Template radii

everysurfer · August 26, 2013, 3:01pm

Ellipsis can definitely be used to get a smooth template.

With just radii, by putting the largest radii in the center and graduating to smaller, you can get a smooth arc with no bumps. It is important that the arcs don’t cross.

That being said, I got inspired by Yorky’s thoughts, and gave it a try. My apologies that I cheated and used the computer again, but I traced a computer drawn ellipse over the pintail template I first posted.

A mathematically purer arc.

IMHO, the first step is still getting your concept down with the radii method. Then overlay it with the ellipsis.

everysurfer · September 8, 2013, 5:37pm

Hi Malaroo,

I’m trying to follow your drawings, but I’m having a little difficulty. It seems like what you are saying is that if you expand and compress the rocker and template curves, they can me made to align?

It would be a coincidence that they match. The template was a tried and proven outline that I developed. The rocker concept was a gift from Bill Thrailkill.

Interesting though. Your idea could be used to design, sort of a “fun with numbers” exercise. For me, I’d want to make sure that the numbers don’t hold you back. For instance, if I wanted to add some tail kick, should I then alter the template to match the rocker? Different templates to work better with certain rockers, so you might be onto something. But how do fins play into it all? Quads and bonzers have less nose and more tail rocker than tri fins.

I do like how your mind thinks about it all. The more time I spend thinking about the possibilities, the more I understand.

So what would you do with a swallow tail? Or wings? Or is a smooth rounded pin really the “purest” design of all?

malaroo · September 8, 2013, 1:53pm

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malaroo · September 9, 2013, 3:14am

Oh no! from here it looks like my pictures are gone?!?!

hello again everysurfer

The only numbers are the measurements and ratios. no maths. No ratios in the above example, meaning ratio's like the boards thickness being a quarter of the width to certerline and the rail line being a quarter of the thickness … (a quarter) is just a concept to vary, you might know that you want it a bit thicker … or the rail line a bit higher or lower.

So frustrating for me. that it's difficult to understand! There are so many little steps involved, if I showed them all, it would become really, really boring. I don't know yet how to make it clearer, maybe a more detailed blog?

Coincidence that they match! … Hmmmmm, If it's all relative the options are limited, then it's just a matter of trying them all. Bill has been around a long time, and is very experienced with that type of shape, so the fact that the rocker he suggests works, isn't a coincidence.

If you wanted some tail kick, should you then alter the template to match the rocker?
Um! arr! hmmmm! I would alter the rocker with planshape characteristics in mind. You will know how much, it's a feeling thing, I believe your brain can see the relationships between planshape and rocker, after all, you are staring right at them.

Fins, swallow tails wings Bonzers. OMG! I'm researching as much as I can and finding relationships and checking their viability. Mini Simmons and fishes are classic principals of "Surfboard Geometry". Yesterday while trying to find your planshape geometry, I found the "Mini Simmons" planshape geometry. (An arc from a circle that uses the length of the board as a radius, put through a cylinder from a quarter to halfway). It looks right, I have to check it.

I wrote a bit on fins (pictures and text) in the "geometry in surfboards" thread. It's at the end of the thread. It's worth checking it out. Since then I have worked out how to make fins by the "surfboard geometry" method and they are created from the boards design, so they are related.

In the geometry thread I tell of a conversation with Geof McCoy (in 1993) he made me a board.
"Einstein," he says, "Do you know what the fastest shape is?"
I'm thinking, I have no answers. ???
he says … "Flying saucer" and he walks off.

Circles, cylinders, ellipses = flying saucer and = "smooth rounded pin".

gadgetuk · September 9, 2013, 7:56pm

Out of curiousity, checked out the 6'02" Tomo Vanguard,

http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o216/gadgetuk437/SURFING/6_02TomoVanguardRadius_zps03101d80.jpg

Wonder if Dan intended this?

BTW

What's wrong with images these days?

everysurfer · September 9, 2013, 8:06pm

I would bet he did.

Maybe he reads Swaylocks?

malaroo · September 9, 2013, 11:57pm

I woke up this morning and realized, you can see it on the board you are shaping. You sight the rail line from the side and tilt the blank (board) till that meets the rocker line. Obviously the rails are in the way a that point, but you get a check of how things are going. It shows the tiny bit of tail lift you need.

Interesting to see the Tomo Vanguard diagrams.

BarrySnyder · September 14, 2013, 12:01am

Spin templates are great for saving space.

I literally have over 250 outline templates. 1/2 board templates so I guess I flip them too. Just over and not around if you get what I mean. Mostly masonite. Some are doorskin or 1/8" plywood.

I've been making them since 1984.

Nearly every shape that comes along these days, I have it.

4'10' to 12'+. Long, short, fish, HPSB's and more.

Still making templates now.

I route all my outlines, so flip temps don't work so well.

My most popular shapes I have several sizes of the same templates.

I also have many, many rocker templates.

Rail temps too.

This picture is just a handful I grabbed for a photo.

No computer, just laying out the curves and creating more.

everysurfer · September 14, 2013, 1:23am

I like your dog.

Labs are the best