Good Pop-outs

General Discussion
1

please dont make this a “popouts suck” or “i hate popouts” thread

I’m interested in your expirence with different popouts, particularly longboards. has anyone rode and compared say:

Bic:

Surftech:

NSP/South Point:

any other popouts?

how did they feel in comparison to a poly boar in:

Buoyency?

Was it corky?

feel good?

wave catching?

Performance on wave?

any others?

and definatly how the board aged eg. dings, depressions etc.

i’ve found bics to ride quite simaler and feel more like a normal board to the south point longboards i’ve treid which were plasticy, bad on catching waves etc.

however thekingofdub’s 7’6" was a lot of fun the other day.

catchya,

josh

sick of dings

2

I used a friends bic 8’ or something once last year, paddled well, and i was suprised how easily it turned, it cut back well. I didn’t like the boyancy much though. Maybe a long one’d be best?

3

thanks for your reply Tej!

4

i own two surftech wood yater longboards (9’6" and 10’4") and they are both very very nice. one of them, the 9’6" is five years ond and gets plenty of use in solid waves and it still looks insane, no pressure dents and no dings, just a few scrapes where it has bounced off the reef…i can’t remember my first rides on the 9’6" but i’ll have to say when i first started on the 10’4" i hated it. i was coming off a 10’6" Erine Tanaka tri fin that is probably the best board i have ever owned. i couldn’t get the yater to whip around on takeoffs and it felt all slow and hull like, now 6 months later i don’t miss a beat and don’t notice it as being weird at all…

i have ridden a surftech brand 6’6" fake fish and it felt like a dog, this board buckled after a few months of light use…i have ridden a 6’3" surftech kelly slater and 6’2" JC surftech thruster and they both felt like any old small thurster, these two boards pressure dented and dinged up with hairline type cracks pretty easily…

the nsp soutpoint look like garbage to me, as do the bic boards…

i make my own “pop out” ie sandwich boards and some of them suck and some feel great. they all seem to last much longer then poly boards. my best one is a 5’10" canard quad with full concave deck. at 6.3lbs it is over three lbs ligher then the poly board i modled it after and it is soo much more fun to ride.

my good buddie was given a 6’8" hollow carbon fiber thruster halfway through the last north shore season… he was blown away by the board. said it was hands down the best board he has ever ridden in his 20 or so years of surfing. he is trying to scrap $ together to replace his whole quiver…

my take on the whole thing is people who don’t surf very often and think that thinking/talking about surfing is the same as surfing don’t like popouts becasue of what they are and how they go against the roots of surfing,

People who only ride one type of board all the time don’t like them becasue they don’t feel exactly the same as the only thing they can ride…

People who don’t think they are cool, people who don’t have a choice, and people that can ride anything like em because they are surfboards…

try em all, some will suck and some will rock, no differnt then poly in that respect…

5

Hi Josh. I’ve had a custom epoxy-wood veneer (does that count as a pop-out?) 9’1" for 7 years and it’s only just showing signs of wear. Some sinking of deck under back foot and butt cheeks. It’s got three stringers, but the wood veneer doesn’t wrap around the rails, just four layers of 6oz. So it should be stiff, but it’s not that much stiffer than my last poly longboard. It does feel more bouyant and sit a little higher, but I had it made 2.5" thick which seems to offset that. I surf lots of strong off and cross shores and had no trouble adjusting to chop etc.

I’ve also got a surftech woody that’s coming up four years. Holding up real well. Rides fine in small waves - may even be a little fast for nose riding (too stiff?). It’s much heavier than the custom which suits traditional style - maybe it was built heavier for that reason. My only complaint is the thick outside layer of resin which shatters really easy and is really difficult to repair. A friend has managed to snap a surftech in 5 foot beachbreak.

