- what about belly just in the part of the nose that is slapping water when you paddle? i'm thinking that some belly there could help with chop but not really effect the ride once to your feet.
- if the belly is brought back past there to part of the hull that is actually in the water when up and riding, i'm thinking there would be all kinds of effects. easier to roll onto a rail being one. are there others?
i'm planning a minigun / semigun (8'0") and have been thinking that some forward belly may be a good thing. my shaping skills leave a BUNCH to be desired so simplicity is a big consideration so i don't screw things up. but, i think i could pull off some vee without major drama.
A good heavy glass job with the v or belly helps with the chop. I guess the important things to know are: how much v, where to place it, and what is a good healthy weight. Keep us posted with your gun progress, I love gun discussions.
I was under the impression that some panel vee under the nose was pretty much standard for paddle-in guns, along with some kind of vee in the tail as well. I’ve only built a few, and that’s what I’ve done with good feedback. You might also want to look into the “reverse vee” idea, which is (as I understand it) vee that starts somewhere around where the entry rocker ends, and ends around the front fins. Popular for a while, but I don’t know to what extent they’re being used today.
On my step-ups, or “east coast guns” I’ve been doing a bit of panel or rolled vee in the entry, into a shallow single to double, fading into a concaved vee, to panel vee out the back. Makes sizeable surf very managable, but still provides a bit of a shortboard feel. These boards are in the 7’0 range.
Reverse V to double concave through the fins works very well, I've done lots of those since about '95. It's a relatively simple bottom to shape, you don't need a lot of reverse (3/16''-1/4'' is plenty). Take it off the outer edge first and re-define the bottom of the rail line; it will actually straighten the rail curve a little from entry to drive area. You can blocksand to blend to centerline if you don't feel up to doing that with planer. At 8'0'', you're getting into big-board territory, keeping it really simple and just doing a slight panel V throughout, fading to flat right off the tail, will work good also.
I’m almost finished working on a 7-2 semi gun type board. I put a healthy belly up front to help smooth the paddling. I also have a bit more rocker in the first 6 -12 inches than most of my boards. I made the bottom tri-plane with the sides pulled up like a hull, but without the rounded bottom. The belly up front blends into the 3 planes, then it’s a slight vee out from where the single fin box will be. 60/40 tucked under rails in the middle blended into hard edge down rail in the tail. Trying to incorporate what I like and know work for me, with some of the things I see here that work for others. I’m hoping that I have this board setup right so I can stay on the back half, and that it has the right amount of length and rocker to work in waves from waist high to DOH.
I’m not finished with the glassing, but I’ll post shots when I’m done.
I think that the belly or vee under the nose probably works best for a board you don’t have to worry about stepping up front. I’ve found that on the boards I’ve ridden, belly up front will slow you down if you put pressure on the nose. The last board I made has very little rocker and a flat bottom all the way from nose to tail. That board paddles very good if I keep back just a bit, and it glides along so well.
I used to go Joe Kuala’s shop whenever I was on Kauai, and he had a good amount of vee just after the back fin on every board. I don’t remember what he did up front, but the vee in the tail was very obvious. That’s has had an influence on what I do.
thanks for the input everyone. bye the way, i'm 6'0" x 175lbs x not so great shape and wish i could get in the water more. i'm pretty set on a 5 fin. to surf as a quad or 5 fin...
TonyLion, it will be 1.5 lb block foam / bamboo skins ('cause that's what i got to work with). i'm thinking i may have to build in some weight in key places. but, Lavarat told me that the weight would come on it's own and that there would be no need to deliberately build it in. i respect his opinion 'cause he's got way more experience with this and surfs the waves that i hope to with this board... i'll have to PM Resinhead regarding glass schedule since he's done a few guns in this build style and his stuff seems to work really well too.
NJ_Surfer: that sounds good. maybe a little complicated for my meager skills. after this build, i hope to do a 7' ish too so, i'll keep that in mind.
MikeD, (mike_stands_for_money_and_the_D_is_for_diamonds)(1:05), "Take it off the outer edge first and re-define the bottom of the rail line" that's exactly what i needed.that line really clarified how to go about it, thanks... what do you think about taking the V through the fins and adding the double after. so, double within V. this may be getting a little complicated but seems like a good option??? my main concern with concaves is making them symetrical, even, and flowing. i'm also a little gun-shy since my first try at concaves went all bad. maybe it's time to just pull up my panties and give it a go again.
Pridmore, yah, i guess it's a legitimate gun. not a full Rhino Chaser but still a "gun". i just didn't want to come on here talking about a "gun" and have someone say "ha, it's not a gun 'til it's at least 9'6" you wimp!" =) ... this will be for when the beaches around here are as big as i care to paddle into... i liked the video you posted recently of your almost finless. looked like you were having fun! some interesting stuff coming from your shop lately... i'll definitely post pics. i hope to start this soon. fall is upon us! on this side of the rock at least.
Sharkcountry, that sounds interesting, i'd like to see pics for sure. not enough gun stuff on Sways. more is better. the way you described the 3 panels makes sense, and you reminded me of Griffin describing his longboard bottoms... also interesting about slowing down when you step forward onto the "belly".
Just doing a slight panel V all the way, then adding the double, will be fine on an 8'0''. The hardest part of reverse V is blending the forward V into the flat ahead of fins, so you would avoid that. On your first gun, keeping it simple isn't a bad idea.
My guns have an entry v to the tune of about 3/8 inch. it helps on big choppy days when a lot of water is moving around. The draw back is that it slows you down a bit when paddling. Something about that big 7" nose rocker with a vee in it makes it operate like a boat. it's a very positive feeling...very secure. But it's not as fast of a paddle as a longboard with a flat or slightly concave nose.
When it's a clean day I still go with the flat entry to single concave under the front foot to the modified vee / double barrel concave under back foot...to vee out the tail. Tried and true!