faster than anyone on a surfboard. His surfing became the stuff of legend.” www.surfline.com http://groups.msn.com/InflateAbleDreamSpeed/shoebox.msnw?action=ShowPhoto&PhotoID=18
To a PNW designer/craftsman who deserves it-- On page 214, of the new BIG Surfer Magazines "Design Forum- Home Improvement, Designing the Ultimate Surfers Garage", respected esoteric waterman adventurer, TSJ author and photographer Jeff Chamberlain writes: “… we need room for the eclectic, the well-rounded: the Greenough-inspired Neumatic surf mat…” Hmmmmmmm… Neumatic surf mat??? What doya suppose he meant by that comment, Hal Sose?? Maybe ya should try contacting Jeff Chamberlain!