Finless Bat


Appreciate your point of view Honolulu. Channels on a finless board
do act as fins in a sense. But for me it’s the thrill of experimenting
with different ideas and concepts. I think many would agree that
experimenting with seemingly pointless ideas is a seed for innovation.
Even though there’s that high possibility that the experiment
completely fails or is heavily scrutinized by others, it’s worth a try.

Very true that channels and complex shapes are a sander’s
nightmare, but I’m my own sander and the effort isn’t wasted. I’ll
throw some fins on when my knees and back gives out, till then I’m
happy being out of control =)


Thanks for the encouragement Herb!  I’d love to check out your pics.

100% stoke makes everything work better.


couldn’t have said it better,brose.


stoked on life !




Beautiful board surfpac, I have just recently discovered Derek Hynd and his finless boards. Those videos of him at Jbay have really shown me the possibilities of experimentation.

I am planning on having a go at shaping a finless board, very excited about it. Although as someone posted, I think my lack of surfing ability will restrict my shaping success (I have a hard enough time on a conventional board)

Does anyone have an idea what purpose of the little cut out on the tail of Hynd’s board is? Im thinking as he is going right at Jbay, is it for added grip on the face? I would like to aim at getting as close as possible to Hynd’s board. Does anyone have any more info in it?

Homero Naldinho a Brazilian guy that was not sold to the system .... one of the first Brazilian shapers........ a genius who is not in the magazines .... living at the margins of society.....One of his many experiments is the finless surfboard....Big respect for this guy !

The photo attached has a center fin......maybe coz its a longboard......I couldnt find a photo of his finless shortboard, but it has the same sistem and zero fins......Ive seen a few guys surfing this board and they ride It standing......not sitting.......

Dont know if someone did it before him......Ive never seen this system before.....

hope you guys like it and keep it going.....most of people are afraid to go out off the trail.......


So what happened to Herb’s finless revolution?

Last post was back in April and plenty of water passed under the bridge since then.

Horsemouth, thanks for the pics, esp the one of the board.

my first foam board I rode finless alot was a bat tail, deep double concaves and it went ok and am just about to try a much more extreme version...some of you here have already seen it ....




lots and lots goin on here, will be very interesting to see how it performs....

[IMG][/IMG]  heres santa going no fins on the first bat tail....


like the board you did, good onya for going for is it riding ?  


Back to what you were saying about round/soft channels vs. hard edges, I just want to confirm, this is the same theory as hulls, right? Displacement hulls move throught the water like a sailboat and have a “maximum” hull speed. As the hull moves faster, the friction sucks the vessel into the water, thereby slowing it down but getting better traction.

If this is correct, would you say a hull contour allow you to surf higher on the face? In my mind, I can see the channels and concave helping the board get up and stay on a plane, but give too much lift when you try setting the rail , causing you to spin out. I could also see the suction of a hull helping in less than glassy conditions. Would soft rails offer more hold, the way 50/50 rails on a noserider hold the tail in by aloowing water to wrap onto the deck? I know that has more to do with counter balancing the riders wieght, but there is no doubt that more board is in the face of the wave as a result.

Has anyone here riden a hull finless?

Hey Idler,

I read your reply about the low pressure zones created by channels and just from the limited (self taught) knowledge of the channels/concaves on the finless boards, I have to agree.. However, I did something similar on an inductued board recently and figured out that drilling holes at a 45 degree angle from the bottom to the top (the angle from the bottom is towards the nose), rather than creating a vacume and turbulence under the board, it actually lessens the pressure that develops that also creates turnbulence under the board. Think about it, if there is a way that this pressure can be relieved, the water flow SHOULD be more even and fluid... However, doesn't this tend to make the board track? The people that have tried out my inducted quad have said, "it felt like a turbo boost kicked in but it seems to want to track"..... Here's a shot of the bottom that might help illustrate what I trying to say.. What's your thoughts?




