Craftsmanship - Is it worth it?

Just read the post about surfboard prices going through the roof and most appreciated Ambrose and Genius’s (J. Phillips) comments. Not everyone on Sway makes their living by working with their hands, as most here are part-time surfboard shapers. Perhaps fair to say that most of the folks here simply love making boards for themselves and make their living doing a “real job”.

For those who make their living crafting things by hand there are perhaps two major areas of saddness that we encounter in this life working mostly by ourselves in small shops. One, seeing poor craftsmanship being passed off as “quality”, and two, people who either don’t care or refuse to understand the difference between junk knock-offs and true one of a kind products made with integrity.

I understand disposable products and I’m the first to buy junk when I just want junk, like disposable razors instead of expensive electric types, or cheap timex watches instead of gold Rolex models, or t-shirts without logos. We’re all free to pick and choose, and the lessons of supply and demand can not be altered any more than we can change the forces of gravity. However, I’m talking about the people who talk quality, march in support for made in America, and point downward thumbs at foreign made trash, while all the while going out of their way to purchase inferior made products and gripe about the prices of quality items. We read post after post here on Sway about Asian factory boards, but we also see those who denounce the prices the pro shapers get for their beautifully handcrafted boards.

I had two recent customers that sum it all up: One was a very wealthy surgeon who was interested in one of my balsa boards and also wanted a bid for a piece of furniture. He lives in a mansion and drives all kinds of fancy cars and sports a designer wife. When I told him the price he just snickered and said, “Are you kidding”? He eventually bought two surftech wood lam boards and found his furniture in Mexico.

The other customer is why I do what I do. He’s a regular guy who owns a small money management company. Not much flash, just substance. What he said to me is something that almost never happens: “I want one of your furniture items for the entrance of my office…I don’t care what you make, or when it’s finished, and I don’t even care what it costs…I’d just like you to see my office and then let me know if you’re interested in making something for me.” I saw the office and decided what I thought would be right. Several months later I called him to let him know the piece was finished. I told him I would love to keep it for sale in a gallery if he did not feel it was priced right or was not what he had in mind. At several thousand dollars, I did not know what to expect when he came by to see it. He smiled and wrote a check. I later received several calls and notes from him thanking me for the piece.

Everything about that experience seems backwards - perhaps a flashback to the olden days. There are a lot more disposable surgeons out there than the guy who bought the piece for his office. I asked him what he liked most about the piece and why was he willing to stick his neck out for whatever I wanted to make and charge. His answer still makes me smile when I think about it. He said, “I just like knowing it was made by hand, and it just makes me feel good when I walk into work and see it each morning.”

Sooo, this is nothing more than a word of encouragement from a fellow Swaylocker to do the best work you can, be proud of it, and press on to learn more and be better at whatever it is you do. Hats off to the full-time surfboard shapers who earn their living making functional water sculpture. Buy their boards, smile, thank them. It’s all about Enjoying the ride!

Richard

sweet story Richard

and learning how to find those customers is where its at!

its deffinately not the richest clients that are the best

Richard

your work is priceless…

in my field we find the following…

the poor small business owner is cheap for good reason

the rich large corporate is cheap for no good reason other than they feel they can push their weight around

the middle market guy will always pay for value

seems the extremely rich just can’t seem to easily part with their moola just like an accountant.

the richest folks out there are also the most frugal (Warren Buffet, Ross Perot etc etc)

You ever see the work done by Northshore Woodies?

When you’re in town you should pay them a visit up at the Waialua Sugar Mill

I love their work, just can’t afford a $10,000-$20,000 wall hanger at this point.

Aloha Richard,

As an American who earns a full-time income creating functional water sculpture… many thanks for sharing those good words! Everything you said is true.

Even though nearly all of my competition is mass-produced

in China, I’ve discovered there are still many people around the world who seek out the highest quality, and are delighted to pay for custom design and craftsmanship. Hopefully there will always be a place for true, one-of-a-kind products made with integrity.

Long live the artisan!

Richard - great story, everyone wins.

I learned that same lesson as a kid on Halloween. I grew up in a neighborhood of small, close-together middle-class houses. Every Halloween, we’d fill our bags in short order, and get nice comments from the neighbors. One year, we went over a couple neighborhoods to a really exclusive little town. Big houses, rich people, we expected full-size candy bars at every stop.