Karl

6

hi josh, the bics are made out of two different construction methods and materials, acs and cts,look at their web site for an explaination, the cts boards are generally lighter ,i have the bic 6 10 cts construction light as a pu board ,in the uk you can buy one for £219 with a board bag and leash its got to be the best value for money board you can buy and it surfs great as well, pete

7

I sometimes surf a 9.0 Bic and i love it. Get rid of the side biters and it’ll surf pretty good. Especially with big crowds, this beast seems to be unbreakable.

I don’t like the flex, lots of energy goes lost. You’ll feel it especially while your paddeling, catching wave, just effects a whole bunch of things.

So: surfs alright, can handle a beating, price is ok, will last you long. Its just missing that bit of magic.

8

I actually like the Bic popouts; I always rent them when I’m in place not specifically to surf. My favorite size is the 7’6"; smaller than that and they’re just too stiff; larger and they’re too heavy. The rails are rather soft, IMO, and fin selection is usually up to the whim of the rental shop owner, but the boards surf loose and slidey, especially if you can get the center fin out. And they’re indestructible.

A lot of these boards are really fun. I’ll take out a BZ foamie or a SoftTop on a flat mushy day and practice fins-first take offs without worrying about knocking myself out. No wax, either.

I used to live around Big Sur and when I went back to visit friends this year I noticed a few of the grizzled vets were riding SurfTech longboards on the weird reefs and kelpy rivermouths, for durability. When the black wetsuit brigade adopts them, that says something to me.

9

Bic ACS, rode the 7’9" . . . as a beginner for me it is really easy to ride on . . . wave catching is easy, and maneuvering is ok. But it has this dead feeling. The closest to that feeling is this water logged poly 9’6" old school glassing (12 volan etc) that should have been repaired several years prior with black mold spots and delams. But the glass wouldn’t strip off. The Bic 7’9" i used during a college surf class (Welcome to the OC). But as I got better I could maneuver, trim and go up and down waves.

anyways I digress . . . the ACS bic is a tank. you can drop it on concrete from held over head and it holds. Its made out of this plastic and tough. Another issues the ACS bics are heavier (than surftech, poly or hand shaped EPS / epoxy).

*recommended for combat conditions

Smurftech 9’ Robert Augustus sig model: ohh, I didn’t like this board. $200 netted this. Every time I rode it, I wish I’d spent the extra $100 and gotten the 7’9" bic instead. I could trim with it and turn. The guy who sold it to me said it was 3 years old. No deck dents at all. But coming off a 7’9" it was alot of board to handle.

But it dings just like a poly. The entire year that I owned it, it never got a dent though. I did know enough to use epoxy dingleberries on it (ghetto ding repair). I couldn’t nose ride it, the tail would just lift out and it would pearl (i slipped and sat on the nose by accident). I caught waves on the average, turning it required work, and it didn’t have enough drive, it was a 2+1. But on waves with some face, if you angled it, it would hold in just right and it was great to trim. It did have the chatter of most surftechs, so if there was chop sometimes it would wobble. The coolest was you’d hear ‘ta ta ta ta’ then it’d go silent (air time) then a second later, ‘ta, ta, ta’

At the same time, I acquired a 9 HP 1 (harbour). Pu/pe Collect $200 pass go, this board is near magic, you go to green room jail. Oh sh*t. This board blew away the RA surftech. It was easier to paddle, easier to turn (single fin), held niceer in steeper and faster waves, didn’t pearl as much. One time I blew a take off and fell forward, grabbed my board, so I was hugging the nose and going down the line for 3 seconds before washing machine time. It didn’t pearl city, hi, like the RA did. It had this momentum to it, that helped it go.

Looking back, I think the HP 1 won because it was shaped by Rich Harbour, and he really knows how to make use of pu/pe to maximize the surfability. Similar to what Bert says you have to mod flex, shape, bottom, fins to match the characteristics of the materials used . . .

The new CTS bics, I think they are similar to surftech . . . I haven’t rode one but held one, tapped it . . . sounds like a surftech, but haven’t rode one. They feel the same, and have roughly the same weight.

