Fish experts…
Whatcha think abou these two contrasting fish.
Center point is about three inches forward on the old skool, and a few inches back on the new skool
Drew
The one on the left isn’t a fish. Its a swallowtail shortboard. Fish were fist called fish not because of the tail shape or the nose width or the fins (keels) or the rocker, but precisely because the wide point is forward of center like the shape on the right.
“Fishform” boats & kayaks have been built for hundreds of years.
It’s the modern adaptation of the fish. Symantics…purists…blah blah, call it, or don’t call it what you want, whatcha think of the dimms for each…
Drew
not to be a jerk, but it’s actually “semantics”
Sorry, I reailze my post might have sounded a bit abrupt. Either one will work, especially if you’re around 6’, 165-170. What kind of waves are you going for?
…and in case you’re wondering, that was my dry humor at work.
I think they’re both 100% awesome, whatever one may call them.
Drew, Whats up? I cant seem to get the picture to show but this link works. Its four fishes my buds and I have made…all about 6’0". The second from the left is like your wide-point-forward board…fast as hell down the line. The far left and far right are the same size (6’0" x 21") but have the wide point behind middle…they ride from the tail and allow more of a regular shortboard style. Check out the cool custom made FCS keel fins…3 tabs!
what size fish would be good for someone who is 6"2, 200lbs. I was thinking a 6’4 about 2 5/8 or 3inches thick, Im looking to use it on mostly small days like 1-2. My other boards are for when it gets bigger.
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what size fish would be good for someone who is 6"2, 200lbs. I was thinking a 6’4 about 2 5/8 or 3inches thick, Im looking to use it on mostly small days like 1-2. My other boards are for when it gets bigger.
Same size as you: 6’2" and slightly thicker (2 7/8").
Go with the old school and did you make those designs using the aps3000 program?
Board on left would surf more traditional, making for easy swap back to your regular trifin. Both work about the same for 1-4’ waves (meaning they work better than your standard tri), but board on right might float better, and nose ride easier.
Strong offshore winds, take board on left.
210 lbs., easily a 5’10" x 23" x 2.75" thick, for floaty SMALL wave board. Might be too floaty, but hey, who needs to duckdive small waves?
Wouldnt the board on the left need to be set as a tri since the widest point is so far back? Thats the problem of trying to use the moder short boards as twin fins.
You are very observant! Good on ya.
Board on left would need bigger fins, as big as maybe 7" tall, but probably 5.5" is enough for small waves only.
Since it’s more pivoty, more stress is placed on the fins, with less help from the rails.
Of course, you could adopt the rolled V idea, so more pressure is applied on the rail by the convex bottom shape, and that would alleviate the need for bigger fins.
Many ways to skin a cat, with the trailer one of the most often used.
Some surfers, in tiny waves, like the flicky feel of tiny fins, and realized the extra speed and less drag from small fins.
Other surfers, in the same tiny waves, prefer BIG fins to generate their own speed, but pumping, weighting and unweighting, and using the natural energy created by hard turning to continue creating their own speed.
So it depends on surfer style, besides just wave size, template, fins used, preferences, and speed of the swell, shape of the wave…on and on.
I don’t claim to be an expert of anything concerning this forum. The fish on the left reminds me of the old McNabb rocket fishes circa 79 to 82. Is that new school? Lots of the North County guys road them. Mike
There really is almost nothing “NEW” in the surfboard design business. Almost everything has been done, tried, hashed, and then rehashed.
New is only relative to what was first designed in 1968.
Anything the newbies haven’t seen lately is considered “NEW”.
I remember something about RenoAb trying WPoint back on shorties before the flip nose kick board…that would be what…1968?
All other things being equal (e.g., rocker, fins, etc.) which of course they most likely won’t be, the old school Fish will/should be faster (when surfed as a Fish anyways and not as a Thruster).
Regarding Benny1’s comment, maybe he was there when the Fish was named by Lis or whoever named it and so has some inside info on the matter, but on the face of it this doesn’t fly.
The reason why? The Fish was originally designed as kneeboard and kneeboards generally have their wide point forward of center. So according to Benny1’s logic, all kneeboards should be called Fish!