Well, I think only about 1 out of 4 houses even answered the door. And those that did were more likely to drop a single piece of gum in the bag than they were anything impressive. Plus, with only like 10 houses per block (instead of our 25), it was a lot of walking! We never went back. Generosity comes from places where people know their neighbors.

I still work like you do too. I don’t try to do business with the biggest companies, biggest names, because they’re on everyone’s hit list. Those deals are wound so tight that the big co. is the only one making any money - nothing for their partners. I also stay away from the smallest ones - they’re the easiest deals to get, but the most risky too. I fly under the radar of the big guys (and my big competitors) and everyone wins.

And, (sorry to ramble, but I think this is an important topic) I ordered a board from a shaper friend a couple of weeks ago. I have a garage full of boards, know full-well how to make my own, and really don’t need it. But he happened to have a few 10’1"y’s left and was saying that he really wanted to make them for people who would appreciate the work.

I started asking about one - he even offered to sell me the blank so I could shape it myself. I said no, no, I want him to make me one. So, as a representation of the old-school materials, I told him just make it big & flat. Volan glass, cutlaps, glassed on fin, no leash loop. Coke bottle green.

Its at the glasser’s now. I’ll pick it up sometime next week. I have no idea what its going to cost, I’ve not asked & he’s not said. I’m not really interested in that right now. I’m not a rich guy, but I just wanted one last board like this. And I knew he could use the order (& deposit) right before Christmas. And yeah, I brought him a 6-pack too, on the 24th, can’t let that old tradition die.

I haven’t been this stoked waiting for a board in years - and I don’t really even know what its going to be like!

Long live the craftsmen! Besides making surfboards I am also an artist and am saddened to see how many artists have given up on craftsmanship in favor of the search for some trendy gimmick. I did have the fortune of living years in Venice Italy. One person there explained it’s magic to me- “It is the last entirely hand made city.”

You know, the better it is…the better it is.

And high price doesn’t necessarily connotate quality. The guy around here who builds the biggest, priciest trophy houses is a hack. While some of the inexpensive guys manage to put out quality.

Hype, as fouund in the house biz and the surf biz, dictate a lot.

On the other hand, I avoid doing house carpentry work when I can, yacht work always, and when a commercial fisherman needs something done I do that any time. Their attitude is ‘You know what it needs, send me to get what you need to do it, and I’ll stay out of your hair, or what little is left of it’.

Somebody trusts you like that, with their livlihood, their life’s savings and quite possibly their life - period, well, you’re not gonna do anything foolish or second rate.

And sometimes you don’t give 'em a bill…

doc…

   Howzit RichMc, Funny you should bring this up, yesterday I started restoring an almost life sized wooden dolphin for a gentleman across the street. It's in pretty bad shape since the glued joints have split and there is some wood rot. Making epoxy putty with milled fibers and Q-sel for filler,striping off all the paint and then will repaint. Still haven't figured out how much to charge, but the guy has $ and is not scared to spend it.Aloha,Kokua

Richard, we’ve both seen each others work and you know how I feel on this subject.

There was a post on Surfer Mag.com a while bach about a certain shaper being one of the all time greatest craftsmen, why the hell does he ask me to do multi stringer shapes for him and install his tail and nose blocks if he is so fucking great? Take the sander to the blank, leave the stringer an 1/8 inch high and collect his overly paid check, the lable owners are completely clueless, it beats the living crap out of me !

Richard, Thanks for the insightful words.

I think there will always be people who love to work with their hands, and will craft beautiful objects because they love what they do. The craftsman who makes a living at it is the one who has to make the tough choices. He has to sometimes make something simply because it puts food on the table. And there is great honor in that alone. However, the work he “loves” to do may have to be set aside from time to time.

As a career woodworker for many years, who has gone on to another career, I am amused when I hear people say, “Well, they sure don’t make them like they used to”. The fact is that there are many craftsmen waiting to make them like they used to, but there are few people who can appreciate the difference, or are willing to pay for it.

My hat’s off to anyone who takes the task before them, and shepherds it to the end, making it the best they possibly can. Doug

“Time doesn’t matter. The praise of others doesn’t matter. Money doesn’t matter. The only thing that matters is the task in front of you, and to that you give everything.” Unknown

Hi Richard -

Obviously each of your works are one of a kind, absolutely first rate and worth every penny.

Rich, arrogant yuppie chumps are a dime a dozen.

Just ask a waitress.

Forgive me for a moment for stepping on the soapbox, but you happen to touch on something VERY near and dear to my heart.

