I just have a few questions for my project (first timer)
Probably going with “blue board” extruded as it’s available around here cheaply, plus epoxy. Sorry if I repeat old worn-out questions, I just needed a little clarification.
Do FCS fin systems work with these blanks? Do they present any unusual problems?
I want a solid color tint. What Is the easiest way (at what exact stage) to do this and what product should I use?
Is white elmers really OK for stacking the sheets for the blank and attatching the stringer? Are there any other products?
Thanks to everybody on here, I’ve already learned so much from this site. My dream is to be able to shape my own boards custom tailored to my style, ability, and local waves. I’m a little nervous about getting started, but all the boards on this site have been a great inspiration. I’d also appreciate any other insight anybody has about EPS construction/durability in general.
well i can answer two of your questions if you want to tint your board you have to buy resin tint which you mix with your resin right before your going to start glassing your board. its fairly inexpensive and can be picked up at any fiberglass supply shop.
as for the 3rd question the elmers glue works really weel. just make sure that you pile tons of crap on top of your foam. also make sure that the two pieces line up exactly. and let it sit for at least a day or so. latley there has been contorversy over if the glue in the middle will dry. i thin it did. some people have punched tiny holes towards the middle to let the glue dry. as for gluing in the stringer i used a combination of elmers glue and liquid nails wood glue and let it sit for like three days.
i also added a little weight when i was sandwhiching the stringer. i put a layer of shingles around the board before i taped it. the only reason i did it was becasue i had excess shingles left from our roof having to be replaced after all the huricanes.
as for the fcs question i dont see any problems with putting in the plugs, i havent tried it yet but i think you should be fine.
you have probably read the 14 dollar blank thread but it might be worth reading again, i have read it several times since i started my eps board.
Probably going with “blue board” extruded as it’s available around here cheaply, plus epoxy.
Do FCS fin systems work with these blanks? Do they present any unusual problems?
I want a solid color tint. What Is the easiest way (at what exact stage) to do this and what product should I use?
Is white elmers really OK for stacking the sheets for the blank and attatching the stringer? Are there any other products?
Good luck with your first board, I’m currently doing the same. This is what I’ve learned so far:
Futures are probably easier to install for a first timer with limited tools (just a router), but I’ve never tried to install FCS’s, so this is a guess.
I’ll let the experts answer this one, I’m going clear with the epoxy.
Might as well use epoxy, you’ll need it to glass, anyway. Order a little extra and glue the sheets with it. Keep it away from the rails, or else you’ll have to try and shape it, as well as the foam. 20 minute epoxy even works good enough, you’re only using it to keep the sheets together while you shape.
I’d switch to EPS (white), right now, if I were you, skipping the blue XPS. Easier to shape. HD will have it in 1-1/2" thick sheets.
Hope yours turns out well. Mine’s in the glassing stage. I hope to be riding it soon.
I would NOT use Elmers with blue (XPS) foam. No air movement = no glue drying.
I would NOT use blue foam, really, at all. History of delaminations with heat (check the archives - they’re full of stories), big weight penalty compared to white bead foam (EPS).
I’ve done 2 EPS/Elmers blanks with very good results. Others report their glue stayed soft for a while. My third blank, I used the Elmer’s version of Gorilla Glue - a brown polyurethane glue that turns to yellow foam. Its half the price of Gorilla glue, bonded the foam very very well, and shaped & sanded even easier than a line (ridge, soon) of dried Elmer’s white.
If your HD has white foam instead of blue, change to that immediately. The change will cost you less than $20 more. If you can’t find white foam, at least use polyurethane glue, and epoxy is probably even better than that.
With epoxy, tint during your lam, hotcoat clear. The tint will help you get an even lam as well.
Yeah, I’ve been a little confused about XPS vs. EPS. I understand that the EPS (especially HD insulation grade) really sucks in the water. I guess as long as it’s sealed that’s OK. And XPS has delam problems? I’m going back and forth on the two. Thanks for all the info!
My first blank was blue XPS. Sureform “tore” the foam, the epoxy didn’t bond too well to the smooth “skin”, causing problems between the foam sheets and the sander I used “burned” the foam. Tried to use 60 grit to shape it and that tore the foam, as well, rendering the blank unusable. Consequently, it ended up in the trash before I could get it finished.
