In the last few months I’ve glassed three boards, all with tints top and bottom and all cut laps.
With all of them I’ve had tape dramas with the tape starting to lift and fall off before the job’s done.
I’ve now got about 10 different brands of tape. Tape from shaping supplies, tape from paint sprayers, blue tape, 7 day tape, 3 day tape… you name it. Same problem with all.
Yesterday I spent more than an hour trying to get the tape to stay down. Retaped 3 times with different amounts of tension to get the curves, overlapping tapes etc. etc. and in the end it still fell off before the job was done resulting in a right mess! It’s driving me crazy!
The problem only occurs when taping off a lap onto a previously lammed surface. Taping on to foam seems ok. It can’t be the tape that’s at fault. Maybe the weather? I’m in England at the moment and it’s a bit cold. With heaters I manage to get about 17c but it’s still a bit damp - then again, I don’t here others from wet climes complaining about tape problems…
I hear you man! Same problem here, the first couple of boardsI glassed went OK, but then exactly the same thing, almost as soon as the wet resin touches the tape…off it peels. I too tried loads of different tape types with no changes, seems that the resin was melting the adhesive in the tape. I resorted to doing free laps in the end out of necessity as the whole lot of tape fell off on one occasion and as I’d already put the resin on couldn’t re-tape. I don’t like the free lap method and if you come up with a solution keep us informed. I think you may have something with the temperature/damp idea, the first 2 boards I did were in summer…and the other 2 it was proper cold. I take it you’re using poly? Epoxy might be better.
I use 3M 233+ tape and have no problems. Blow the foam off to make sure there isnt any dust left, or vacuum if thats your thing. I’ve never had a problems with early release or bleeding under the tape. Make sure its not too cold where ever your are glassing, that might cause problems. You can find 233+ tape online at Uline.com or at an autobody supply store.
Have you used 3M233 its a green colored tape and smells yummy!!! I live in Newengland so its cold and damp here at times no serious problems with 3M233…also are you using poly or epoxy I find if I set my poly off to slow it can eat into the best of best masking tapes if not cured quickly…may be adjusting your kick a little harder I usualy lam a longboard in no more than 15 20 min before jelling…lateron
If you’re using too much surface agent, or the wrong type of resin, you could be getting a waxy surface that’s difficult for tape to stick to. If that’s the case, you can hit it with some abrasive. If anything bleeds under the tape, you can cover it with a pinline.
The 3M 2328 doesn’t smell of anything far as I can tell Nat
Sticking to foam seems okay - the problem is to get it to stick on to cured lam resin. I’m doing tinted decks and pigment bottoms so the bottom laps on to the laminated and cured deck. Important that the lap is neat which doesn’t happen when the freakin tape alway falls off!! No additives in my lam resin, pure iso, and I do a hot mix, but the tape is pretty much lifting before I even lap the rails anyway, so I’m sure it’s not an issue with the glue being disolved.
Fatbaslardass: I’ve done loads of cut laps in Indo, and never had a tape problem, so I reckon it could be a weather thing. Or else it’s a conspiracy and ‘they’re’ swapping out all our masking tape to… well… make us really ANGRY…
Funny all the different replys to your post on a specific question? I know what your going through, sometimes you need to get the adhesive warmed up bit. Try putting the tape in the microwave for bit or sun. A lot of times after i’ve done the tape job I’ll run my fingers over the tape really fast to friction heat the tape/ adhesive. The problem is a good news, bad news thing. The good news is that your getting the proper lamination when you glass…tight lamination with the weave just showing. The bad news is that with a little of the weave showing your don’t have the surface area of say…a sanded hotcoat for the tape to stick to. Plus to add insult to injury, you have little void areas for the resin to work it’s way under, and subsequently start melting the adhesive.
So try to heat the tape up and get the adhesive to stick to the little hills in the weave of fiberglass.
I understand what you are asking now. It can be difficult at time to get a clean tape line on a lamination. Still though, I’ve have good luck with the 233+ tape. Make sure the board and tape is reasonably warm, as in 70 to 75 degrees. Also make sure you arent stretching the tape too severely when you apply it. If the tape creases around curves use a narrower tape, on the weave you dont have much surface area to adhere too anyway and a crease will just make that worse.
They make a 233 and a 233+. I’ve personally found the 233+ to adhere better than the 233. Its a little pricey a roll, last I paid was $2.50 a roll for 3/4" wide, but its worth it. They make it all the way down to 1/8" for pinlines, but I’ve found the 3M fineline tape works better for that anyway. Like I said before, any autobody supply store will carry all this stuff.
Yes, 2727 is the best. The adhesive is the most chemical-tolerant I’ve found, and it is easier to get a nice curve than with any other type that I know of. Also, it’s really sticky.
Have you tried burnishing the tape and letting it sit for a day? To burnish, I take a pen, or similar round shaped object, and rub it against the tape and board so that the leading edge is tight against the board. Then, just leave it overnight before you do the color tint. I think the adhesive in the tape actually bonds better the longer you let it sit. I’ve never had a problem with tape falling off - then again, I’ve only glassed a couple of boards…
i was taught to push the tape down with a razor blade or tounge depresser. if i let preped boards sit over night i re push the tape down before i laminate. on foam or weave its what we do.
Ok… I think I’m doing everything right, so I’m going with the board and tape being too cold.
I’ve got a layer of clear 4oz to go on the deck which usually I’d just free lap onto the bottom, but I think I’ll test resinhead’s idea of warming the tape before use and do another cut lap. Seems like a possible cause as tapes are kept in a cold room.
hi Tomway, im in wales and i use 3m2328 masking tape and i get it locally from a local auto paint shop it seems to perform the best, ive tried other makes but they werent suitable. it is also the standard tape used by most production shops that i know of. i use silmar resin with no difficulty. it is also quite reasonable price wise. regards gnrbds.
Try 3M233+. I had trouble with my tape leaving gooey adhesive on some of my slower catalyzed batches. I’m sure if it were upside down that gooey stuff would’ve sagged. The 233+ did the trick. Also kicking your resin a little faster should help because it reduces the amount of time your tape is expose to the solvents.
I’m no genius. PlusOneShaper gave me these tips and they worked.
Use more catalyst or wait longer to lam the other side. It’s the pigment. Once the resin is totally off (might be a few days at cold temps or slow cat) then tape off. You will find it happens more often with more pigment. Also use some cobalt five to ten drops depending on how much pigment. This cures the resin faster. Develop a ratio of catalyst. Some people use a 100 ratio. If it’s 70 deg they use 30cc catalyst to complete the hundred. Get it? 80 deg 20cc. 85-15cc. When you wash your squeegee kick your floor it should be gel. good luck.
