Whether or not the Icelandic volcano spewed out more toxic muck into the atmosphere than the whole world for the last 2000 years, or the belief that the world goes through drastic atmospheric cycles and climate change is a figment of our imagination, i think we can all agree that cutting down on our carbon and toxic footprint is a sensible idea, especially for a group of people that spend so much time in and around the natural environment. With that said…
I’m just curious if anyone here is making a conscious effort to build a more “sustainable” surfboard. Leaving all discussion on sustainable wood surfboards out of the question, is there anyone using the green alternatives in the conventional foam based surfboard industry? Green Foam? Bioresins? etc…
Also, is there any alternative to the Green Foam company? Their concept is great, long overdue, and obviously welcome to the industry, but their blanks are still urethane. Is anyone producing some kind of foam/foam like blank that is not urethane or styrene based and is potentially recyclable or biodegradable?
I ask this because there have been a few environmental threads lately and I was wondering how all the board builders here are addressing this issue…
Just to put things in context: The building, transportation, and furniture industries EACH use well over a billion pounds of polyurethane foam per year. So if you want to get away from polyurethane foam, don’t sit in a car, on a sofa, or on a mattress.
Most people spend more time in front of their computer and there are more of them than surfboards and they have a lifespan roughly the same as a surfboard and are much more toxic in landfills than surfboards.
Are you one of those psuedo ‘Internet-Eco-Surf-Warriors’ who sits on mass production furniture and drives their car to a fast food joint after surfing and then posts about it on the internet?
TO ME, it seems like the question goes way beyond the toxicity and waste involved with the materials at the craftsman stage themselves. There’s also the total transportation costs, the resources used to grow/create and then process the raw materials to render them into the “finished” condition that the craftsman uses, and most importantly, the longevity of the finished product relative to it functioning as intended.
A pu/pe board “may” initially be more toxic than a “green” board, but if it lasts twice as long in its operating mode then the net damage to the environment may not be as severe as the total racked up by a succession of nominally less toxic - but also less durable - green boards. If that’s the case.
I reckon we do more damage to the environment over time by driving to and from our surf spots than what the margin is between green vs. dirty surfboards. Right now I’m favoring epoxy and toying with the idea of using urethanes like Resin-X or AST and veneers to get the durability and long term performance I want out of these boards. But I’m under no illusions that using resins with fewer TOCs or EPS blanks with stringers from sustainable resources is somehow making a dent in the carbon footprint my surfing leaves. I’m resigned to the fact that I’m toxic to my environment.
Most people spend more time in front of their computer and there are more of them than surfboards and they have a lifespan roughly the same as a surfboard and are much more toxic in landfills than surfboards.
Are you one of those psuedo 'Internet-Eco-Surf-Warriors' who sits on mass production furniture and drives their car to a fast food joint after surfing and then posts about it on the internet?
Currently working on a 10’6" pu/epoxy with plastic/fiberglass fins (couldn’t find the energy for birch this time)…Given that there is nowhere to recycle eps offcuts around here and the blank selection is way better for pu (not to mention it is more fun to shape)…I think this is about as green as I’m going to get for a while. Really the carbon question for home builders is more one of a) how long do I ride my board, and b) do I drive to the beach every day…or just days that the waves are good…(better yet, never drive and ride your bike if you can). It feels good to try new greener materials, but the true cradle to grave enviro costs are much bigger than pu/pe vs eps/epoxy. For instance…was that hemp you glassed your last “clean” board grown in Romania? If so, how? Ditto on the birch…And how did it get here? What did you do to recover all your dust? Does it accumulate in your backyard and runoff with the winter rains or ? How much extra resin did you pour on the ground?
Glad to know people are thinking about this and trying to make changes…the industry is surprisingly far behind the rest of the world on this stuff, but the real environmental costs of surfing are probably more about travel to/from the surf than in the tools we use to surf. Just my .02$…
I think the positive of a green surfboard is possibly when oil gets to some extravagant price per barrel, then some of these alternatives
will be just that --affordable alternatives. However, in the meantime, I am not 'market research'. I think there alot of greenies
who are favorably disposed to these items and they are unwittingly being the 'market research' and 'quality control' endpoints
for many of these R&D ventures. So maybe we shouldnt go so hard on them, its all for a purpose.
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When oil reaches that extravagent price level surfing won't matter anyway becuase most of us will be reduced to a 3rd world lifestyle. At that point most people will be more interested in basic survival than in trivial recreation. The plus side would be that I have a stockpile of 16 boards and live within a 10 minute walk of some quality surf and it sure would cut down on the number of inlanders clogging up the lineups.
