I need to order a blank for a new project and need some advice please.
My friend Steve has asked me to make him an 8’6" board. He is an experienced surfer (approx. 160 lbs 5’10") who used to ride short boards in his youth but has been riding longboards for years. His current favourite board is:
Length 9’8"
Width 25.5"
Nose 17.5"
Tail 17"
Tailblock 9.5"
Thickness 3 5/8"
Nose rocker 4"
Tail rocker 2"
This board was build intended for glide. It has a single 7.5" fin (small?) set forward in the box. Very flat bottom. There is a subtle about 2mm single concave that starts at the nose that runs back full for about 4 foot where it blends into a short 1mm double concave and then progressive roll about 4mm to about 12mm roll / vee in the tail. Rails full rounded 50/50. Weight about 22 lbs. (I have ridden this board once and it glides well even in small weak waves and seems to turn well.)
He would now like to progress to something shorter that turns a lot more quickly but still have that glide element. (The board is intended mainly for river surfing but don’t let that distract you. If it don’t go on the sea it surely cannot be) He feels that 8’6" is a good place to start. He initially thought something like his longboard shortened and scaled down but then we agreed we needed more than that. I have been looking for board designs in that length to base my design on but have not found too much suitable. There is the Bruce Jones Retro Mini Longboard 8’6"x22"x3". Personally I haven’t really ridden much in this length range. (mini longboard / mini mal?)
Then last week I borrowed an 8’4" Bic Magnum to see if I could use that as a real life reference. I’ve had 2 small waves on it only but it seems to glide very well and the tail is very responsive. I’ve had a good look at it. 8’4" x 23.25" x 3 3/16". Nose 18" Tail 15.5". Nose rocker about 3.5" Tail rocker 1" Round tail. Extremely flat on the bottom from nose to about 3’ from tail - straight across - no roll then quite a bit of rolled vee out the tail - about 10mm. Fin set up centre single 8" + 2 3.5" side fins. Weight 17 lbs seems a bit heavy for a board that length but gives it stabilty in chop. Is this intentional or the nature of the Bic construction? Fullish rounded rails with a defined edge all along the bottom. (increase planing area?)
If I stretched this board to 8’6" would I have something decent/ fit for purpose? Obviously I don’t want to just copy it, maybe more width in tail? Low tail rocker offset by lots of tail vee? Planning to glass it with epoxy 6 oz on the bottom; 6 oz + 6 oz patch on the deck so it will surely be lighter than the Bic. Need to lam, fill and gloss with 4kg of epoxy resin.
Main question - I need to order a blank soon from Homeblown UK. The closest size blank they have is a 9’2" so I am going to have cut 8" off somewhere. They have stock standard rocker and low rocker or they will do a custom rocker for me. What rocker measurements suitable to what I am trying to build should I give them? If I’m going to cut 8 inches off the tail could I tell them to make the rocker 1 inch (if thats what its going to be) 8 inches from the tail? They are able to plane the bottom and thickness the blank for me so I will need to decide on that too - will save me a lot of work and be a more professional rocker.
All experienced wisdom appreciated.
(Rocker photos not accurate due to lack of level buts gives the general idea)
I need to order a blank by Monday morning. Frustrating that they do not have anything between 7’11" and 9’2". I would prefer not to cut off and waste. Have been looking through a Clark catalogue for suitable rockers but probably will just go with Homeblown standard low rocker 9’2". Nose 3.7 Tail 3.2 Don’t feel confident to design my own rocker between the nose and the tail at the moment . Have been having doubts about the suitability of the Magnum. A wider more square tail might be more suitable. Get the blank and then sort out the design.
Hope this is of some benefit to someone. It is to me.
I think you're having trouble getting responses because not many of us know anything about river boards.
Since the guy likes the 9'8'', I don't see why you shouldn't just shrink that design to 8'6''. Give that a go before you start changing all the other variables.
Are they able to cut your bottom rocker (you said they'd mill bottom)? If so, you should have them glue the deck rocker as close as possible to finish, and do the foiling/thickness in their cuts off bottom. Just leave yourself a few mil from finish thickness so you have room to finish out deckside.
edit to add that you need to find where your desired foil/rocker is going to fit in the blank; probably will be closer to centered in blank rather than all the way to nose (or tail). the blank mfr should be able to help with this.
Thanks Mike. The silence was beginning to give me a complex. (Had I unknowingly committed some unforgiveable Swaylocks sin?)
Fair point about river boards. I have initially been reluctant to speak about boards specifically designed for river surfing as I have presumed that most people on the forum have little knowledge or experience of this and won’t be able to relate to what I’m saying. Most surfers on here are of the sea. There are some lake surfers as well I see. (And one or two river surfers. Are there any other riders of boards I have left out?). However having surfed in the sea for over 40 years and on the river for more than 5 years it has been interesting to note the differences and similarities of the waves as well as how different boards perform. A river wave can be small or large, weak or powerful, white water or clean face. A single wave can within a few miles display all these characteristics and unexpectedly change from knee high to raging head high within a short distance (perhaps later I can go into the characteristics of a river wave in more detail if anyone is interested). The emphasis on river surfing (in my experience currently limited to the River Severn) is distance (the current record is 7 and half miles). Most sea surfers who come to the river seeking this experience find they do well on big boards. Traditional noseriders / logs 10’+ in my experience fair the best. Wide tail and big fin give stability in the white water where must of the riding is done. Low rocker, flat bottom give glide through the slower unbroken sections. Weight helps with momentum. If you only want distance then you get a barge and straight line for as long as the wave will allow. (just remember you might have to carry it back afterwards). However if you find straight lining boring (which it isn’t because the wave is constantly changing) there are sections on the wave where you could ride something shorter and throw a fish or a variety of shortboards about with great satisfaction. I used to use a 10’6" log but have recently found that my 6’4" mini simmons is like a bar of soap on clean face. However its probably too short for long distances. Which means there is a place for something in between. Like 8’6"
Which brings me to your next point. Shrink the 9’8" to 8’6". As I mentioned this is what we initially wanted but somehow we moved on and I ended up with the Magnum but in hindsight this makes sense. Why lose all those great features? 8’6" x 23" x 3"? I’ll do some more drawings and see how the nose and tail work out. This would make life so much more simpler. I presume the rocker would stay the same? ( i recall a thread by Bill K on here about this)
Your point about glueing the rocker makes a lot of sense. I’ll speak to the blank maker on Monday.
The other thing that may have kept people from responding was the # of questions in one post. From my point of view, I'm glad to help where I can; but don't have time to get into things where there's three or four questions, each with dependent variables that would have to be discussed. Try and limit your scope a little, then when you get someone willing to help you can bring in the follow-up questions. Then a bunch of us will respond and argue, LOL.
Thanks. After agonising over rocker numbers I finally decided to go with the stock low rocker blank and increased the nose and tail a bit. I haven’t done a final measurement but i would guess I’ve got about 4" in the nose and 3.5" in the tail
