Fish Questions

I plan on shaping a fish based on the Lis template thats around, I ride a 5’3" blackball beater fish and really enjoy it so I want to have something more durable like a 6’ board from a clarkfoam 62C. I think I have most of it figured out, apart from the rails and the Toe-in and Cant. Old school fish seem to have no can and no toe in. Modern twin fish from Rich Pavel and Mandala seem to have a small amount of toe-in, can anyone say how much ? Also is there any cant ?

The rails I’m not sure of I was thinking of something like this straight through - see attached.

I’m low-average ability surfing beach breaks.

Thanks in advance

my mandala 5’8 has straight keels, no toe, no cant…

flat rocker and flat deck makes for easy paddling. straight ahead keels make for very very fun carvy feeling on long point waves. i eliminated hard edges on my board, it only has 50/50 rails the whole way through and surfs wonderfully from 3’ - as big as it gets before i whimp out. just remember to surf off your front foot, it get super squirely off your back foot but you loose speed. pump and trim withf ront foot weighted and turn with yo back foot.

Toe= 1/4"

Cant= 6-8 degrees


my 5’ 8" lis style fish has 5 x 9" ply keels foiled both sides toed in 1/8th canted 2 degrees and it surfs just fine standup or kneeling! This was shaped from a 69A ( a bit more room for error!)

here’s mine, for the 80th time…

my 5’6"…no toe…no cant…5x9’s…fun…fun…fun.


kirk , how far up are the fins on that and does it stick (more) through a turn than a board with the fins farther back? can you turn it around on a dime in other words?

I have a modern six foot Steve Lis with the Gephart twins. No cant. No toe in. Mike

redrails, the fins are only 8" from the tips. the perspective on that picture makes them look farther up than they really are.

btw, nice avatar. that’s one of my favorite paintings by Tim Ward.


clean shape,i like it.

Kirk, where did you get those fins?


got them at Fiberglass Hawaii in Santa Cruz.


They look super nice. I think I will give them a call. Thanks.

lol,I can remember when not too long ago that NO ONE and I mean NO ONE built a fish.For that matter, know one knew how.There were people trying to cop dims of my bros boards in the late 90s at contests here and abroad.Not no name builders, but some of the biggest names in the industry todate.

Nowdays, everyone is an expert…I hate to tell them how wrong most of them are built.

Tim Stamps watches me (and my bro) closely.He asks the right Qs,and is on the right track.

SB in SB knows,we have paid our dues…the rest? Someone asked awhile back why the fish faded out back in the 70s…for the same reasons it will fade again.Herb

Thanks everyone some beautiful board pictures.

The answer to the rail question is in this thread;search_string=fish%20rails;#118314