Reduce waste while building and 2. make em last. That’s 99% of being green. I’ve used and sold epoxy for 30 years in part because it addresses #1 and #2. It also reduces emissions at the same time and can be done at the same or lower cost as any other build. 2013 will be here before we know it and it appears now that this tech will be virtually mandated in CA. But we’ll see.
The first 6 replies to this post seem to be saying that making a green surfboard doesn't matter, and that other industries pollute way more. Buying computers is polluting, but you don't use your computer to ride waves. Surfing is an experience only possible if the environment is clean and preserved, so it's more important to have a "green" surfboard than a green computer. It's like, thanks for the waves ocean, in turn, I will make surfboards in a way that will do less, little, or no harm to you.
The most green surfboard is an alaia with no glass from a quick growing tree. THen hollow wood surfboards, then epoxy and recycled eps, maybe with some wood skins, and you can go frmo there.
The point of this thread is specific, so all you guys shoudl stop claiming that it's just a matter of not driving so much and flying so much. Those are fair comments, but the thread is specifically about designing more environmentally friendly surfboards. Let's stick to it.
At Entropy, we’re looking at green components by examining the carbon footprint of our epoxy resin, not just for surfboards but anything using a thermoset resin. Once you’ve decided that making a durable board, and reducing your waste is worthwhile, we figured carbon footprint is the next logical place to go. By using sustainable materials and doing a life cycle analysis on the raw materials, we’ve found that there is a significant measurable benefit to using sustainable materials that don’t draw from food sources and is reclaimed from waste streams of existing industries. > 50% Lowered emissions by using closed loop processing, lower water and energy consumption, less chlorinated chemicals. Then when you consider the latest catastrophe in the gulf driven by our dependence on petroleum, looking at sustainable materials starts to have a bigger impact than just carbon footprint.
you guys in the US, SA and OZ may be able to save “green” miles by saying wood and all that has to be shipped in, but the REST of the world imports blanks, and resin, and cloth and fins. So, that carbon footprint argument is worthless for us.
And ANY step towards better equipment is worthwhile from my standpoint. The pu/pe boards have set a benchmark in terms of what we are used to, not necessarily the best. Think about it, if there had never been one, would you still consider it the best?
Luckily here in the UK I can get a UV cured resin made from Linseed oil. Over recycled EPS is probably the greenest yet best performing concept I can think of, excepting wood build methods. I’m trying to become a crude oil free builder in the next year, so while I may not be able to be an eco-nazi with the rest of my life, at least my boards are as clean as possible…
hans, that may be true, but most builders/factories I know of use US blanks(USA), Burford(OZ), Southcoast Foam(OZ), or some other South African brands, Silmar Resin or another formula from SA, and FCS fins. Not sure that any of that stuff originates in the EU, not that there aren’t valid companies out there.
My point is the argument that making a pauwlonia board per se is as toxic from the go due to shipping the wood makes very little sense to us over here since most blanks and materials are shipped in anyway,
The Linseed resin is made by Sustainable Composites in Redruth, Cornwall, UK. I don’t have the link, but a google search brings them up.
I make my boards with foam made in belgium (EPs or XPS) and epoxy resin made in Germany (if I’m not mistaken). I have no clue where the glass comes from.
Shipping foam is a bad idea if you think about it.
I build in Epoxy over Poliester foam. The environment is not a factor in my decision. I just like working with epoxy resin over poliester.....I've done both. I use traditional foam because I like it too.
I’m making hollow wooden boards, from balsa that was cut down locally. Sounds good, right? Only thing is, the wood is cut with a chainsaw… gas powered. Then I bring it to my shop in my truck… also gas powered. I burn gasoline in my generator when I use my power tools… I am off the grid. I use epoxy glue… I’m glassing with epoxy.
I don’t know… how green IS my board?
The only thing I can say, and its been mentioned before, my boards are going to last a lot longer than most boards that aren’t made of wood.
Now that we have the basics out of the way move on to what counts which is stewardship.
The onus is not the carbon foot-print or green resin or any other BS, it’s the ROI.
Since you cannot repay your existence through some arbitrary measure of carbon, VE, calories, etc, the important measure is what you leave behind so where surfboards - or anything else for that matter - are concerned, have you learned your craft and made a positive impact on the development then passed it along for others to take and run with?
This is a board building site, have you advanced the craft?
There are better ways to build - I personally use the assembly approach as against the removal method. When you only use what you need, you’ve already made great strides.
It’s all about the total resource investment.
Oh, and “Green” or “Sustainable” anything is a catch phrase.
Build well and wisely then pass your lessons along.