Shipping has gone totally insane.
Our costs doubled in the last 6 months and
that’s not including the fuel surcharge.
The Japanese put a very high cache on American culture,
that which we view as disposable they collect. I prefer their way.
If the hand shaped side of the industry is to survive it will have to make changes in it’s business model.
Those changes are already in place in some countries but it takes a will to make it work. When people put a higher value on the end product because it is hand made then and only then will the customer pay for what it takes.
I know one shaper/glasser/snader who has traveled the world.
Some shapers know the whole process. Even here on Sways. Especially here!
Every one of the backyarders is a thorn in the side of the
man and rightly so. I say keep up the good work!
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customer relations/advice etc… could that be done via internet/video chat?
For some(like me…) that would do. Others are very keen to speak to a ‘real’ live person. However I think the main point is that the customer is looked after and given real advice and feel that he is given a higher level of service than the local surfshop with generic/popout boards and untrained teenager staff can provide.
regards,
Håvard
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The Japanese put a very high cache on American culture,
that which we view as disposable they collect. I prefer their way.
Why? Honest question.
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Shipping has gone totally insane.
Our costs doubled in the last 6 months and
that’s not including the fuel surcharge.
The Japanese put a very high cache on American culture,
that which we view as disposable they collect. I prefer their way.
No kidding. I agree.
What’s wrong with supporting your local shaper and glassers? Grass greener on the other side? The comment about fuel surcharge is spot on.
My wife was flight crew for TWA since the 60’s. She could give you an earful about ‘her’ industry. Flying blanks or boards all over to hell and back for reasonable cost is a fantasy that will never happen. The airline business is one of the most difficult and volatile businesses one can imagine.
A plane’s space is finite (to say the least), every airline overbooks flights in the hopes that they will fill every seat, each and every time. When they don’t, I get to fly. This is known as “space available” and I’m referred to as a “Non-Rev”, which stands for No revenue…they aren’t really making anything off me…but because she was an employee for all those years, the airlines offer this as a perk for duty served. The industry is brutal, so these folks deserve some perks, believe me. You always hear about the poor passengers getting mean flight attendants…there’s another side to it, believe me. There are some real morons that fly.
There are also fluctuations that are constantly being taken into consideration. The obvious one is weather, another is mechanical s (breakdowns) ,which no one can control. But there are also weight restrictions. Each type of aircraft can only go up safely with X amount of weight. And to be quite honest, freight sometimes pays better than people sitting in a seat. I learned this in the late days before TWA got swallowed up by American…we went to Egypt, and all the non revs weren’t getting out for weeks at a time because TWA was balancing freight with paying customers to make a profit. Sometimes we end up bouncing all over the globe hopscotching our way to or back from somewhere. It can be wonderful or grueling…it’s the price you pay for traveling this way. At Xmas time things get even worse…people try to haul 14 bags on the planes expecting it for free. We don’t even try to go “SA” this time of year. Now put that big ass clumsy fragile surfboard into the equation and see how it is going to be received by the airlines. Containers yes, on planes? No. Are the airlines really trying that hard to save money? Absolutely…it was TWA that developed the method for taxiing out to the runway using one engine until final takeoff…anything to save fuel. Ironic since once up extra fuel gets dumped.
As far as the traveling Shaper-Wilbury concept…I would be sitting pretty. My last flight to France was thru Heathrow/London on ‘the Polar’ (over the arctic). This was the only flight that looked feasible for us to make our destination as planes were full of people going to the World Cup in Europe. The Da Vinci Code had just been released, and all the lemmings were flocking to Paris. People are so impressionable! This was last summer, and we were told more people were travelingto Europe then since the end of World War II. My wife looked at all the flights to ‘list’ us (on a closed sytem for flight crew) and she deduced we stood the best chance of getting to Paris by going thru LAX on the ‘polar’ to LHR ,then puddle jump or chunnel to Paris. We got even luckier when we got the last 3 seats (our son was with us) in First Class. On a 777 there are 16 cubicles up front (1 reserved for crew rest) that have full lay down beds, a visitor pull up bench, a full video library of your own…excellent menu, champagne, beer whatever…and you are treated like royalty…really. If we fly coach it is free…but why would you when our tax for flying the first class was $82 per person. My wife priced our seats thru Expedia and the one way cost was $9980.
Britain has now added a tax for coming into their country, and you locals know more about it than I do…but because we never left the airport and were only en route to Paris we didn’t incur the charge. The other factor to consider is the strength of the Euro and the British pound…Americans are shocked at how expensive it is to go to Europe now. The people that insist Bush has done a fabulous job with our economy are either already rich or seriously deluded. Go to Europe and see what your dollar is worth. Better yet, go to Moscow, now the most expensive city in the world.