NSP I rode the 7’6" funboard with a kick pad. It felt dead, but it could catch waves. It did this funny bounce thing in chop. It wasn’t as good to ride the ACS Bic 7’9" the bic could catch easier, and turns were easier. Compared to a Harbour 7’6’ pu/pe Revolver, the revolver outclassed both (NSP) in all terms of surfing (wave catchin’, turnin’ trimmin’, paddlin’ etc), but more so the NSP. Plus it had this momentum like the HP 1. The NSP’s durability is above surftech / surftech related, but i think it isn’t as strong as the ACS bics.

10

I have a surftech Takayama egg. From the mind of Donald Takayama to under my feet. The shape looked great in the shop and surfs great, very versatile. As far as flex and boyancy, I have nothing to compare to, I have seen no pupe shapes that even compare to this shape. Its holding up well even though I abuse it.

11

Rode a south point 10’ 2" rental for some dayz in waikiki mostly at 3s and was impressesed for a rental–on the 1st wave i went for faded left and got a good right turn and setup for a nice nose ride and good cutback on the first wave–everything felt right from the takeoff thru the nose ride cut back --felt like a great way to introduce yourself on an unexperienced board where i was the visitor–cuze i was able to trade waves easily after that on a really fun dAY–NEVER RODE an epoxy po before but really had a fun 2 weeks and liked the bouency cause i could butt paddle my big butt back in–nice paddle.

ez takeoff—ez turn–ez ride–plus it saved my boards from baggage handlers

12

I was forced to borrow a Surface (least expensive model) canary yellow 9 footer when i went to visit someone. I took it out at a semi uncrowded beach/reef break and was pretty impressed after just a few waves. Then I took it out at a rather well-known reef/point break and had a great time! It bent every which way, it would somehow get right under me whe I started to lose my balance, it had moments of inexplicable slowness, and it also ocasionally went pretty fast. I was impressed enough to approach a friend who reps them and asked for the same model He didn’t have one but offered me a used “deluxe” version. The price was right but the magic was not there. Sold it for what I had in it to a happy beginner.

13

Hi PC -

I’d never heard of Surface Surfboards but checked them out on a website. IMO, the weak link in soft boards has often been the fins. Looks like Surface uses a decent box fin arrangement.

14

The cheap model has a set of fins that are simply connected through the foam to a fastener on the deck. the deluxe has a knockoff of the Futures system that isn’t even flush with the deck. The cheaper flexible board and the wiggly fins seem to work together - kind of like a standup mat - challenging, unpredictable, goofy fun.

15

Hi Josh,

Here’s a few that I have ridden:

9’? Yater Surftech: Easy to paddle and a fun noserider. Downside is that it feels too stiff and light. Granted, I rode it in pretty decent beach break so it may not be a fair assessment. Seems like it would be a pretty good point break board.

9’ NSP: My wife rented this board in Kauai a few years back and all I can say is “GARBAGE”. This board did not paddle well at all. It was so stiff that it chattered on every little bump in the water. Any wave that was overhead would bounce and toss the board in every direction. It’s strictly a beginners rental board to be used in knee high whitewater.

8’6" Surface epoxy. (Not the soft top): Very easy paddler with plenty of weight behind it. Not a high performance board by any means but, it can be ridden in a variety of conditions. Primarily points and mild reefs. The downside is the fin system. It’s proprietary and you don’t have a choice of fins to choose from. Plus, the fins remain a little loose in the box even after tightening them down.

6’10 Yancy Spencer Fish from Boardworks: This is my favorite PO of all time. It’s light and very easy to paddle. Extremely versatile and manouverable. I’ve had this board for several years and it really takes a beating. I put the Futures 512 Twin Fins with the smaller trailer on it for anything up to a couple feet overhead and it flies. For bigger waves I’ll switch out the the twins for a tri-fin setup. I like to bring this board with me on trips as a backup. It’s the perfect traveler because it’s light and takes a beating. My friends like to tease me about it but everyone of them has ridden it and will always borrow it to mix things up.

