I would like to begin usin the lap cutting method as it seems to be neater and more old school. my question is probably obvious but here goes…uv resin is impractical in this method, correct? what if the resin hardens before all the lap cut is completed?
I use UV catalyzed resin for cutlaps. Take the board outside exposing the deck portion for a few minutes. Carry it back inside, flip it over and cut your lap line, then carry it back out to expose the rails and lap. Seems that that that weird deal with masking tape and a slower resin kick at a tapeline still is at play with the UV resin too. Test a piece of scrap foam and see how it works. TS>>> I would like to begin usin the lap cutting method as it seems to be > neater and more old school. my question is probably obvious but here > goes…uv resin is impractical in this method, correct? what if the resin > hardens before all the lap cut is completed?
I would like to begin usin the lap cutting method as it seems to be > neater and more old school. my question is probably obvious but here > goes…uv resin is impractical in this method, correct? what if the resin > hardens before all the lap cut is completed? Laminating polyester resin never gets so hard that you can’t cut one glass layer with a box cutter. If it worries you then only expose the Suncure for a minute or two until you like the hardness. Cut the lap in the shade, then complete curing in UV light. MEKP hardener won’t let you do that. The worst that could happen, if the glass could possibly get so stiff that you couldn’t cut it with a blade, you would have to use a hobby tool with an abrasive wheel to cut the lap. But the same would be true with MEKP hardener. Suncure allows you to work out all the bubbles and flaws, no matter how long it takes, then cure it. That alone would cause me to use it. But like I said, I’m a glassing screwup.
I just ordered some stuff from surfsource and saw that they had it. I only saw it in a 1 oz. tube for ding repair, but I would think that they should be offering it for a gallon mix. I did not see it on the web site, just in the catalog they sent. Just thought you might be interested in it.
I just ordered some stuff from surfsource and saw that they had it. I only > saw it in a 1 oz. tube for ding repair, but I would think that they should > be offering it for a gallon mix. I did not see it on the web site, just in > the catalog they sent.>>> Just thought you might be interested in it. Mike, Thanks for the heads-up. I’ve been drooling over the Solarez UV epoxy at Fiberglass Supply. Their lots and prices for said epoxy were prohibitive. Maybe these two suppliers and associated manufacturers can compete to lower prices for UV laminating epoxy.
Which is twice as much as the poly equivalent (which is about right when you compare a gallon of poly to a gallon of epoxy). That has got to be some trippy stuff. If you try some, let me know what you think about it.
I would like to begin usin the lap cutting method as it seems to be > neater and more old school. my question is probably obvious but here > goes…uv resin is impractical in this method, correct? what if the resin > hardens before all the lap cut is completed? I have done at least 20 boards with UV resin and the one thing that happens is when you flash this resin in the sunlight (10 seconds or so) it’ll kick slower than if you leave it exposed for a minute or so. The underside of the board (assume we are laminating the bottom first as always) that does not get direct exposure to sun does not cure as fast and remains tacky for a good little while. Certainly enough time to flip the board after 15 minutes or so (do the finger test to see how cured the glass is first) and trim the lap. This stuff is trick and so there will definatly need to be some trial and error applied.
Hey Mike, Just received reply from Solarez as the followings : “Right now - we have uv-cure epoxy for repair but for laminating, it is very difficult to explain. The resin will not melt styrofoam but when curing rapidly, it tends to distort the foam because of the rapid exotherm. you can shadow the resin but it is very tedious. So, to make a long story short, we do not have a laminating resin for styrofoam” For those eps/styrofoam boardbuilder, its a bad news… Regards, Crabie
Glad to have this info, Crabie. It stands to reason. Catalyzed, epoxy is more dependent on heat than polyester for hardening. Curing faster with UV, epoxy would be more likely to overheat than polyester. I wonder if Suncure has tackled this problem. Thanks, Noodle
Noodle: This thread prompted me to shoot the guys at SurfSource a note (they also own SunCure) and find out what they have to say about this. I suspect it is as Crabie noted, the chemistry is different and presents a different set of problems. I’ll post their reply as I get it. Tom S.>>> Glad to have this info, Crabie.>>> It stands to reason. Catalyzed, epoxy is more dependent on heat than > polyester for hardening. Curing faster with UV, epoxy would be more likely > to overheat than polyester.>>> I wonder if Suncure has tackled this problem.>>> Thanks, Noodle
thanks for the input!!!