My understanding (and I started kneeboarding in San Diego in the early 70’s) the Fish was so-named because it ‘looks like a fish’ when viewed from the deck. Made sense to me back then (although that could have been due to the drugs!) but it still makes sense to me now.
Visuals
On the right your left fish, and pardon the distraction standing next to it.
I would consider it right brained
Here’s your right side fish. I consider it to be left brained…
Here’s another version of your right side fish a little more left brained than normal. And again please pardon the distraction on the left.
Wide nose = catches rail off top carve especially backside unless you totally whip it off the tail like you can with a board shorter than you are tall. Front footer
Pointy nose = smoother carve(release) off the top or in the hook but more thruster oriented in nature. Rear footer and believe me this will spin out at size/speed just like Curren’s did (look at him struggle with it)
Left fish = right brain surfing = a testoterone relationship with the wave
Right fish = left brain surfing = an artistic relationship with the wave
Either one, either way you’ll learn something from them and have alot of fun doing it…
one man’s opinion that’s all
Quote:
The Fish was originally designed as kneeboard and kneeboards generally have their wide point forward of center. So according to Benny1’s logic, all kneeboards should be called Fish!
benny’s take sounds reasonable enough to me…i can’t speak as to fact or fiction, but your logic…well, let’s just say i haven’t heard logic that fallacious since the LSAT.
Oneula, What the heck is that blue thing anyway? I’ve seen a couple in the water both people barley surf, they are scary, for the trurster bushman (a swallow tail at best) I wish he could see the top two boards, Last weekend I just stopped in at Surfahaus, just to spy on some new boards, bushman had a couple in the rack, they were bad, his try at fishes have been bad period no flow from nose to tail funny noses and pulled in tails, What gets me is this guy comes in and bought the thing (thing) not a fish not a new school fish, and there was a beautiful Tim Groh real fish except for the super sharp foiled keels (super nice glass job and cheaper only 450 I think) the bush 470 ugh I don’t understand!
When I rode my first fishes in 72-73 I thought it was because they were so dam fast like a fish, remembering the movie w/David N. flying down the line, I’m 50 now and ride No. 4/2004 in blue a 5’10" x 21 x 2.5 bullet of a fish with my updated keel fins and any and all technologies I’ve read about like concaves, cant, toein, fin tips, Direct S glass, Uv resigns etc…which we didn’t do or have back then, but we do now because it just works better, no more tracking problems, and still thick enough to catch any wave I want, I’m older now and I still remember grandma telling us about sharing.
Give a HOOT, don’t drop in, Have Fun!
Like I said best to ignore the blue thing on the left.
No need to cause a commotion or distraction.
And based on my experience the less people know about it the better for me and the few that choose to own one…
The 6’3" Bushman fish is his attempt in 1995-96 to copy Curren’s Petersen special without the complex bottom (simple vee that’s all). It was a custom order I got thru the boys at SurfandSail next to the old Kuu Aina remember them? The guy with the Madhatter hat… It was my favorite underground sailboard/surf shop and pretty cool… Bought alot of boards from those guys. The board only floated up to 165-170 comfortably and I’m 195 now. As much as I’ve looked around since then I’ve never found another bushman fish like it. He added more width in the nose now like the rest of the fun boards and calls them cosmic fishes…
The Mandala quad is kumu ono/chodoii desu.
I just got it from Manuel in January for southshore winter west wraps. At 6’4" it’s the smallest board I’m riding now but I’m still having problems with it backside and with backfoot carves off the top (nose always catches on the face). Still love it though.
The Brewer’s gotta find a new home soon as I need to make room, I probably will put it up at RV’s. Single to double barrel and really thick (3" 50/50 Rails). I don’t really need it anymore with a Mandala and Gemini.
Again I say either way you go, left or right shape it’ll be fun. Just need to surf them differently.
Make them both of them and find out yourself…
I’ve already got a glued up 1lb Lowes homemade EPS blank of the left side pointynose fish in the garage now waiting to be shaped for fun ala Bert Burger when there’s time (light, wide, thin, concave deck, flexible wood sandwich construction)…