Custom shaping is a bit misleading if you ask me. You order a board. The shaper decides what “he” thinks you want. You get a great board but you’d like some minor adjustments to your next one a few months down the track. Stop right there! Unless your shaper wrote down some pretty precise measurements (no problem if you Kelly Slater) you’ve got very little chance of getting your minor adjustments. In fact what you’ll probably get is whatever the shaper thinks is best with some vague guidelines along the way, i.e. your custom order sheet. I’ll have a 6’1" x 18.5" x 2.25" with low rails please. Now how many ways are there to link those curves? How about exact control over the final shape of the board? I think Base have it right by the sounds of things. Sitting with the shaper and adjusting things on the screen. You can even get a PDF of what the board will look like before it’s shaped! How many Asian manufacturers offer that sort of service? Try none! Now that sort of service is what I call personalised. In the meantime how about changing the term “custom” to hand made. When I can get the same board repeated with minor adjustments to say within a millimetre then I’ll call it a custom. Otherwise I’ll just order a hand made one.
deanbo. Base have 3 aps3000. machines. thats one way to get you a pdf. you see most of us shapers who take making you a better board seriosly keep records. i have 5000 boards on file in notebooks from b4 i started using aps with 6" incremental measurements of rocker, width and contours. and another 4000 aps3000 files from the last 4 years.
i have attached a sample pdf my customers can sign of when they order. i welcome customers to bring in old boards and file numbers to go thru the design process with me. in fact for 3 years i had a projector in the shop so the boards were pretty much full size on the wall to help you see the design as i work. we now use a large flatscreen tv. i think your “handmade” can be confusing. i think “individualy crafted for you” probably is a better description. .
if you order a board from a shaper it should be a all inclusive discussion where you arrive at a conclusion of what the craftsman is going to make for you whether he use a electronic planer or a hand powered one.
woof woof
Nice to know there are some people offering that level of personalisation. As for woof woof you may need to dig a little deeper.
dont shapers near you? how the f#@% are they still in business if they dont?
i understand tho because i would have sent at least 4 guys out the door today because they wanted something lower volume than i think they should ride… i could have made money by selling the 6’0" tall 85kg kid a 6’0"x18 x2 1/8 just like his mate who is 5’8" and 65kg! oh well i can only help those who help themselves and will listen to advice… 50 percent of people wont listen to someone whos made 10,000 boards under thier own label with at least 1/2 custom. but they will buy a $950 tech board from a good write up in a surfmag by a 22y/o jorno who surfed thru uni…
compared to dave I am totally at the other end of the market, however I keep records and know what rocker I used and usually ask you to bring your old board in to get the comparison. but if shape doesn’t match rider I am not going to take the fall there is the door.
I’m gonna be Devil’s advocate here (its so much fun).
Doesn’t it seem that once the shape is reduced to a computer file, its just that much easier to send it off and have it made somewhere else?
And, adjusting the shape by millimeters? What about the inherent flex/distortion of the board? The viscosity of the resin? The mood of the laminator/sander? What you had for breakfast? All those are huge factors in how a board rides.
It may gratify the customer’s sense of control to be able to order in such detail, but could be easily argued that the whole fixation on numbers has helped to propel the craft into a more standardized, machine-like process.
Consider that Santa Cruz has more than it’s share of shapers.
Some are more accessible than others. I
If you took the same sketch of a board with all the specs. including rocker, rail, & bottom configuration to a gang of local shapers here abouts and had each make the board every one would be different.
So?
Look at the shaper’s work first. If what he’s shaping suits your fancy, try and talk to him. Some shapers are far more accessible than others and you can be sure that whoever you talk to you’ll get a different perspective. Everyone approaches things a little differently.
If you pick a Santa Cruz Shaper just make an educated choice and go with the flow regardless of whether you pick, Mel, Colletta, Goin, Stretch, Jobson, Thomas, Palandrani, Haut, Junod or one of the 20 or so locals I haven’t mentioned.
No Worries, Rich
i really admire the shapers who do EVERYTHING themselves, that's just huge to me.
Miles Thompson
I totaly agree, you go to a certain shaper because they do a board a certain way and you get their individual twiston the board you want.
Allan, your absolutly correct. however im not sure thats the level of custom shape reproduction deanbo was talking about.
"Doesn’t it seem that once the shape is reduced to a computer file, its just that much easier to send it off and have it made somewhere else? "
yes it makes it very easy. in fact there is AKUshaper in china using empire foam. theres a dsd in holland, theres all kinds of machines all over the world with ways to transfer files in minutes to use on anything…
there is benifits to keeping it in house and benifits to sending away.
i like having my own shop where i meet the customer, design a board with them, drive 5 mins to my factory, cut the shape on my own APS3000, finish it, then hand it to the guy who taught me to shape 20 years ago to glass, then downstairs to the sander who ive spent many a day with…
you well know with the unnecasary fixation of numbers are irrelevant and that the key design factors have a large sway over the suitability of the board to a given client.