16

I recently did a repair or a 9’0 Realm amd had to admitt that it was a pretty nice over-all shape. It had a “California designed” lam(logo) on it. The glass job even seemed better than the ones I have done repairs on in the past. I have a friend who was a “Pro-Surfer” in the '80’s. His ten year old kid could ride pretty much any board Dad would buy. He prefers to ride a 6’10 Realm they bought at a garage sale. McDing

17

I’ve own and ridden both Boardworks and Surftechs mostly shorties.

I think epoxy popouts work better as longboards because of their lightness.

I’ve surfed the Boardworks Cheaterfive Egg, Yancy big fish and Linden bigboy 7’0" thruster

none of them seem to work all that well compared to the Surftechs but I heard stories of guys riding the cheater five ultra vee bottom eggs in the country with some success. Heard alot of good suff on the new Hynsons and Aipas.

I own the Surftech French 7’0 shortboard, Merrick 6’8" Flyer, French 8’0" Hybrid and McCoy 7’11" Nugget.

The French hybrid was first venture into these types of epoxies after buckling my favorite Jeff Ho fish just padddling out.

The Hybrid paddled okay but was too long for the width which a problem I’ve had with other long ands narrow poly longboards too.

The Flyer is a fantastic small wave mush wave board as it just skips along generating speed in terrible conditions, but this is a problem too(explain later).

My favorite is my McCoy 7’11" single fin Nugget with the McCoy Gullwing fin. Paddles like a 10’ but turns like a 7’ and a beautiful backside board. A very versatile board in all conditions forehand and backhand.

Now for the issues…

The Positives

Frontside, you can pump these things into 5th gear with little effort.

You can also launch them on a whim and go from point a(bottom) to point b(lip) with a pop.

The finish holds up if you take care of them but the will pressure and will ding or snap like any other board but over all the finish does hold up a little better after normal use.

The Negatives

As mentioned before you can pump these up to speed very easily because they are so light, but the lightness causes a couple of problems for me.

The first is that when you get to a certain speed like screaming across a sucking overhead to double overhead face, the board starts to lift up off the water and gets very squirrely until you finally lose it. I’ve had my french and merrick come up out of the water and blow up on me when I got it to a certain critical speed and those wipeouts were never pleasant. Kind of like a formula one driver blowing a tire in the corner. That’s never happened to me with a poly.

The second issue especially for me on the backhand is that their lack of projection really makes driving around the corner and especially whipping back into the hook almost impossible. I’ve noticed this problem with every epoxy/styro board I’ve ridden including my own balsa compsands. You don’t notice this as much on the forehand because you can insert alot of mini-pumps to keep up the momentum. If I could do the same on my backhand, maybe I wouldn’t notice it as much but my backhad tends to be more drawn out and drivey.

I will say this though, is that you don’t notice this lightness problem at all with the longboards. The lightness actually ends up to be a plus allowing you to ride the board more like a shortboard. Which is exactly why they are so popular here in Hawaii with the younger, bigger and older riders because they up the ante in the paddle contest without losing the performance aspect of a shortboard.

If you want a performance shortboard you’ll need to get some of the newer boards and not something that is an exact copy of an existing design. An example is the Takayama “In the Pink” model which was designed for the new materials. Some others would be the Byrnes, Webbers and Stretch but the newer guys have the advantage adjusting the desing to fit the styro float and epoxy stiffness.

Now to add to the debate.