Growing up, I always believed I would be a craftsman for a living. I envisioned myself a musician, a luthier, a furniture maker, an artist, or a wordsmith. I took a liberal arts education believing such a thing was still relevant in this nation. It turned out not to be.

It costs a minimum of $7,000 per month to live modestly and raise children in San Diego (my home town). MINIMUM. How many boards would I have to shape and sell to live? If a small industrial space costs $1,000 per month and at small numbers the raw materials that go into a board cost me $100 - $150 per board, how many $350 boards do I need? What about accounting costs, banking costs, advertising costs, etc.? 50 boards a month? 75? A couple of hours to shape a board, a couple to glass. 200 hours of work a month, 300? That is, of course, if you could find a market for that many boards.

Buying sufboards SHOULD be a major investment. It is a major investment from the craftsman. Do we sacrifice the American craftsman so that 14 year old groms in OC can have a half dozen boards made by prison labor in a totalitarian Asian nation? Yes it hurts to pay $1000 for a board, but that is what it honestly represents. Why must we sacrifice our nation so that consumers can have the cheapest doo-dads? Don’t these consumers want to make a living too? Don’t they want the opportunity to live a rich and rewarding life putting their soul into making things of lasting beauty and function? Why is cheap consumer goods the overriding moral imperative in America? No one is suggesting that the craftsman have the opportunity to live like a rock star, just live.

I’ll end with this example from other crafts. A good friend of mine writes beautiful and witty novels. However, he is completely crushed and considers himself a failure because he can’t make a living writing. I try to tell him that his inability to make a living has nothing to do with his craft. Making a living from writing requires the ability to sell a manuscript to a publisher, an agent, a PR firm, and Barnes & Noble, not the ability to write well

There would be no Hemmingway in today’s America. He would never have been able to write novels as a part-time, free lance war correspondent and manage to do the marketing and schmoozing necessary to have his book “placed” here at home. Had Hemmingway lived today he would have had to work as a manager at Wal Mart and dream of life as an author. At least he would have had cheap disposable surfboards from China!

IMHO, handshaping and the craft side of surfboards is the only way. As for the pop outs or machine shapes, no way . They have their niche in the market and some like them. I won’t spend my money on them . Hand crafted

Quote:
It costs a minimum of $7,000 per month to live modestly and raise children in San Diego (my home town). MINIMUM. How many boards would I have to shape and sell to live?

First, I’m going to have to question your $7k figure. I live 1/4 mile from the beach, just south of San Francisco in Pacifica which can’t be any cheaper than San Diego. And my wife and I and two kids live what I’d consider to be a modestly comfortable life on much less than the figure you quote. We could do it on $4k even. This would be sacrificing lots of the things that Americans are convinced they need in life, but none of those things are “modest”.

Second, can someone post the numbers of the fixed costs to make surfboards in a small business setting? I know we don’t really know what blanks will cost when this all shakes out so let’s use the numbers from before Clark closed (for either clark or walker blank) and assume either future suppliers will be priced similarly or retail prices for finished boards will rise by an equal amount that blank costs do. Let’s also skip having to rent a place to shape. I’m thinking of the home shaping shack kind of set up.

Let’s use longboards (which represent over 50% of surfboard sales). And let’s use typical boring longboard and assume that multiple stringer, fancy glass job boards sell for enough more to justify their added cost/time compared to basic boards. So… can someone fill in these numbers:

Blank (typical 9’0" single stringer):

Consumables (sand paper, tools, maintenance, etc.) per board:

Glass shop’s charge to shaper for standard glass job:

Fin box(es) and fin(s):

Anything I’m forgetting:

In other words, what does it cost in money for a shaper with connections to a glass shop and blank supplier to shape a board and have it back at his place ready to hand over to a customer. I’m guessing something around $400. Am I wildly off?

If so, and longboards can be sold directly to customers for between $600-700 easily (hell, even shops would buy at that price since they sell longboards retail for $800-1000 these days, even before clark shut down), then why couldn’t surfboard Craftsmen live a comfortable lifestyle? Is $200-300 a day for shaping one board not enough to live a “modest”, fulfilling lifestyle in California?

I sure hope my guess at the numbers aren’t wildly off because I hope this type of shaper survives. There seem to be many, many shapers doing something similar to the above. And all of them have backlogs of orders for weeks if not months. Are these guys starving? Do we need to pay them more? If so, I want to hear about it!

