are there any techniques for building a foam core/wood veneer board (that’s a compsand, right?) without a vacuum bag? if the answer is “no, don’t even bother, not worth the hassle”, then i’ll just delete the thread. i’m just curious and everything i saw in search was bagged.
ziplock bags filled with water have been used.
seriously though, a vac bag is simple, cheap, and easy.
Use balsa blanks no wider than 8 inches and no longer than 48", no thicker than 3/32". Painstakingly, done with great care, coat your plank with epoxy. Start on the bottom of the board. Start at the tail or the nose. Start at the center/stringer line and place your plank. Press down to foam and wipe any excess resin on the edges of the plank. Put some kind of thick palstic down or release film on top of blank so not to soil your weight system. Place thick reference book( usally 12" x 9 ") until you totally cover plank. If you have good board support or strong stringer ,so not to distort rocker shape, you can do more than one plank at a time. Don’t have seam lines on following rows match your center plank seams. No fiberglass cloth is between wood and foam, just foam/resin/wood. Use fast curing epoxy and place a new plank when epoxy is set on plank(s). No reference books, use gallon zip lock bags doubled up and put sand in the insdie bag.
This should be enough info to get you into trouble. The assumption of commen sense is being applied here so the dozens of other details to do the deck and rails, tail and nose blocks are not mentioned. Don’t be afraid to use wide blue painters tape when making dome and rail curves in combination with your books/weights/sand bags. When finished you can sand it by hand with 100-150 grit sand paper. Glass it,fin and plug it like you would normally glass any of your other boards.
This is stone age proven, so don’t be looking at your sun dial too hard. Take your time and you will be finished before you know it just casually working on it. A big wide sheet of veneer won’t work with this method so don’t try it.
Pic below of sand bag over preglass double leash plug with fiberglass cloth cap being heald down nicely with weight until epoxy cures.
awesome, thanks for the info guys. sounds like learning the whole vac bag process is the way to go. sandbags/water are super interesting though.
I think it’s best to use a vacuum bag for veneer. I met some kite boarders from Australia earlier this year and one guy was showing his boards. He makes all his boards and he does all the glassing in a vacuum bag. He says it’s way stronger and lighter. He was telling me about using cheaper materials for the peel ply, but he gets it from China, and it’s harder to get it here in Hawaii.
FYI… bb30 is an expert at vacuum bagging.
Charlie, one of these days, I’m going to have to get a lesson or two on laminating in a bag using peel ply.
Has anyone explained the bagging process step by step yet? I’ve read through many of the bagging threads but still don’t feel like I know enough about the process to give it a go. I’ve also tried to watch some videos but most aren’t dealing with surfboards (greg’s is the best i’ve found so far).
RippinRyan… it depends on what you’re vac bagging.
Veneer? Cork? BalsaCompsand? Fiberglass? Other Laminate?
Basically, the bag is just a clamp that will hold pressure over the whole board.
I’m interested in everything but I would like to learn cork or fiberglass first. I understand the basic concept of bagging and the supplies needed but I guess I don’t know the correct technique exactly.
There are you-tube vids showing the process, and believe it or not it isn’t any more complicated than what they’re showing. I consider bagging a clean veneer (as in, not even needing pinlines) to be way easier than doing a clean wet lamination.
All you really need for equipment is tube-type vaccum bag for $13 http://www.acpsales.com/Nylon-Vacuum-Bag-Tubes.html
A one-time purchase of bag clamps to seal the bag for $12 http://www.acpsales.com/Quick-Lock-Seals.html
A one time purchase of a 1-piece plastic “nipple” off a cheap condiments bottle for your bag-to-vacuum connection (you only want the lid that looks like this) http://www.usplastic.com/catalog/item.aspx?sku=66940&gclid=Cj0KEQjwzK6hBRCbzLz_r_f-3tkBEiQA-zyWsGzsPbsCUVk7TCcO9kjuAFtmGbU3rcT7wgfynW8YbX4aAg_U8P8HAQ
A low-end continuous run vaccum pump for $124 http://www.acpsales.com/EZ-Vac-Pump.html
OR an aquarium pump that’s hacked (takes about 10 minutes) to pull vacuum instead pump air for $35 + shipping http://www.amazon.com/Tetra-26075-Whisper-Aquarium-150-Gallon/dp/B000V7KM32
$13 + $12 + $2 + $50 = <$80 for the entire rig, and the only consumable is the $13 bag, which with just a little care/concern will normally last 5 or 6 pulls before it starts leaking. You don’t need vacuum guages, mac valves, reserve tanks or any of the other gear. Just plug the continuous run vacuum pump in, connect the hose to the nipple and let it run. With a new bag and no leaks it will pull plenty of vacuum to clamp a veneer, even on a longboard. That kind of pump is so quiet you can’t even hear them running unless you’re within a few feet of them.
I even bag wet lams with that rig without a problem, except I have to add peel ply and paper towels to control the excess resin.
duplicate
Would that set up pull enough to do cork? If so, there’s a good possibility I’ll be trying it out on my next board if it’s really only a $80 setup:) Also do you have any pictures of your setup?
wet out your skin with epoxy and lay it on the board properly, lay on top of that a deflated air matress (cheapo), wrap the board in the clear packing wrap (comes in rolls as wide as say 24 inches, Home Deport), inflate the matress, step back and behold.
Or go read Reverbs thread on low tech lab and build yourself an aquarium vac pump. Super simple. Duct tape some plastic together for a bag. do a little test first to get the feel of it. slap your forehead and say “doh?”
all the best
Be careful with the aquarium pumps. Tetra changed the design and reversed the diaphrams. They will hit if you hack it. It can get loud and I don’t know how bad it is for the pump.
If you can find an older Tetra pump like the one shown in the thread here about hacking them, you will be fine. That EZ pump looks like a good one to start with, but it’s over $100.00.
Here’s what I had time to upload today
I built a vac bag with plastic trach bags it took about 20. i duck taped them together and used a hand vacum pump from my dads tool box. I think the pump was some sort of refregerant pump. i had to stand their all day and pump every 2-3 minutues but it was worth it. I attached they pump with an old tube of shoe goop. I worked pretty good, but I had a few bubbles. ist that what swaylocks is all about making boards with bubbles.
piece out