Have you seen the trailer of “Glass Love”, the new video from Andrew Kidman? (It’s on surfermag.com)
In the first wave it appears an strange fish, with Huge keel fins and an exaggerated forwarded wide point and a tail template with a “reverse curve”.
Anyone knows how this kind of fish works? Who shape them?
Coque.
PS: Hey Lee, don’t hate me for writing again about fishes 
soon i’ll be asking about bonzers.
I didn’t see the footage yet [I’m going to order the DVD soon , though]. Was the fish you mentioned anything like … THIS ??!!
Michael Mackie [south coast new south wales, Australia] made this one.
(see www.mackiesurfboards.com.au for his refined ‘fish’ shapes he makes nowadays.)
If you look closely, you’ll see the template curve back OUTWARDS in line with the trailing edge of the massive keels [!!!] …why, I’m not exactly sure !
ben
Wouldn’t that board be real hard to turn?
That board is being ridden by Neil Purchase Jr. and was shaped by Neil Purchase Sr. in the movie Andrew said that that was the second fish that he had made his son based on the shapes of Rich Pavel.The board looks very similar to the board chippy posted.
Glass Love seems to be the perfect Swayaholics video beautiful surfing and boards with info about the boards.
Its probibly been posted before but there is a great Rich Pavel interview on allaboutsurf.com also a great one with Dale Solomonson.
I think the basic outline fits into the Lis / Pavel / Frye / Caro template, the tail is certainly different, but the deep swallow and wide point forward certainly seem to be in the same “school” (ha ha) as other “classic” fish. The tail is actually kind of like a real fish’s tail, or at least the cartoon conception of one. Keels are different, but the wide base and height seem to be similar to my 9x5 Gepharts. Without seeing the board in person, that’s all I can say.
Wouldn’t that board be real hard to turn?
spot on !
it was for me. If I was 40 lbs or so heavier, probably coulda made it work better…
ben
Back in 'late 70/early '71, while I was out of surfing, some guys in SurferMag were shown innovating with a fish tail that extended outwards just like that red board.
I couldn’t tell you much except it faded away quickly.
I had joined the Army, got kicked out, did some racing, broke tib/fib, and spent 13 months in a cast.
Thanks for your responses, i was wondering about how the water will flow on those kind of outlines… i can’t imagine what are the benefits or how’s the feeling.
Coque.
Wow, I went to the site you suggested, very cool shapes! Look at how those Keel’s are cut away. I wonder how that’ll ride.
That board is being ridden by Neil Purchase Jr. and was shaped by Neil Purchase Sr.
That’s a Michael Mackie shape and it is ridden in the fim by Garth Dickenson (first surfer in trailer). The concave curve in the template by the fins was inspired by the template of the early Winterstick snowboards. I highly recommend getting a copy of this film, loads of different shapes. Trailer is here website - http://www.litmus.com.au/
I knew I recognized that tail…
Sorry Mr G I was just going off what I MISS heard on the commentary section of the movie.
Just got the DVD for Christmas and was going to ask the same question, good thing I did a search! If the outline was indeed inspired by a Winterstick swallow, what benefits come of having it on a surfboard? Some info for anyone interested: The winterstick swallow is purely a backcountry board, as all the design elements are geared towards riding in deep powder. The idea is that the spoon nose rides high and “planes” through the snow, while the swallow sinks and helps you lean back for powder with less stress on your back leg. However, they are very difficult to ride on any type of packed snow. Would having the tail reverse in the last part of the outline let each pintail carve deeper and enable you to drive a harder-off-the-tail, snowboard-style back-foot turn vs. the more front-footed style of riding the typical fish? I’m pretty intrigued by this design concept, so anyone with experience on this type of board please share your impressions!
In the kiteboarding world, last 4 years, there was one distributed by Murray’s Marine with the snowboard reverse curve outline.
It actually worked fine! No real problems, smooth riding, and defying all logic! Faded away by '03 tho, as no one would believe anything soo weird would work conventional.
I thought the Winterstick didn’t work in hardpack because it lacked a hard metal edge. Dont’ think the swallow shape had much to do with it.
Fill in the swallow, maybe you get the Burton Fish??
I can’t tell from the photo if the line of the tail comes back out past the expected contour line of the rail or goes straight back, not having any experience of fish designs before my first thought is that it would have a similar effect to that of wingdings on a short board, and helps give a greater surface area for picking up waves and drive in smaller surf. I find that board really intreguing and would love to have a go on something like that. I’ve read other trens about fish but they are a rarely seen creature in Uk waters.
Lee-as I understand, the Winterstick swallow is difficult on hardpack for many reasons-nose wider than rest of the board, not much bite in the swallow area due to flex, no kick in the tail, and a very tight sidecut radius for a board its length. I’m pretty sure the newer ones have metal edges, but not positive. Supposedly, they ride like they’re about 20 cm’s shorter than they are due to the floaty nose. I’ve always wanted to ride one, but haven’t had the bucks as they’re pretty pricey. One of the benefits of being stuck in Utah is I get to spend a lot of time in the powder, and I’m always interested in alternative snowboard designs-if you think the 6’2 thruster shortboard domination is bad, check out snowboards sometime!
Very good little thread!
The Michael Mackie boards are indeed interesting.
On his website it looked like he’d done some flex tail fishes, with very long swallow tails. That would make the reverse snowboard type curve work, cause as you put weight on the board, the wider tail would “grab” and flex. I doubt it would be any good on a board with no flex, but can’t be sure as I haven’t tried it!
I have, however, tried traditional powder oriented snowboards with deep swallows. It’s the sweetest thing, I promise. Back in '85 I saw an article about snowboarding (on Wintersticks) and made a few with a mate of mine.
They work just like described before: the long, wide-ish nose floats, while the swallow allows you to ride perfectly balanced, no leaning back. You can go some incredibly fast on them, and it feels like velvet.
There’s a whole semi-underground of deep-swallow riders in the Alps, and the boards are much more versatile now. Less width difference between nose and tail, better flex distribution, edges etc. Check the website of “swell panik”, yes it’s with a K, and learn much more.
I’d be very keen to hear from someone who’s ridden a Michael Mackie board. Chip, have you heard any goss? Oh yeah, and happy birthday geezah! (I’m one meself).
Maz
I’ve ridden the one in the picture, my brother rode one of his mate’s ones near ulladulla [Mackie country]. I think it’s like M.P’s board in the 70’s…the shaper rips on them, everyone else struggles a little. But Michael’s less extreme boards are great. And his single fins are beautiful.
I want to go to ulladulla this year…
ben
Maz, good to see ya here !!
today, my brother sent me a GREAT birthday present…a shot he took of Tom Curren at off the wall. [ And, 15’ honolua bay, and waimea shots too. STOKED !!!]
Wow, I went to the site you suggested, very cool shapes! Look at how those Keel’s are cut away. I wonder how that’ll ride.
michael, researching at a local reef …
[featured in the ‘Nine Lives’ video, by the way…Curren and Sunny charge it ! ]
ben