Wouldn’t it be great is there was a country somewhere that elevated true craftsmen to the status of National Treasure?

Naw really! If you want to distinguish yourself so you will attract the bucks to have a modest living, maybe ‘craftsmanship’ is the ploy to use. But then, a better title for this discussion might be ‘Dollars: Worthy of Excellence?’ My answer is ‘No’.

Hi Slim, we live on about US$2k per month for 12 people, and still buy wetties, build boards, and go surfing, and eat like Kings but we don’t buy shoes, new clothes, or toys! We also bake our own bread, buy in massive bulk to save money (like a 44 gallon drum of molasses, huge sacks of flour, milk powder and so on, some of which is from farming suppliers, also grow our own herbs and pick windfall fruit, sometimes scoring 800 to 1000 pounds of oranges which we then eat our way though in 2 weeks!

Regards,

Roy

PS sorry to digress, interesting thread

.

Quote:

If so, and longboards can be sold directly to customers for between $600-700 easily (hell, even shops would buy at that price since they sell longboards retail for $800-1000 these days, even before clark shut down), then why couldn’t surfboard Craftsmen live a comfortable lifestyle? Is $200-300 a day for shaping one board not enough to live a “modest”, fulfilling lifestyle in California?

Lets see…

$200 net per day x 21 work days a month = $4200 per month. Self employment taxes mean that you will likely pay very close to 30% of your actual income in taxes, or about $1,000. I don’t know about Pacifica, but living in a coastal town in San Diego and renting an actual house where you could shape boards and not have a landlord send you packing averages about $2200 per month. Or you could buy a median priced home in San Deigo (definitely NOT near the coast) for $512K, where your mortgage would be aprox. $2800 per month, property taxes aprox. $450 per month, and maintenance would probably eat about another $150 per month (usually in big chunks, not evenly spread out). $500K buys you a home with bars on the windows in San Diego or a development home that would NEVER allow you to off gass polyester resin or use power tools. If you are self employed, medical insurance for a family of 4 usually runs about $300 per month. That leaves you with the fat sum of $700 per month to raise your kids on or -$400 if you want to buy a home.

No bookkeeping costs? No tax preparer at the end of the year? No advertising? No telephones? No web site? OK, if you think you can do it that way. American consumerism, I guess you would call all that. And don’t get sick, or slack off on your board making schedule, or be underpriced by a Chinese factory. Forget about taking a vacation with your kids, you won’t have the money or the time.

I have been working with small businesses for the last decade. Unfortunately I see the realities constantly. If you are doing it on one board a day without the benefit of some outside help you are WAY ahead of most small businesses. I don’t mean to be negative, but just realistic. Honestly, I hope you are doing it. I wish many could. It was possible in California when I was growing up, and I want it to be possible now. Good luck to you, and I sincerely wish you success.

Quote:
$200 net per day x 21 work days a month = $4200 per month.

You could always work more days, or use my $300 figure instead and have $6300 instead. One’s wife can always have a job too you know… FYI, 3bd homes in Pacifica rent for about $2k, sell for about $650-750k.

Quote:
Self employment taxes mean that you will likely pay very close to 30% of your actual income in taxes

One could always “cheat” and forget some of the income one was paid in cash. (they’d just spend it on more ‘smart bombs’ anyway).

I hope one-a-day type shapers don’t die off!

Dear Marabout,

If you are producing 1 board a day you are not small time. Most small time board builder make considerable less than that. You would be lucky to produce more than one per week.

Roy,

Do you live in a commune? I would love to hear about it if you do?

Sincerely,

Troy

FYI, I wasn’t talking about myself. I was just thinking that one a day should be totally possible for an experienced shaper. (remember, they are ‘outsourcing’ the glassing). Jonny Rice in Santa Cruz told me he does just one a day and he was basically the kind of enterprise I was thinking of when I set up my hypothetical. He has a “shaping shack” at his house, sends them out for glassing, and charges $650 for a 9’0", and then adds on from there for tail blocks, fancy color jobs, and other modifications. I hope he is making a couple hundred off each board because he totally deserves at least that much. He could easily raise his prices $100 and I bet not lose any business because longboards in surfshops are at least $800 now (including his).

Roy, your lifestyle is very attractive to me. Sadly I married a total “city girl” and she’d never go for anything even 10% as wild and free as what you’ve got going. So until I either break free from her spell or at least get the kids out the door, I’m stuck.