Looking for some input to my newb like crazed thinking. Couldnt find anything on this in the search.
I was thinking of redecking just a section of a PU board like a compsand - I was thinking balsa but could go with other suggestions.
Background…
An older (early 90’s) PU 9’ performance longboard (nice and thin) that I use and abuse when the surfs up. Id rather go out and beat this board up than stay on the beach to protect a newer $$$$ longboard.
Board was buckled when I got it (stringer definately cracked to bottom) - repaired that twice now. Also had some delams that I repaired. The second repair was with epoxy and full wrap top and bottom (lasted a long time). Just noticed after the last abuse sessions that the deck area where the old buckle is delamed again. In addition other deck delams keep spreading – most likely old board, hard use and thin board/glass.
Repair thoughts…Repair the deck – maybe make it stronger without too much weight so that I can use this as my abuse board.
Remove a section of the deck roughly 4’ in length and the width following the rail outline about +1" in. That size gets me into good foam with no delams. Thinking of making the cut so it looks like a deck patch (V front and back or curved). Let foam dry, clean up the existing foam, maybe use pour foam to build up to original shape and get smooth.
Then the repair - I know I could just reglass at this point but why not try something else. I was thinking 3/32 balsa with 2oz under the balsa, vac bagged to the foam - sort of like an inlay. Clean that up and do 6 + 4 oz on top overlapping onto the old poly areas.
What do you guys think - will it work? My guess is it will definately be stiffer and lose some of that flexy feel. 6+4 too little or too much glass?
Any suggestions from the experienced guys on how / what to do is appreciated.
Sorry this is so long and thanks in advance for your input,
If the board is that badly beat up, go for it. I did this with a snapped longboard; no problems yet. I think that when you attach your deck to the stringer that will stiffen things up quite a bit. But at the stage your board is at, it should be fine. For glass, use the same amount you would use normally, just put some of it under the balsa. Please take pics of this process and post it if you have access to a camera, it’s fun to see a Frankenstein project
Ill try to take pics as I go. Just entered the point of no return and cut off the bad deck area. The cut off was heavy 4’ length approx < 20" wide > 2.5 lbs (many repairs).
Going to let it sit for a few days to dry while I make my mind up and get supplies. On that note…After a bit of cleaning up and rough smoothing the foam it looks like I have some low spots deeper than 1/8". That may ultimately effect the repair method.
Will a thicker core-cell or d-cell layer and glass be better than pour foam and balsa?
I still like the idea of the balsa inlay look - decisions, decisions.
Silly - if I dont glass under the balsa what do you suggest for best bonding?
I stripped the de-lammed glass from the deck and removed all the rotten, compressed foam from a once-magic board, and pour-foamed the void (in layers). It was a big area- 2/3 of the deck, all the way to the bottom glass in some areas. I reshaped the pourfoam and bagged some bamboo veneer on and reglassed it.
It wound up definitely heavier, but it was solid and watertight, and it looked okay, plus, it got my foot in the vac-bagging. compsand door.
Just an update - not much progression since the last post.
I got the bad deck section removed and cleaned up the exposed foam. Like I said earlier there are some spots that are deeper than others - mostly a result of the earlier buckle repairs and messed up foam that was removed from that area.
I may have to vac bag something about 1/4" thick to fill the deeper spots – bummer is alot of the exposed area is only 1/8" deep. Lots of sanding…and waste
You guys that have done this before - what do you like better core-cell or d-cell.
I guess it comes down to what will be the easiest to vac bag and sand down flush with the existing deck.
Im thinking of the following options – I could glass/epoxy and then paint the area like a deck patch or go with really thin balsa or bamboo veneer on top of the foam to keep that cool wood look (but maybe too stiff and heavier).
I will attach a pic once I figure it out (first time trying that). You can see the exposed area and just make out the old buckle/break area.
If you decide to use hard foam, go with Core Cell, It’s just better, especially in shear strength, probably the most important characteristic…imho
Constant flexing induces shear stresses, D-cell can’t keep up, although I hear they’ve improved this aspect of this foam… I dunno, don’t want to chance it…
Good point on the shear and flexing – the pour foam that was under the last repair handled it quite well for awhile but I did notice that when I removed the deck that it looked like the pour foam had broken up a bit and separated from the underlying PU foam. Probably too many cycles and flexes…
I went with balsa. I was able to get some from a kind source - big thanks. Trued up some pieces and taped the joints. Took my template, marked the balsa sheet and cut out the shape. Based on my reading here I decided to tape only the inside joints with cheap masking tape.