Okay, so getting back to the point. Worldwide distribution of surfboards makes my head spin. The magazines love to paint a rosy picture of how BIG our industry has become. Globalization is the new buzz word. CNC is the new God. After all, NO ONE EVER USES A PLANER ANYMORE…heaven forbid! Well the Japanese put a value on CUSTOM, and I applaud them for it. There’s a lot of crap out in the world already and that whole justification that CNC’s are creating the MAGIC BOARD because shaper’s can only do it once and never do it again is a G.D. myth. The human brain is the ultimate computer lest you want Terminator breathing down your neck. There’s also something to be said FOR THE EXPERIENCE INTERACTING WITH YOUR SHAPER. One man’s magic is another man’s poison so even if a CNC can reproduce a board “perfectly” and it’s magic for Kelly, it might suck for YOU.
All I know is some things are sacred to me, if I want to mass produce a model or what I would call a “Production Custom” than I would have the machine true my blanks and do the ‘grunt work’…this was never more apparent then when I was doing as many sailboards as humanly possible as soon as the first blow happened…but that is my option. You will have a very difficult time convincing me some big ass conglomerate is going to satisfy my custom experience in their quest for worldwide domination. That the guy that started Resin8 made a fortune as a dotcommer before he was 24 yrs. old is commendable or enviable, but his getting off on starting his surfboard business as his next conquest isn’t appreciated by many of us and never will be. What’s wrong with interacting with a skiled craftsman that is sincere in making you an excellent quality product and interacts with you in person vs. cyberspace? Maybe you might feel good for getting a truly personalized surfboard from them and helping him pay for his kid’s college. Maybe our econmy would be bettr served by not sending your purchasing power to the most polluted country in the world. How much did you save for the tradeoff? $100, $200? Was it worth it?
Who says there’s no soul in foam? Guess again.
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Maybe our econmy would be bettr served by not sending your purchasing power to the most polluted country in the world.
Which economy would that be exactly? And what country would that be? How about sending the money of to some country that is not the most global warming gases polluting country in the world? How about sending the money off to a country that is not the country that spend the most resources on the planet pr. head? I only wish it would have helped…
The funny thing is I was told that the ‘surf industry’ is supposedly bigger in Europe than in the US if you measure the revenue made by the ‘surf companies’(whatever that means). But in reality that’s just clothes, everywhere I turn there are people wearing Ripcurl caps and Roxy cloths that probably wouldn’t know what side to put the wax on a surfboard(if they knew it was a surfboard in the first place). Quite a few boards are being made in Europe, but I doubt it’s anywhere near the US or AUS (or China for that matter). Someone show me the numbers if they have them.
If you live where I live, there are no local shapers to support. Shipping is needed if you don’t want to build your own boards.
regards,
Håvard
Haavard…where do you live? I’ll ship you whatever you want.
Why what?
Why do the Japanese put such a high value on American culture?
or
Why do I prefer their way?
-
I don’t know.
-
I just do.
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Why do the Japanese put such a high value on American culture?
Fashion, sometimes?
Your guess is as good as any.
We generate culture for the money it makes us.
What happens to it after it is sold is anyones guess.
Garage sales?
Which brings it all back around.
Surfing is culture and surfboards handshaped by famous American shapers are
cultural icons that people around the world want.
But if it’s just a surfboard you want support a local shaper. Or get a mass produced board. Whatever.
If it’s a cultural icon you want pay the dam price no matter how steep. Right?
But whatever you do dont hold a cultural icon to a margin that only works for a mass produced product.
YOU dont go to Walmart and buy master recordings, You buy copies. And that about covers it.
Why do the Japanese put such a high value on American culture?
Certain parts of American ‘Culture’ are creative, innovative, hip and fashionable.
The epicenter of this is California…which also happens to be the epicenter of American surf culture, which also happens to have a rich history. If you think of American Surf Culture as a popular brand, it makes more sense.
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Surfing is culture and surfboards handshaped by famous American shapers are
cultural icons that people around the world want.
But if it’s just a surfboard you want support a local shaper. Or get a mass produced board. Whatever.
If it’s a cultural icon you want pay the dam price no matter how steep. Right?
I think you almost nailed it. I very much doubt that you will be able to make someone around here buy a brand name at any cost, but when it comes down to choosing between two boards side by side I think just about every surfer will go for the name brand if the price is about $100-200 more than the generic OEM boards marked with only the surfshop logo. And somehow (don’t know how) the s-core boards sold too (or atleast disappeared from the shops).
I don’t know, but it seems to me like most American shapers, whenever someone says ‘global market’ in one way or another the old record goes ‘support your local shaper or the soul of surfing will die’. You should be saying ‘opportunities’. You are the root of the sport. You have all the know how. You have ‘all’ the brand names. You are the icons for the rest of the surfing world. Why don’t you sell that?
