ive been thinking that aside from the "selling point" appearence of a board in the showroom , the issue of fine craftsmanship and possibly the size of the builders ego, i can understand why the sides and bottom of a board and fins have to be fairly smooth to work well. but lets get brutally honest here- why does the deck have to be smooth or glossy, and why does the outlines template and both sides of the rails have to be perfectly symetrical? it sure seems like less concern for "craftsmanship" where it doesnt really matter and more only where it really counts would result in a drastically lower-priced board that still rides great. so-- IS THIS HERESY??? or am i right in assuming much of a new board`s cost is simply tied to the fact that its got to sell more than ride? bud h.
I may be off base here but it seems to me if the cost of materials for a board cost about $150.00 and the surf shop marks the board up $100.00 than all this craftmanship is worth about $200.00. When you split that between a shaper,glasser,sander,and shipper its hard for me to see how anyone even makes a living doing this. The fact the board turns out symetrical and is smooth is totally amazing!
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ve been thinking that aside from the "selling point" > appearence of a board in the showroom , the issue of fine craftsmanship > and possibly the size of the builders ego, i can understand why the sides > and bottom of a board and fins have to be fairly smooth to work well.>>> but lets get brutally honest here->>> why does the deck have to be smooth or glossy, and why does the outlines > template and both sides of the rails have to be perfectly symetrical? it > sure seems like less concern for "craftsmanship" where it > doesnt really matter and more only where it really counts would result in > a drastically lower-priced board that still rides great.>>> so-- IS THIS HERESY??? or am i right in assuming much of a new board`s > cost is simply tied to the fact that its got to sell more than ride?>>> bud h. …On my personal boards I usually hotcoat the deck,and just take the nubs/zits off.It’s usually a thinned out hotcoat as well.I get the strongest,possible deck W/O THE EXTRA WORK.Sanding/wetsanding/polishing,heats the surface up making it weaker, IT LOOKS PRETTY,but it’s weaker!!And by not sanding the hotcoat out, also allows me to delete a patch or layer of glass,if so desired…you wax it anyway,right…As far as symetry goes ,I put my numbers down ,double check them to make sure that’s what I’m shooting for ,and shape, I don’t ever measure again unless I’m setting fins/boxes,etc.,long after the shaping is done,I like to eyeball my work vs. driving myself crazy trying to keep the numbers even. …The next time you go into a shop take a small tape measure with you you’ll find that those even looking symetrical boards aren’t really so even after all.Herb
I know of a very popular racing sailboat (hundreds built) that supposedly isn’t symmetrical.
I know of a very popular racing sailboat (hundreds built) that supposedly > isn’t symmetrical. This is a very,very fine artform.This is not abstract painting on a peace of cloth streched over a wood frame. This is hand form shapeing a tool to surf on. It must be uniform on both side’s. This is what we were taught from the men who knew. They were boat builder’s, and the finest of wood worker’s. And #1,they were,and are SURFER’S. They do not want us to chop out a form just to say we did.Please remember who they were,and are stil. Joe Quigg, Mike Diffenderfer,and many more. Many more. Sorry im rambling. But i love this art i do.
I say, “Looks aren’t everything” when it comes to surfboard making. A perfectly symetrical and finely shaped board is really only as good as it rides. A $700 longboard is worthless to a rider if it can’t perform well. Of course, a really rough and unrefined shape will probably not sell in a shop. So, a board needs to be lots of “show”, with some “go” in order to satisfy the average customer.
Wouldn’t it be true that a board that is perfectly symetrical etc would work best in perfect conditions.As I see it a wave is a constantly changing medium rarely perfect and you only have a partial section of your board in contact with the water at ony one time, then you are on a curved and sloped surface with one side of your board riding up the slope and the other riding down the slope.I always try to build my boards as symetrical as possible but I have had customers bring their favourite board in to duplicate and I ask them do they want me to include the twist, rail wobbles, offset box etc when you point it out they can’t believe it’s true about their fave board but ultimately if that’s the best they’ve ridden and it works for them they don’t really care.Most of my customers say this “As long as it surfs nice I’ll be happy, if it’s pretty as well it’s a bonus”
Wouldn’t it be true that a board that is perfectly symetrical etc would > work best in perfect conditions.As I see it a wave is a constantly > changing medium rarely perfect and you only have a partial section of your > board in contact with the water at ony one time, then you are on a curved > and sloped surface with one side of your board riding up the slope and the > other riding down the slope.I always try to build my boards as symetrical > as possible but I have had customers bring their favourite board in to > duplicate and I ask them do they want me to include the twist, rail > wobbles, offset box etc when you point it out they can’t believe it’s true > about their fave board but ultimately if that’s the best they’ve ridden > and it works for them they don’t really care.Most of my customers say this > “As long as it surfs nice I’ll be happy, if it’s pretty as well it’s > a bonus” Yes,this is necessary.Come on guy’s.Just make the best toy for surfing you can make.Im telling you,if you take more pride and time on this art,and remember where it came from you will create something that you and your friend’s will be proud of.And in 30 or 40 year’s when you see it at art show it will blow your mind. Think about what you really are doing in every board you shape.I really don’t care about the glass job. It’s just covering up my shape. I dont want it glassed ever. But it get’s it just becouse.Sorry im rambling again.