I had some 2oz cloth left over from building a custom model boat so I cut that to match the balsa. Weighed the glass to figure out epoxy needs (planned on 1 to 1 ratio). Got all my bagging stuff together, 4 mil plastic sheet, bubble wrap and paper towels. Vac pump is a modified refer compressor.
Mixed up the correct weight of epoxy and hardener. Placed the folded glass in the epoxy dish to wet out. I thought I got it all soaked through but after I rolled it all out onto the balsa it had some big dry areas. I probably should have warmed up the epoxy so it flowed easier. So I mixed up some more epoxy and wet out. Flipped the balsa over, glass side down on the deck. Put a poly sheet as a peel (just in case I had too much epoxy, paper towels and bubble wrap and covered with bag.
Just took it out of the bag - looks good (attached picture). Only bummer is a few of the end joints pulled apart. The balsa was thick because I wanted to do a bit of reshaping of the mis shaped foam so maybe they were too stiff to flex around the curve and pulled apart. Maybe I should have left some tape on the top to hold them tighter - not sure that would have worked either. Oh well after sanding and glassing it should be fine.
Next step - plane down, sand and glass. Im am thinking maybe I should just go with one layer of 6oz so I dont make it too stiff. Do you guys think that will be enough or should I throw in a 4oz so the balsa doesnt get dented.
Thanks to everyone at sways – I spent alot of time reading and learned tons before I started.
I may need to get a real vacuum setup. The refer compressor worked but it was waaaaay hot and I needed to filter off the oil mist from the exhaust. But I do like the bagging thing - especially with the valleys in my deck - I dont think I woud have achieved a complete bond with weights on top of foam or balsa.
hey yoyo i would just go with the 6oz balsa has pretty good psi and it looks like your using 1/8". usually balsa can with stand 30 to 40 psi so i wouldnt worry about putting an extra layer for a patch. very interesting in the way you cut out a section and added the balsa there deffently cool looking its probably going to be bomb proof if anyting everything else will break around the balsa. now are you going to be doing the bottom as well?
Bottom is in great shape - I replaced a large section of it when I did the last epoxy repair from the deck buckle. It must be the flex / strength of epoxy because the old poly resin/glass just cracked when it buckled. Maybe its so strong that the front end will break off … then I can learn how to do a break repair.
Thanks for the tip on the glass and balsa - actually some areas are 1/8" while some are almost 1/4". It will vary based on the depth changes in the old foam.
Definately a great way to try out vac bag’n. Im sure now Ill do more – and most likely spend more on gear (real vac pump, better bag material, etc)
Was getting ready to glass over the raw balsa and figured Id research as much as I could here on sways. Im glad I did since I wasnt going to cheater coat the balsa and probably would have ended up with a dry lamination.
So - I coated with a heated and thinned out RR, I also read a tip to preheat the balsa (in the sun for a bit and then a bath with the heat gun just before application). Looked like the balsa drank it. Waited for that to tack up and applied a second thinned coat so Id have comething to sand. I will let that sit overnight and will be light sanding and laminating soon. The second coat may have been overkill but it was only 30 grams and I didnt want to sand into the balsa again.
Also my first use of with RR epoxy - liking it so far.
Well its almost done. Hand laminated a layer of 6 oz on top. That was after the cheater / sealer coats. Hotcoated, sanded and gloss coated. After the gloss sets Ill sand and not polish (it will match the old poly better). I was going to wide pinline the border to hide the irregular cut between the glass and balsa but it doesnt look that bad and Id rather surf it than look at it.
Ill weigh it when Im done – Im hoping if my calcs are correct it will be the same weight or maybe a touch lighter than before.
Its pretty smooth - picture above has a reflection in it and the gloss coat is still wet.
Anyone ever use colored adhesive pinline tape for cars before?
I also have some automotive U-Pol clear spray left over from a kid bike repaint – would that be recommended for UV protect or just a waste of product and extra weight?
Thanks again for everyones help on this project with their responses and my digging through old posts its been an enjoyable project
Well - after 10 hrs in the post cure hotbox and a sand to 220 it looks pretty good. Im going to skip the pinlines. Only thing left is to wetsand the rails and feather it in to the old bottom repair which had some waterbased polyurethane for UV protect needed for the other brand of epoxy. Pic of sanded repair area.
Sounds like RR doesnt need the UV protection but I still may apply a layer of the poly just for added protection.
Final weigh in looks like its 1/2 lb lighter (on a bathroom scale) so give or take a bit its not far from the original weight and hopefully stronger.
Balsa - glass joint isnt perfect but it doesnt bother me enough to add a pinline…(maybe later when I feel the need to try pinlining)
Thanks again for all the help… next step try it in the surf.