I’ve also owned a Pointblanks 7’2" Mako. While some might not call it a popout, in my book it kind all falls into the same epoxy styro catagory even though they are made my hand. These boards ride completely different than a Surftech or Boardworks and are the closest I seen as the ideal solution as any off the shelf epoxy out their. High performance, long lasting and light, they are a favorite of mine. I kick myself everytime I think about having sold my Mako thinking I could make something better in a woodlam. The boards are more expensive than the others but in my opinion are the best of the big name styro/epoxy options you can get from a retail store (patagonia). If you can afford it these are a good choice.

If you are looking for long lasting the BICs are built like and feel like tanks.

Popout epoxy longboards from Surftech, Boardworks, Southpoint are your next best bet

Shortboards made for the new tech are the next

And Pointblanks if you can afford it.

For pure fun the SurfLifes and other softie blackball fishes are just pure shorebreak magic. (see the video on the surfermag site of Gavin Sutherland on one)

Hope this helps…

It’s only one person’s opinion just remember that.

18

Oneula,

Why do you think they don’t work so well on the backhand? Weight issues? Rails? I’ve heard this comment from people who ride them before and would be interested to hear an opinion from someone as unbiased about pu-pe/epoxy/sandwich construction as you, rather than the usual ‘it’s because popouts suck’ reply!

19

I’m no pro and I’m not expert… but I think it’s because you address the wave differently (or at least I so) on your back hand than on your forehand.

On my forehand I can intiate a pump right off the takeoff or draw a long line off the bottom turn and pump down the line before initiating a cutback or after the cutback off the top on the forehand, intiate a quick curren-like forehand rail release back into the face to rengage the forward momentum before the board loses its forward motion.

On my backhand I tend to drive straight down to the bottom or take an angled drop and then fully engage my inside fin to shoot up to the lip or shoulder. Being a little older and slower I take a little longer setting everything up on my backhand and my moves are alot bigger and more fully engaged. So once I’m up to the lip or shoulder I then re-engage my inside fin and gouge out a top turn almost like a mini bottom turn to return to the foam ball or lip for a foam ball bounce or lip bounce to then drive back down to set up for the next bottom turn. Again this is usually in good sized wave and not ankle hoppers.

As the wall lines up I’ll pump it but my weight is alot different pumping down the line backside than on my forehand. Probably just positioning and physics.

The problem is that after the big top turn on the backside and as I approach the foam ball or lip I never have enough mometum to carve off the foam/lip so I endup trying to manage a bouncy piece of ice cooler box as I go over with the lip. Really screws up your rhythm. Really short fish designs help but it’s still an issue and I’ve experienced on every light styrofoam core board I’ve ridden that I could paddle into a wave…

Now if I’m really on, I can drive straight back up off the tail but as you hook it back around under the lip, Styros just die and don’t carry any momentum to drive you back down to beat the lip as you try your best to take it apart… Try that is…

It’s more a weighting issue and technique issue which probably could be resolved by applying a different technique. But having grown up with in the single-fin 70’s my backhand is a product of the board and wave I learned how to surf on.

I think someone lighter on their feet and quicker with their moves would not have as big of a problem as someone with an older style and technique like me. I experience the same problem on my forehand with styro’s if I pull a big turn and then a quick snap off the shoulder back down with no follow through, the board just stops until the whitewater comes up from behind and blasts you… So you need to keep these boards going with continuous small connected turns. Stryros are not for those with big one or two turn moves (Except on a longboard).

Again just my experience

I think you need to talk to a younger person

I’ve been riding my popouts for about 4-5 years, I have no qualms about buying another as long as I can demo it first… That’s the key for me… You can’t do that with polys

20
Thanks a bunch Oneula- that all makes sense and I'm more interested in an 'experienced' surfers viewpoint (I'm older and slower for sure) as those damn kids can surf anything well usually. I love riding on the backhand- the drop, the setup and then throwing that big turn is about as fun as it gets if you pull it off right. Even on a 5'10" fish I'm getting the feeling of momentum I like but I'm wondering where the board will get too small or too light for me to get the feel I like, or even if that will affect it. Go surf more and more boards is the best bet I guess.