“And, adjusting the shape by millimeters? What about the inherent flex/distortion of the board? The viscosity of the resin? The mood of the laminator/sander? What you had for breakfast? All those are huge factors in how a board rides”
we have and can gone as far as having the same laminator/sander combo for repeat boards, controlled temps, but what about the blank pour, or the wood /stringer layup, or even the years that the tree grew.
several of the factorys here have one particular work crew who only do team boards to maintain a reasonable consistancy! where can we stop…
one thing that seems good for the customer is its one of the few things in the world that has such a unique personal input. the customer gets a sense of gratification in being part of the creative process. for such small dollars too…
.
on average it takes me about 5 boards from the same shaper, each board being tweaked a little, until i get close to a great board.
A few more thoughts:
Consider that we live in the digital age. Some shapers are more computer hip than others.
One shaper will pick the blank that most closely suits what your custom can be cut out of. Then he may or may not invite you in for the shaping process. If he does be sure to stand where he wants you and keep you mouth shut until he moves from on part of the process to another. He may as you want you think others will just move through things very methodically.
Another shaper may sit you down with him at the computer and spend time tweaking all the contours, rails, an rocker with you. It can be done that way. I’ve spent several hours with super computer hip local shaper and seen the board in perspective relief before it was shaped.
That’s the board I got! It was a full on custom too.
Right Cornelius? (-;
Pick your artist (In my book shapers qualify big time.)and go with his process.
Stay Stoked and be well, Rich
I’m getting ready to get a custom from John Mel, would it be inapropriate to ask him if I can watch part of the process?
Just got back from a surf we had the same discussion. Computer or hand , asian or local I have to say I push the local ,hand but to the young crew it is dial up the perfect board and away we go. good ,great totally hot. If this is the case why don’t people just design there stick and email it to the machine man and rule out the board company ( dave your ears just pricked) and send it straight to a glasser . Half price boards.
Check the waves out on reef2beachsurf.com
how many people have painted the Mona Lisa? it’s a hard transmission to make when you’re talking about something you can commit to weather it’s a woman’s body or a car what have you - a stereo, a meal, or a house. it comes down to knowing not thinking that you know but KNOWING what you want out of it and having the ability to articulate that vision to the man who’s hands are assigned the task. have you ever prepared vegetables for a salad? i haven’t so you probably won’t order a salad from me
knowing what you want is a shaper’s insurance in the board’s design. their ability to understand what others want from them comes from practice which builds popularity. everyone wants the oldest shaper they know to make their boards if they enjoy thinking about surfing new shapes. it is nothing less than sheer artistry in sculpted interactive foam form we desire. don’t deny us our contributive vision as customers, please. customers is an interesting word to me… we are people who like to pioneer fashions and new trends in future walks of surfing heritage. we feed on this idea and the fact that it’s good for us to think about such things, and it is. and with the strength of that hunger harnessed properly i think anyone anywhere could make a board. hell! glass a foam blank and i’ll ride it!
if a shaper is good that person’s hands are kept insistently busy. he’s probably done it year after year for a living. a year is a long time to wait for a board, yeah. if i was asked to paint the mona lisa i’d want at least 2 years. it took da vinci took 2.5 ! jellyroll morton invented a written language for jazz and claims to have invented the genre itself!
nothing is ever as good as it could possibly be - we can always “make” things better by noodling - or is there such a thing as too much of a good thing? i’ll take man over machine, hands down. a man or woman’s mood over artifice. i believe in diet and exercise not pills
custom to me means that the board was built for ME the way I want it to be to the best of the shapers ability—that said, i have gotten some really magic boards —one of the best methods to be this is to walk in(having called ahead) with your favorite board as a starting point. and further down the line the delivery of a sixer or 12 pack for the glasser and sander will not hurt the overall process either…
Yo Danny,
John is a long time friend of mine and a man of few words, but the same time he’s a most accessible and real person. It never hurts to ask. So go for it. If he says yes, just stand in the door by the vacuum tank and listen to the planer and compressor howl. John has his methods but remember to listen very closely to what he says. He can say more in a sentence than most guys can say in a paragraph.
I know you;ll be happy with your board cause he’ll make you just what you want. He’s made customs for me on and off since '69 – a most versatile shaper and gentleman for sure.
No Worries, Rich
how’s this…
a craftsman’s commitment to quality
a personal lifetime guarantee that the client will be completely satisfied with the end product no matter what the situation within the boundries of the materials used. Don’t like it then bring it back and we’ll try something different and keep doing this till you’re perfectly happy with the results. Anything truly custom usually involves this core end client philosophy.
Usually price is not an issue and neither is profits.