Just making up a basic Fred tool. Got a joiner to cut a 30 degree bevel as JC talks about in Shaping 101. When I got it home I noticed the angle was actually at 60 degrees. Looked at a few pictures of others DIY tools, as below, and noticed the their angle is at 60 degrees also. Confused. Shouldn’t that be a lower 30 degree angle or are they measuring 30 degrees back from straight up and down 90. Any help appreciated.
The angle from vertical looks like 30 degrees, from the bottom of the tool 60 degrees. You want the tool to cut 45 or 60 degrees to the vertical rail, any less angle and you’ll cut past the rail centerline and lose your outline.
What you have got in the pictures is correct. To use it you should place the wooden part down flat on the bottom of your board and run nose to tail. That will start your tuck. Next spin it round so the flat part of the wood is laying against your squared off rail. This will give your second cut. You should be looking to pretty much split the height of the first cut in two with the second cut. I always finish the second cut at each end by spiralling the tool upwards at the nose and downwards towards at the tail which blends one cut into the other real well.
I’ve also made one with a piece of ply in place of the blades that I stick 80 grit paper to for use on EPS - much less aggressive and prevents the beads tearing.
Yeah just looked at John Carper’s and his cut is at 60 degrees also. So, when he discusses two 30 degree cuts, it’s not really, they are 60 degrees, aren’t they?. T’was confusing.
Cheers for the tips crew.
Ghetto rat, if you’ve got a basic hand tool that gives you the precise consistant angle you want every time, in comparison to your hand to eyeometer guesstimation, why not use it? I grasp what you imply about developing a good eye to hand perspective and skill, but I guess you must be a phenominal hand shaper in comparison to those of us who supposedly prefer such guided accuracy. Dunno if it would make you any less of a shaper, but what do I know, I’m justa very green noob.
The hand-eye coordination it takes to tune the bottom of a rail isn’t difficult. F-tool serves only one purpose, and if one applies the wisdom of the “Food Network’s” Alton Brown, everything except the fire extinguisher should be multi-purpose. After the bottom is trued up with the planer I buzz the rail with the planer from 0-open-O, and its a lot quicker, then you can tune closer with a surform, sanding block, or if everything is right, straight to screening. Never saw a need for a Fred-tool, and really it should be called a Barney-tool; sometimes I have to admit that hand-shaping is stone-age.
I have never seen a single pro shaper use one of these things, all the good ones I know cut the rail bands with the planer. I also don’t get how this is any help cutting TAPERED bottom bands. If you want the same width of band down the whole rail, this might be useful. But I’ve shaped a whole lot of boards over the last 40 years and about two of them had the same bottom rail shape end-to-end.
…well, it s exactly as Ghettorat and MD are saying…
In a small HPSB with lots of rocker you ll fuck up the bottom rail on the nose with that tool; you need to stop before the kick, then you ll have more problems than solutions on those rails.
If you do not want to risk the shape (due to rookie experience) with the planer, you can use a surform but with a microblade on it; and that s make the difference to not gouging the rail.
You ll see that is more user friendly that the fred tool
Yeah looks to be a tricky tool to use, I just mark the rails with a pencil and guide then work with a Hard sanding pad. Have tried the planer, surform, and other tools but find a hard sanding pad with a 40grit on it removes a nice ammount of material and easy to control if you mark your lines first…
At best, this tool gives you a flat surface to start your first band on rather than planing on a corner edge. It’s not a true band since it doesn’t have a foil to it, and the only way to get that is like ghetto said 0-open-0. If you do your rails entirely by hand, it’s of some use, but you have to stop well before the nose (both sides) and the tail (bottom) as previously said.
Worth repeating. Just shows how messed up people are after watching a video. I wouldn’t waste my time, and haven’t watched his video. The point MD emphasizes is bottom rails don’t stay at one angle all the way through, and that’s why that tool sucks.
No pro but used one of these for years. Absolute piece of piss to cut a tapered rail band with it, just a question of pressure. Also rolling it at both ends after the initial 2 angled cuts allows blending. Work well and fast. Good for newbies too…I’ve made boards with over 100 young teenage kids and they’ve used them to great success.
I guess the difference is with you guys is that you are pros doing it every day, some of you probably just shape and don’t do the whole process so of course you’re much more tuned in with the tools.
You’ve probably been taught by someone or mentored. I’ve never even had the pleasure of watching someone one else shape a board so its all been picked up over the years watching bids and clips on the Internet and of course about a million hours reading here.
Maybe I’ll try the next one just with the surform…see if it makes any difference.
Cheers
Rich Www.thirdshade.com
No pro but used one of these for years. Absolute piece of piss to cut a tapered rail band with it, just a question of pressure. Also rolling it at both ends after the initial 2 angled cuts allows blending. Work well and fast. Good for newbies too…I’ve made boards with over 100 young teenage kids and they’ve used them to great success.
I guess the difference is with you guys is that you are pros doing it every day, some of you probably just shape and don’t do the whole process so of course you’re much more tuned in with the tools.
You’ve probably been taught by someone or mentored. I’ve never even had the pleasure of watching someone one else shape a board so its all been picked up over the years watching bids and clips on the Internet and of course about a million hours reading here.
Maybe I’ll try the next one just with the surform…see if it makes any difference.
Cheers
Rich Www.thirdshade.com
At my old place, I had several well known shapers make their way through my shop. One, now a big CI shaper and I were discussing shaping one day. We were actually talking about banding methods on boards. He kept talking about his Fred tool. Finally I asked him, "what the F@ck is a Fred tool. He proceeded to show me how it works. I went into my shaping room and showed him my Fred tool. A shureform held at 45 degrees. I have never watched JC’s video. don’t care to either.
Ghetto got it right. The rail band on the bottom changes angle from nose to tail. Also with so many styles of boards and rails, that tool seems kinda like a one-trick pony.
Learn how to use your tools. They are far more versatile than some shureform blade screwed to a piece of wood.
Hey Reverb your pics make me realise how much further I have to go with my planer technique. Nice work. I’ve always used either the Fred tool or just my surform on its own. Loving that dust chute too. cheers rich www.thirdshade.com
