looking down on longboards

General Discussion
21

A lot of it depends on when/where you’re surfing, I think. Lets face it… like it or not, there are “longboard days” and “shortboard days.” If you go out at a spot dominated by shortboards, that’s a performance wave, on a head high or overhead day that’s not really suited for longboarding, you’re gonna get some looks. And if you’re trying to shortboard at what I call a longboard wave spot, you’re gonna get frustrated really quickly by all the longboarders sitting outside and getting the long rides. My experience has been that that’s how “longboarders” get a bad rap… either by frustrated shortboarders who choose not to ride longboards when the waves call for one, or by longboarders who are out in conditions that are not really appropriate for their equipment, and their performance shows that clearly. So for me, more equipment choices means more fun, and more days maximizing the potential of the waves that day.

That aside, bad etiquitte is bad etiquette, regardless of what you ride.

22

Some of the things I say in this post will fuel the fire on both sides.  A lot of what I will say is reminiscent of an article Lance Collins wrote in surfer back in the early 90s, in the early part of the longboard resurgence.  In essence, I will simply list the reasons why I ride longboards.

1)  Most importantly, at the places where I surf, paddling out on a shortboard will essentially guarantee that I get no set waves, have to paddle for scraps, and generally have a less than stellar time out in the water.  95% of the people are out on longboards, and I have had much more fun since realizing, around 1997, that I had to join them because there was no way I could beat them.

2)  Yes, I have trouble paddling shortboards.  Could be because I haven't been able to surf very often since getting a full time job 10 years ago.  Could be because I had major back surgery in 1994 which hampers my paddling, could be because I'm tall and just lack the natural skill that a lot of you guys have on shortboards.  I recently got a Fish and am enjoying it, but I don't take it out unless I feel the conditions are such that the longboard is a liability - i.e., beachbreak, hollower waves, bigger surf, low tide, etc.  I definitely have trouble catching waves on it when the waves are smaller or mushy.  It's frustrating.  Once I take off, though, I can ride competently, do cutbacks, off the tops, etc., and I don't fall very often, if at all.

3)  I do not snake, hog waves, drop in on people, let my board go flying, etc.  I was raised to be courteous and this holds true in the lineup.  Flip side, if someone is hogging waves, dropping in or just generally being a dick, that person gets dropped in on.  GIve respect to get respect in the lineup.  As mentioned in #1, there just aren't very many (if any) shortboards in the lineups I frequent.

4)  I wish I could ride a 6'4" like so and so.  Don't get me wrong.  Whether I'm not in good enough shape to do so, not a good enough athlete, etc., I'm not sure of the reason.  Small boards do not work for me, period.  Even when riding my fish, I really miss the glide of the longboard.  It seems to me that longboards *want* to catch waves and accelerate in the pocket, whereas short chips are so draggy and have so little float that the rider generates most of the propulsion.  Two completely different types of surfing, in my opinion.

Some of you will read this and say: "well, the guy admitted that he can't ride a 6'4" modern thruster and therefore he's using the longboard as a crutch."  If that's the conclusion you reach, so be it.  It doesn't mean, however, that I can't skillfully and competently maneuver a longboard, position myself well, and ride smoothly.  Not all of us are born to be Dane Reynolds (or whomever), and being 6'1", I've always viewed my height as a liability in the surf.

23

I have never understood the “longboarders vs shortboarders” thing.  Surfing is surfing.  As with everything else, there are those who show respect to others and those who don’t.  In 46 years of surfing, I never rode a longboard until about seven years ago when I helped start Hydro Epic, and all they made was a 9 lb 9’1".  For a few years I mostly rode longboards… although I treated them the same as a shortboard.  It didn’t matter if it was six inches or triple overhead.  Longboards can be versatile tools.

Lately I’ve been back on shortboards.  My wavecount isn’t as high, but I’m getting more out of paddling.  

Some of the bad rap longboarders get may be because that’s what most beginners are sent out on.  They haven’t learned proper etiquette… they may paddle for every wave, drop in on others, ditch their boards at the wrong times, etc.  Shortboarders can do this too, but with less success catching waves.  Instead of launching 9’+ projectiles, they’re bobbing obstacles on the inside.

Proper etiquette is paramount to keeping a happy lineup.  Follow the rules, be respectful, give waves, smile and be happy.  We’re surfing after all.  I don’t get how people can have such bad attitudes doing something so (potentially) spiritual.  I don’t surf because I’m trying to prove anything to anyone.  I surf because it’s the most gratifying thing I can do.  I respect the right of others to have the same connection.  I don’t judge others by what they ride (unless it’s a spoon… kidding).  I don’t care about getting approval for what I ride.

