EPS Alaia made from $9.50 Home Depot foam

General Discussion
1

I picked up a piece of 4' x 8' x 1" thick EPS insulating foam from Home Depot for $9.50 the otehr day, with the intention of making an alaia out of it. I'm hoping to achieve the same performance as in my paulownia alaias but with more float so paddling isn't so difficult. This foam appears to be about 1.5 lb. EPS, but I'm not quite sure.

 

First I cut the foam piece in half and glued it together with Gorilla Glue to make an 8' x 24" x 2" thick flat blank...

 

 

After the glue dried I traced the outline of one of my existing alaias on it, a 6'2" peanut shape, and cut it out with a handsaw.

 

I decided to do the exact same shape so I could compare the two as far as build and materials go. In the future I will probably change the planshape as well if this build works. I will also likely get EPS surfboard blanks instead of using HD foam, but for a cheap fun experiment you can't beat the price!

 

In this photo I've begun creating my bottom contours, as you can see by the rolled belly I've shaped into the bottom of the nose of the board.

 

Here I've drawn on my guide for the single concave and rail chines that will run through the bottom two-thirds of the board. At this point I ran into a little trouble as this EPS is really difficult to shape a concave into. The foam tears really easily and I can't seem to get an even concave contour yet. I quit while I was ahead yesterday, and am going to try a thin piece of eggcrate foam with 150 grit glued to it with spray adhesive. I'm hoping this will work better but I'd love to hear some suggesstions from the Sway's crew. This is the first time I've used EPS and I can definitely tell the quality of this foam is not ideal for surfboards.

 

My friend Slashzilla is going to help me with my first epoxy glass job when I get to that point. I will be using innegra and 4 oz cloth, with carbon fiber wrapped rails to help control flex. Should be interesting!

2

Very cool idea, keep us updated on the progress and eventual ride report.  How much glue did you use to pancake the 2 pieces together?

 

What tool are you using that is tearing the foam?

3

I didn’t really use enough glue, it was a medium size bottle. I think (hope) it’ll work well enough. I’ve been using a sanding block w/ 150 and the new Foam EZ sanding pad. The edges at the angle point rips the foam. I hope a flat wide piece of eggcrate foam slightly bowed by my hand in the middle will work better.

4

how much carbon and how are you gunna use it ? how much flex are you hoping for , more or less than the timber ??? what about the end weight, are you looking for a lighter version for any perf reason ??? cool…

5

use a piece of eps shaped to the curve you want and glue sandpaper to it with spray adhesive( non solvent one). i cant see the point in making an alaia in foam tho.  wats it gunna do better than a piece of wood

6

Fletch, i think this is a great idea and Im keen to see how it goes, so I can copy it.

 You couldve used that cat for weight rather than those diving weights.

 No offence but its a BIG pussy!

7

[quote="$1"] how much carbon and how are you gunna use it ? how much flex are you hoping for , more or less than the timber ??? what about the end weight, are you looking for a lighter version for any perf reason ??? cool... [/quote]

 

I'm not 100% sure yet, my buddy Slashzilla has been doing EPS/Epoxy builds for a while and has used all the cool new materials like innegra and CF, so I'll let him show me the ropes on that. I'm hoping to approxiamte the flex I get in my paulownia alaia, in a board that is potentially lighter (though that's not the main reason for this build), but that more importantly floats better. If you've ever tried to paddle a paulownia alaia you know what I mean here.

8

[quote="$1"] how much carbon and how are you gunna use it ? how much flex are you hoping for , more or less than the timber ??? what about the end weight, are you looking for a lighter version for any perf reason ??? cool... [/quote]

 

I'm not 100% sure yet, my buddy Slashzilla has been doing EPS/Epoxy builds for a while and has used all the cool new materials like innegra and CF, so I'll let him show me the ropes on that. I'm hoping to approxiamte the flex I get in my paulownia alaia, in a board that is potentially lighter (though that's not the main reason for this build), but that more importantly floats better. If you've ever tried to paddle a paulownia alaia you know what I mean here.

9

[quote="$1"]

use a piece of eps shaped to the curve you want and glue sandpaper to it with spray adhesive( non solvent one). i cant see the point in making an alaia in foam tho.  wats it gunna do better than a piece of wood

[/quote]

 

This is a good idea, I'll give it a try. As for how it's better than a wood alaia? You've obviously never tried to paddle a wood alaia, they don't float very well. The main reason for this build is to achieve the performance characteristics of a paulownia alaia in a board that floats and paddles much better than a wood board.

10

[quote="$1"]

Fletch, i think this is a great idea and Im keen to see how it goes, so I can copy it.

 You couldve used that cat for weight rather than those diving weights.

 No offence but its a BIG pussy!

[/quote]

 

That's not even the big cat! The cat in the pic has a sister that is noticeable larger...and no offense taken!

11

 

Time’s up…

That was a limited time offer… Something for you E.F. to have fun with…

I never said a word…lol… I’ll swear in court…

12

Hey Fletch!  Keep going and let us know how yours turns out.  I made two alaia's a couple years ago that turned out pretty good.

First One - 2" EPS (EPS is what you have not XPS) 16"x8' - I put concave deck and concave on bottom 1/3 from the nose out the tail, rails were thined to       about 1/2".  I was able to ride it (I usually only ride 9' or longer boards) prone not standing.  It paddled very easy and caught waves easy.  But, when I turned more than about 45 deg. it would start sliding.