The only thing stopping you is shipping costs. Get that figured out and you have a global market for selling your boards.
regards,
Håvard
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California/U.S. icons and “The only thing stopping you is shipping costs. Get that figured out and you have a global market for selling your boards.”
Since I’m not an icon myself, and in fact live so far away from that neighborhood I don’t even drive by it on the freeway, it’s my speculation here…
This must be the toughest balancing act imaginable. Work for years, get the tools, knowledge, skills, experience and vision necessary to be a real craftsperson…need to make a living too…and everything escalates. Need to make a better living, unsteady work conditions, the convoluted priorities of modern living, a desire to expand. It may be craft for the craftsperson, tool creation for the tool users, but the “next level” financially seems to need at least one foot in either “art” or “fashion”. We’ve seen that it can be done.
As Haavard says, shipping can be a bugaboo for small scale global business. Beyond the actual shipping costs though are other costs or intimidating factors. The paperwork is one such thing…but surprisingly to those who haven’t done this it can be much easier than expected…but it has to be done and done correctly. Another “hidden” thing is actually packing the boards for shipping. At a certain point that can become a full time job and blasts the capacity for the actual board builder. Plus the costs of packaging materials. I’ve seen the simple cost of boxes for odd sized items turn a job from profit to loss, just because the estimator didn’t price the shipping boxes…to say nothing of the price of shipping.
Maybe there is a business opportunity for somebody to be a boardpacker? Surfboard shipper as another level of service? It could be run out of a garage to store materials and a van or bobtail truck. Pack the boards right at the factory and move or or drive them off to the shipper. Roam the coast…
Nels
are you referring to handshaped as “off the blank” or actually shaped/finished by the shaper whose name is on the board? Very intresting to see you talk about a new business model for…real custom bds shaped by the shaper! I travelled globally shaping-6 mths of the year,when i was based in france- for nearly 20 years to Japan/USA/Aust/UK,great times,OK money but supa punishing on body,with jetlag,and time away from being the hardest,so any of todays top shapers just stay mostly at home and use,distibutors,agents ,websites to try and get to the customer,I am starting to develop a business plan where people can contact you by e-mail,and I can quote prices incl. airfreight using the Fedex’s and DHL’s of the world! this is expensive,but the product would be hand shaped and hand laminated,hand sanded,with a numbered certificate of authenticity, as I can only make 30 pw,what will people pay for a true state of the art custom? and of course I can adjust the price if for example ,freight is 300 $'s, board is 700 $'s-custom/freight a total price of 1000 $'s.In any other industry when you talk custom,ie:guitars,cars,etc, double the price and wait 6 mths,so you are right …a new business model needs to be developed,relative to what the customer wants and is prepared to pay.Probably in the most interesting period of change,seen in the s/bd industry,at the end of the day it is the customer who will determine what we make and at what price irrespective of freight
…hello Maurice,
when you travel to shape do you carry the planer and other tools?
I ask cause with some visa and customs I found problems…like you re a tourist you cant work here
why you bring those power tools? etc
-DHL s price for a longb is around $6oo
fe ex around $900
is very difficult to compete due to these prices or similar ones
and the average guy who wants to pay for an expensive board only knows the famous brands
and dont even know about cool shapers, etc
I just got a shipping price from an Ozzie shop in Sydney to deliver to Ireland.
AUD€300 collect from airport or AUD€450 to your door.
Thats for a 7’
I think thats reasonable.
Though I will be hit for tax + duty at 24% on cost of board + shipping on collection.
When I travel,I have clarke/hitachi planer,and a couple of my custom blocks/hand planers-so very lite!In Japan no probs as the customs are used to shapers flying in,USA is the hardest but as I always had an ongoing destination like Europe or Aust,easy to explain tools-on the way to work,and Europe…never even heard of any body being asked.
sorry I didn't think of freight for long boards,and yeah someone who is wanting to freight a bd would probably only want a premium brand/product-the board market is now becoming saturated with the "Asian invasion" and as the Quality is now very good and some factory's with the good shaping machines are actually producing great bds and are landing them at 1/2 our cost price, so as this continues the small cool shapers will be destined to the hobby segment of the industry,or differentiate their product with Technology/design
Mairice, plan on shaping any boards in Hawaii in the near future?
Shaped and finished by the shaper.
Or to whatever degree possible.
Put it on the label. Like foods.
You might divide it out by time as in 50% hand made 50% machine. Say what is what. Whatever. That’s just a general idea. Here’s another:
List the names of those who contributed to each board.
Like movie credits. Or book credits.
Three words about marketing.
Branding branding branding.
It’a all about branding.
Studying the concept may help you generate ideas.