Noodle: Dale at SurfSource replied to my e-mail last night. He noted that they have come up with several formulas of UV curing Epoxy that work great. The rub is that they are so expensive he doubts anyone would want to use them on surfboards, about $125.00 per gallon. They are still working on this though and are aware of the demand. TS
Noodle:>>> Dale at SurfSource replied to my e-mail last night. He noted that they > have come up with several formulas of UV curing Epoxy that work great. The > rub is that they are so expensive he doubts anyone would want to use them > on surfboards, about $125.00 per gallon. They are still working on this > though and are aware of the demand.>>> TS Tom, Thanks for checking. At $125/ gallon I’ll keep waiting. -Noodle
A few days ago I was putting an epoxy sanding layer on a board. My friend had asked me to put a little epoxy on a board that he is finishing up. In the glassing area it was 80degrees and I had been working with the resin for about 20 mins. My buddy’s board was outside the glassing shed in the shade. I finish up what I’m doing, the resin is still thin like poly hot coat. I walk outside with the resin bucket. Before I could get to the board in the shade about 15 feet away, the sunlight caused the resin to kick off to the point where it started to smoke. I immediately ran to the shade and dumped the smoking ball into a 5 gallon steel can we use. I thought it was going to catch fire. I had no idea the epoxy would react this drastically to UV. I was using 30 min hardner, which from previous experiences, know that you have at least an hour to work with before it even starts to kick, even at high temps (excluding the UV). Has anyone ever had a similar experience with UV and epoxy resin? There is a lot of chemistry there they are going to have to figure out. I hope they do.
Has anyone ever had a similar experience with UV and epoxy resin? Mike, My guess is that all wavelengths of sunlight caused your epoxy mass to go off. I had the same experience with 30 minute epoxy. I was glassing under trees in 95 degree weather. I knew that it would be close, but I thought I could make it work. I mixed the epoxy and spread it directly onto the glass. I hadn’t realized it, but while I was cutting glass and mixing resin the sun had moved and thrown a shaft of light onto my colored deck. The epoxy in the sunshine immediately smoked and melted into the blank. Yes, the heat from sunlight could easily smoke a canned mass of resin which had sat for twenty minutes. I could throw in the lesson which I learned from my experience here, but I’m guessing you already heard it, loud and clear. -Noodle
As long as you guys are both here. Remember the question about the S-2000 epoxy kits that SurfSource sells? It’s about time for me to get that epoxy lamination I’ve had on the sidelines moving forward. What has either of your experiences been with using the S-2000 epoxy been like? How much working time to I have if I can get my glass room down to 75-78 degrees? No UV light other than overhead flourescents at about 8 feet off my rack. This is a shaped and laminated epoxy project I inherited from another builder. It needs another layer of cloth on the bottom and 2 on the top to complete. I’ll sand just before glassing and even use some prep-sol or something on the sanded surface before laminating. Guaranteed I’ll be suited up and under the mask too. Any comments on the S-2000 and pitfalls? Am seriously thinking of tinting this a solid white or light color to cover some blems that are visible. Tom S.>>> A few days ago I was putting an epoxy sanding layer on a board. My friend > had asked me to put a little epoxy on a board that he is finishing up. In > the glassing area it was 80degrees and I had been working with the resin > for about 20 mins. My buddy’s board was outside the glassing shed in the > shade. I finish up what I’m doing, the resin is still thin like poly hot > coat. I walk outside with the resin bucket. Before I could get to the > board in the shade about 15 feet away, the sunlight caused the resin to > kick off to the point where it started to smoke. I immediately ran to the > shade and dumped the smoking ball into a 5 gallon steel can we use. I > thought it was going to catch fire. I had no idea the epoxy would react > this drastically to UV. I was using 30 min hardner, which from previous > experiences, know that you have at least an hour to work with before it > even starts to kick, even at high temps (excluding the UV). Has anyone > ever had a similar experience with UV and epoxy resin?>>> There is a lot of chemistry there they are going to have to figure out. I > hope they do.
As far as tinting the epoxy resin, I have no experience with that. A friend just got some pigment like coloring (it came in a little plastic tube) and it seemed to work well with the epoxy. This was only used for leash plugs though, I don’t know if it would retard anything with full on lamination. I will ask around. As far as the ss2000 epoxy resin from surfsource, it is the only epoxy resin I have used and it has worked well for me. It kicks very clear and is verrry hard when it sets. Regardless of whether or not you are going to use poly or epoxy for your sanding layer, you have to prep your lamination well (you don’t want the dreaded bannana peel effect). I skip sand my lamination then come back with a 3m scratch pad (like the ones they use to prep cars for paint) to get the shineys between the high points of the weave. Noodle lams extra layers of glass down so that he can sand more of the cloth, without weakening the lam job. To each his own, I prefer to use less material and less sanding (this also prevents you from being able to see the weave after you put your sanding layer on). After you prep your lam, wipe it down real good with denatured acholoyl (I suck at spelling). With the standard 30 min hardner that comes with the SS kit, at that temp. you will have all the time you need and then some. I would estimate you would have at least two hours working time. Put it this way, two days ago, I laminated the deck of my board during the middle of the day. It was about 85 to 90 degrees, with no direct sunlight. I had a solid 45 min to 1 hour working time. After about an hour and a half it had set enough to put a sanding layer on. Just like a poly board you can continue to glass once the resin has started to kick and has bonded to the foam. Just take a cloth with a little alcohoyl on it and rub a small spot on the board. As long as the cloth does not move you can lay out your sanding layer on it. The only drawback is that it will net a heavier board, but skipping some prep might be worth it for you. This resin takes a while to set, that is why setting fin boxes, fin plugs & leash plugs are such a pain in the ass. I think once you see how strong and light these boards are, you will want to make one for yourself.