Second one - 1" EPS 16"x8' - very slight concave similar to #1, rails thined to 1/4".  It is much more flexable and harder (for me) to catch waves.  But... it has much better control for turning.  Very little sliding with this one.

I've used CF in my boards very early on and found that I did't like it's effect on the board (usually snapped and hot).  I now use S2 glass and RR epoxy.  The last 20 plus boards that I've made are all 1 to 2 lb. EPS with balsa vac.bagged on.  4 oz. s glass over and under the balsa.  I just got my hands on about 60 board feet of palownia and milled it to 3/32" to cover my boards. 

You'll find that you can make an alaia that is lighter weight and may be better than a wood alaia.  It just takes a lot of experimenting with the thickness and shape. 

Have fun and keep us posted!

Les

 

13

I've made a couple boards out of home depot pink foam, and if it is the same as the foam that I bought, it is actually XPS (extruded rather than expanded, polystyrene) foam.  If I remember right, the density is 1.3 lb.  The boards that I made with it did not last long (granted they were also my first glass jobs), and most developed huge cancerous air bubbles between the foam and the glass.  All in all, I found that it was actually cheaper to buy a 24"x24"x96" block of 2 lb EPS foam, and use a hot wire foam cutter to put some rocker in the blanks.  I don't mean to discourage you, because I think the alaia idea with that foam is pretty damn cool.  Just letting you know my experience.  Good luck!

14

Whoa! Thats some seriously detailed knowlege, thanks for sharing it. I figured I might have needed to do a little more with the gluing…

15

Nice! Those sound like great experimental boards. They were both 8' long? It seems that with the very limited rocker in alaias that length might be a little harder to surf than a shorter board. Very interesting how the thinner foiled board (1/4" at rails?) was better as far as maneuverability. I'm not sure how I will make my rails, but I'm thinking I might go thinner than I was originally planning now. Also interesting about the Carbon Fiber. I've never used it but have heard mixed messages about it.

Also really interesting to hear about the thin milled paulownia. From what I've gethered so far about using it for alaias and handplanes, it seems like the ultimate wood for a veneer on surfboards. Can you PM me and let me know where you got it? I'm having a hard time getting Brad from Applecore Stringers to respond to my emails. He's the only guy I know that MAY have paulownia since the Paulownia barn went under...

16

Yes, both 8'.  I surf longboards so if I was going to stand on these I thought I'd need the length.  The thin one flexes quite a bit and that was the problem taking off with it.  It would bend and push against the water.  I finally found that if I paddled closer to the nose and when the wave caught me I'd push the nose down to catch the wave.   From then on it was great.  I think the thinner rails helped maneuverability and control.

I use carbon fiber for my ukuleles but not on surfboards anymore.  If you want to make your rails bullet proof I've heard kevlar works but is hard to work with.

Yes, I think that Palownia is the wood to use...it's just difficult getting it here in the states.  Two years ago there was a large tree that was cut down in Oregon.  I got two 8'x10"x2" pieces.  Took for ever, here in central Cal., for it to dry!  Then last year a friend was going to be stationed in Tenn. so I asked him to see if he could find some for me.  He brought back about 60 board feet of it!  His next stop was Barstow so it dried real fast!  I guess you just have to be inventive to get the stuff at this point.  Not sure where you live but if you have friends in the southern states or are planning a trip there check it out.

 

17

Alright, got a little more time to work on this project and am just about ready to glass this thing. Here are some updated build pics:

Based on advice from this thread, I went ahead and made an EPS foam sanding block for my concave, it worked great!

Completed concave, done utilizing the sanding block pictured above.

 

View from the nose.

 

Deck all cleaned up, prior to putting deck channels in.

 

I first thought about putting in thumb channels like Stretch does on his boards, mainly because you grab the rails a lot when turing an alaia. However the more I thought about it the more I thought these channels would help engage the rail in the face of the wave more, giving the water flowing over the deck a few more curves to hug to thus providing more engagement and control...we'll see if it works but it looks pretty cool!

 

Another view of the deck channels.

 

I have already spackled the board and am just about ready to glass. After consulting with Slashzilla on how to glass it, I think I'm going to go with the following:

1. Glass Innegra and 4 oz on the deck.

2. Vac bag carbon fiber on the rails, lapping it about 1/4" over the top and bottom of the rails to create a C-Truss.

3. Glass the bottom with 4 oz, lapping the deck over the CF.

4. Depending on the flex, maybe add another 4 oz layer to the deck for added stiffness.

 

The board is really light and pretty floppy unglassed. I want to get a nice springy flex like a paulownig alaia, any thoughts, suggestions on how to achieve this level of flex?

 

18

I would suggest weighting down the deck when glassing, to put in a slight rocker. It might be a little hard to dial in the first time, but your glasser should have a good feel for predicting the right springback. Good work.

sickdog

19

dunno if that much cloth and carbon will give you much flex at all…would minimise the amount of carbon, but should be an interesting ride…keep posting pics and ride report …good stuff…

20

Love this project.  How did the 150 grit with egg crate work out?  Better than the sanding block?  I’ve never shaped that HD stuff before, so I’m curious how it handle different techniques.