The second try with EPS, the Sureform shaped the foam nicely, the epoxy held quite well and sanding was a breeze. It felt more like I was developing the skills needed to shape real blanks, rather than developing techniques to cope with the foam.
A vent plug can deal with any water that may get in the foam in the long run.
Spackling adds almost as much weight as the extra epoxy the foam might suck up, so unless you need to patch a divot (I did), I would skip it.
If your using XPS DON"T try to put the layers together with white glue. It won’t set inside of XPS. Use epoxy. EPS will take on water depending on density. 1# does take on quite a bit, 1.5# not so bad, and 2# not much at all, no worse than a lightweight urethane. XPS doesn’t take on much at all but has issues with delamination in hot weather. Personally I like 2# EPS for most boards. You won’t find 2# density at you local HD but you may find it in the phone book. Look under isulation and there may be a supplier in your area. Most places do have it and you can then get it in the size you need so you don’t have to glue sheets together.
i really liked the way that the liquid nails worked on gluing in the stringer.i am not sure if anybody else has tried this method but i feel that this extra stronger glue will increase the strength i also did a little sanding on the sides for extra surface area.
Make sure that if you use liquid nails you let it dry for quite some time, even after you “think” it’s dry. Liquid nails is often used in speaker box construction and it has to fully dry before the speakers are added. The liquid nails puts off a gas as it’s drying and can explode a speaker box. If it can do that to a wooden speaker box I don’t want to think what it could do to a board.
yeah i never really thought about that. but before you can even start shaping the board it sits for about 3 days and by then its pretty damn dry. alot of peope are letting there boards cure for a while after the board is completly finished. i really dont think that i am going to casue any kind of combustion by using wood glue. but if i do i will be sure to inform everyone.
I’m probably stuck with 1# eps for the first board anyways,
do you think it’s better to spackle it or just let it suck up some extra epoxy (do you pre-coat it)?
Also, if I order some RR or other epoxy, I’m still curious whether I can use regular poly-style resin tint or if I need another kind? Probably won’t try, but can I do artwork on the blank?
I’ve had good results using light weight spackle diluted with distilled water to seal the blank. I let it dry a completely before glassing. I don’t think it adds much weight. If you use epoxy to glue sheets together you have to deal with some very hard stuff at the glue line when shaping, but it bonds extremely well. There’s no Home Depot where I live but I’ve found it’s much cheaper to buy a big block of foam than individual sheets. And you can cut what you want in one piece. If you use FCS plugs try to use a slow hardener for epoxy. I’ve had FCS plugs smoke (literally) on my first try using Fibreglass Hawaii epoxy in the islands, maybe not so bad in a cooler climate. That experience soured me on FCS - no problems since then with Futures however. Haven’t used resin research epoxy - not available here in the deep south - how about it Greg?
You’re going to make a great board - you already have way more information than I ever had. After every drama the guys at the boat yard would nod knowingly and say “Oh yea i’ve seen that before”.
I haven’t sealed my blanks in any way. Last 10’0 I laminated only took about 32 oz each side (resin+hardener) compared to Greg’s guide of 27 for a 9’0. Just work fast & smooth, & it won’t suck in.
I also subscribe to the ‘inhaling blank’ idea. I put a space heater under my blank on its stands for a few hours prior to glassing. Then cut the glass, mix the resin, and flip the blank so the warm side is up. Turn down & move away the space heater and laminate. As the blank cools it contracts and inhales a tiny bit which seems to help seal & set the glass. Nice dry lams, no shiny spots, no pinholes. Do it in the evening, start with the room about 70 and let it go down to 65 overnight (not lower, though).
By next day, I can get home from work, surform the laps, and put the spaceheater back underneath. Spend a few hours eating dinner, reading to the kids & putting 'em to bed, then go back out & lam the other side. Day 3 I usually hotcoat the deck (which was what I laminated on day 2) to get that ideal within-24-hours epoxy bond. Day 4 I can flip back to the bottom for finboxes & stuff. Day 5 I sand the bottom & hotcoat it. Its a process which demands some patience, but yields very nice results.