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ve been thinking that aside from the "selling point" > appearence of a board in the showroom , the issue of fine craftsmanship > and possibly the size of the builders ego, i can understand why the sides > and bottom of a board and fins have to be fairly smooth to work well.>>> but lets get brutally honest here->>> why does the deck have to be smooth or glossy, and why does the outlines > template and both sides of the rails have to be perfectly symetrical? it > sure seems like less concern for "craftsmanship" where it > doesnt really matter and more only where it really counts would result in > a drastically lower-priced board that still rides great.>>> so-- IS THIS HERESY??? or am i right in assuming much of a new board`s > cost is simply tied to the fact that its got to sell more than ride?>>> bud h. Bud, then I guess we all need to get boards from the guy at Amco, I worked on a transmission once. How hard can a surfboard be? The guys who don’t care get a nice Realm Board and others choose shapers and craftsmens like myself that give them 40 years experience, in and out of the water. If the person doing the work is incapable of true, clean lines, with a concept of what makes it all work, then by all means, please pay accordingly. Next, at the 99 cent store.
I’m pretty sure that most of us consider our shapes to be a reflection/extension of ourselves. If a board turns out mishapen, with a lumpy, bubbly glass job it probably means the builder is just starting out or just doesn’t give a shit. How good can that be? Re: symmetry - check out Al Merrick’s H-2001 noserider! http://www.almerrick.com/2_3_body_print.htm
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ve been thinking that aside from the "selling point" > appearence of a board in the showroom , the issue of fine craftsmanship > and possibly the size of the builders ego, i can understand why the sides > and bottom of a board and fins have to be fairly smooth to work well.>>> but lets get brutally honest here->>> why does the deck have to be smooth or glossy, and why does the outlines > template and both sides of the rails have to be perfectly symetrical? it > sure seems like less concern for "craftsmanship" where it > doesnt really matter and more only where it really counts would result in > a drastically lower-priced board that still rides great.>>> so-- IS THIS HERESY??? or am i right in assuming much of a new board`s > cost is simply tied to the fact that its got to sell more than ride?>>> bud h. I really cant agree or disagree with your statement, but a board that doesnt look good, probably wont sell. Generally speaking, a board that looks good means that whoever took part in its construction took pride in his work. I like to have my boards glossed and polished, it makes them look nicer for a longer period of time. Sanded finish boards, while some say maybe stronger, look half finished to me.
It’s true that a board that doesn’t look good will probably not sell to the public, and therefore put a boardmaker in “the red”. However, what’s REALLY important when YOU’RE droppin’ in a wave that’s bigger than you’re used to? It’s the overall board design and dimensions customized for the individual rider! It’s all-round board performance that has some latitude! Not just a cool wood tail block or a hot airbrush job that’s admired in the back of ones pickup. Cool “extras” are what help catch the customer’s eye and make it sell. Board performance is what makes the customer return for another board.>>> I really cant agree or disagree with your statement, but a board that > doesnt look good, probably wont sell. Generally speaking, a board that > looks good means that whoever took part in its construction took pride in > his work. I like to have my boards glossed and polished, it makes them > look nicer for a longer period of time. Sanded finish boards, while some > say maybe stronger, look half finished to me.
It’s true that a board that doesn’t look good will probably not sell to > the public, and therefore put a boardmaker in “the red”. > However, what’s REALLY important when YOU’RE droppin’ in a wave that’s > bigger than you’re used to? It’s the overall board design and dimensions > customized for the individual rider! It’s all-round board performance that > has some latitude! Not just a cool wood tail block or a hot airbrush job > that’s admired in the back of ones pickup. Cool “extras” are > what help catch the customer’s eye and make it sell. Board performance is > what makes the customer return for another board. Ok guy’s.I promise this will be my last say in this matter…Well,maybe not.$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$.This is not even close to why i shape board’s.Customer’s? Sell?Return for another board? I GET TO SHAPE SURFBOARDS.YOU GET TO SHAPEBOARDS.Really? Is that not enough? Please tell me it is.Please.
polished bottom and rails feel slippery (besides beeing weaker), while a sanded finish gives more rail and hull control and is faster (besides being stronger)!
polished bottom and rails feel slippery (besides beeing weaker), while a > sanded finish gives more rail and hull control and is faster (besides > being stronger)! where did you get this information from???
where did you get this information from??? And why would you care.
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ve been thinking that aside from the "selling point" > appearence of a board in the showroom , the issue of fine craftsmanship > and possibly the size of the builders ego, i can understand why the sides > and bottom of a board and fins have to be fairly smooth to work well.>>> but lets get brutally honest here->>> why does the deck have to be smooth or glossy, and why does the outlines > template and both sides of the rails have to be perfectly symetrical? it > sure seems like less concern for "craftsmanship" where it > doesnt really matter and more only where it really counts would result in > a drastically lower-priced board that still rides great.>>> so-- IS THIS HERESY??? or am i right in assuming much of a new board`s > cost is simply tied to the fact that its got to sell more than ride?>>> bud h. The shop is in business to sell surfboards so the boards it sells should ride as good as it looks. I think both aspects go hand in hand when a customer is looking for a board. If your boards dont ride good, word of mouth spreads fast that your shapes suck and vice versa.
I may be off base here but it seems to me if the cost of materials for a > board cost about $150.00 and the surf shop marks the board up $100.00 than > all this craftmanship is worth about $200.00. When you split that between > a shaper,glasser,sander,and shipper its hard for me to see how anyone even > makes a living doing this. The fact the board turns out symetrical and is > smooth is totally amazing! Is it supposed to come out symetrical??? Anyone can shape a symetrical board…the true talent lies in wavey rail lines and un even decks. (just havin alittle fun here) All along I’ve been shaping under the wrong premis…and I’m with you…how does anyone make a living doing this.