ok, this has given me another idea for a finless board but I havent riddne my latest version yet...I better write my ideas down before they get lost haha....great thread and hope it keeps going.....I havent ridden a hull finless but my Fish -Finger is totally flat except for a very subtle rolled vee thru the nose, approx the first 10" and it is very slippery and challenging, doesnt want to get on any rail ( which have no edges, totally soft for hold into wave face which it does quite well ) but wondering if some rolled deep channells would allow sufficient traction to get it on rail and perform a bit more traditional turns..placemnt and depth would be critical , sounds similar to whats already done.....might have to just shape one and see.....


link of my Fish-Finger in action if interested...not totally finless but super fun, slide and glide just the same....

just rode my new board which is a hybrid shape that can be ridden with fins, tiny small fins or even keels , you choose your own adventure...I rode it the other day with no fins...too slippery and all over the place but I put some tiny 2" flexy plastic fins in it and the thing came alive, so much fun...could fly down the line and do spins, make late-ish drops, it planed well and held better than I hoped....many positives in this little baby, lots going on but couldnt be more stoked after that sesh.....



I know this thread is about finless but I think its relevant and I am not really trying to go finless, more trying to take this stuff where it takes me for fun, for learning and just coz it is a different way to enjoy riding a wave, dont think we all have to have fins or no fins, or whatever, my little trip and its fun so far...hahaha....

have you finished the board, any pics, ride report ???


pics of finless ( almost finless ) are hard to get right, but you can see I am mid slide 360, leaning forward to get tail spinning, can see the big bat tail outta the water when spinning backwards... small and crappy  waves are now getting me super stoked too......

Great suff, moving forward with the design.

 I love the pattern , is it a spray or a leopard print fabric?  Looks great.

my kids had free reign on this one, 7 yr old daughter wanted to do snow leopard ( like off Kung-FuPanda ) so thats it...spray and posca combo, all done by my kids...and yep, design is moving forward, its a real personal one as nobody else is giving me feedback ( nobody else has ridden them nor game too, except one guy, he has done a full review fro Smorgasboarder Magazine coming out in Jan , should be interesting to see what he thought of it, especially as a middle aged intermediate surfer , time will tell I guess ) just me riding, shaping, designing, all for my fun, not for sales or anything other than to make my surfing as much fun as possible and to see where I can take it....loving it..., either way, I am enjoying this board and am unsure of what I'll be doing to modify it, but will think of some adjsutments, I am sure...

here's another pic...backhand is so hard, this is on the original that I made, here I am mid 360 slide spin....


I made an alaia with really sharp chines and it spun out like crazy. I sanded the chines down to rolled and it got much more grippy with better directionality. This was counter-intuitive for me at first but when you imagine the water running diagonally across the bottom of the board it's easier to see the hard chines creating a release point for the water, thus the board spinning out. The roll creates more surface area and suction as the water traverses the bottom of the board, leading to better control.


Honolulu, I don't get why you even post here on Sway's, all you do is complain about other peoples curiosity and innovation (just like on my ASymmetrical thread). If you don't like it, just keep your mouth shut! This place is a forum to learn and express creativity, which doesn't hurt anyone. Maybe you need a reminder of the first thing my parents taught me when I learned to talk, "If you don't have anything nice to say don't say anything at all."

my board is different coz I ride it with 2 tiny little flexy fins so I am getting a tiny bit of hold there so its a different ball game really, I am not trying to go totally finless, doing what feels fun for me and just running with it for now, although I am inspired by some finless surfing and craft for sure but just kind of surfing them and seeing what it wants to do , just having as much fun with it as I can, not tyring to surf the standard way but without fins at all, looking to do never been done stuff on waves and shaping boards to help me do that.....



super deep double with the big chines means I have very little drag, lotsa lift, it planes so well, and with almost no fins and super square hard rails, it releases well and with that combo it is sooo much fun for what I want to do....each to their own but this is exciting for me and I have shaped and ridden alot of different stuff, definitely some gold in here somewhere.....      

Mark, Id love to have a go on your boards Mark, I know theyre not for sale so Im not offering any money !!

(Mark, goto th SEARCH at the top right, type in LESS fins and its the 3rd one down). see PM