 

Bob Pearson told me a funny story a while back.  He was surfing a longboard at one of his home breaks in Santa Cruz, and a kid on a shortboard paddles over to him and says - “get out of the water you longboard kook” (if you’ve ever seen Bob surf, you know he’s not a kook).  Bob looks over and sees the kid is riding a Pearson Arrow.  He doesn’t say anything.  As the kid is paddling away another guy says “do you know who you just called a kook?”  The kid paddles back to apologize.  Bob says - “f__k you, get off my board”.  The kid goes home with his tail between his legs.

 

 

24

What with the diversity of craft in the water these days, you almost have to specifically define exactly what you mean by “longboard”.  Anything longer than what YOU’RE riding?  Over 9 foot?  Must weigh more than 15 pounds? 50/50 rails only? Anything exceeding certain, arbitrary nose/tail/wide-point measurements?  Is a Walden Compact Disk a longboard or a shortboard?  How about a 7’4" Aipa “Big Boy” Stinger (15-11/16N and 14-7/8"T, but 23-5/8W and 3-3/4" thick)?  With all the hybrid/retro-ish/mid-length stuff floating around, it starts getting blurry.

 

Might just be easier for us to all agree to hate on kayakers who paddle into the lineup…  

 

;-) 

 

 

25

 

I employ the two chance rule - If you snake me (or others) twice, I’ll snake you.  If I give you waves and you blow the takeoff twice, I stop giving.  Everyone can make a mistake.  Two in a row means you don’t care enough for me to care back.  

Happy surfers can fall as much as they want and still get my respect.  Just don’t expect me to roll out a red carpet for you if we’re both in position :wink:

Agro dudes get my hairs up, and make me want to bitch-slap them.  Guys who paddle into a crowded spot filled with beginners then throw attitude about it bring out my inner monster.  Even if a beginner does something stupid, reaction should never be in the form of physical threats (unless we’re talking “big-name” critical spots that beginners have no business being out in).  The closest I’ve been to a physical altercation in the water was when some pro was scaring the shit out of a beginner tourist in knee-high Waikiki.  The tourist was shaking in fear as the pro was threatening an ass-whooping for “nearly killing him by dropping in”.  After several minutes I couldn’t take it anymore.  I had to paddle between them and break it up.  I took the heat for the beginner so I wouldn’t have to watch.  I had to spend the better part of a week dealing with that guy.  He’d say “everyone knows me”… to which I’d say “and they all think you’re an asshole”.  One of his surfing buddies came up to me and told me they surf together every day, and they’re great friends, but… “he can be a jerk sometimes”.

26

To beerfan…

Don’t let the little car stop you. That’s what roof racks are for. Or just fold down all the seats and slide it in (back seats down, front seat without the head piece pulled all the way forward but laid down so the backrest lays back over the folded back seats). My girlfriend drives a corolla and can fit my 9’4" Christenson single-fin inside if its just her driving.

 

 

enjoy the ride…

27

personally tankers make me lazy and only seem to get fatter

riding bigger and bigger boards like always buying looser fitting clothes 

I hate surfing my tankers and then switching back to paddling a 6'2 fish or 6'8 high performance cause its painful

going the other way is way better because your legs get stronger for your shorter boards.

But the problem is that everything is slower on a tanker so when you move down to your potato chip your timing and foot positioning is all off

Pretty much everyone I know rides tankers/longboard and absolute rips like a shortboard on them but its because of their physical girth and age.

But ever since Lance and the boys started riding them back in the late 80's early 90's

a high performance 9'0 became the new hog everywave shortboard.

I have close to a dozen longboards from a 7/11 Surftech Nugget that paddles like a 9'0 to a 10'0 Jim Turnbull Country Surfboards Bonzer bottom thruster which is still my all time favorite other than an old Yater Ramsey Jay I rode in the 70's

If it's super small I'll play on my longboards or if I get really pissed off and frustrated I'll go home(5minutes from the beach) and get a longboard and make all the wave hogging longboarders pay for their selfishness. That last thing you want to do is make a pissed off shortborder whose riding a 6'2 jump on a something with 3x the paddle power and snake you one every wave you want to take off on then out paddle you back out everytime.

Also just because you ride a "big" board doesn't mean it can't be your shortboard the 250lb-350lb local laborers in my line up prove it to me everytime. I see the same thing regarding SUPs the big boys who were absolutely ripping on the their 10'-11' 3"-4" thick longboards are doing the same on their 9'2"-9"6" Blane Chambers shaped high performance SUPs. They are pulling off turns and moves that most of the longboarders can't even do. Then you have all the bowlegged wobbly buggy eyed SUP wannabees looking like the same type of wannabees populating the line up on their longboards.

What amazes me is how people assume just because you ride a longboard you have to surf like its 1960-1970 or something. Why not come off the bottom and stick that extra 3 feet of nose into the pitching lip and take the air drop floater back down to do it again. I just don't see most longboarders these days willing to pull the longboard moves we used to do in the early 90's.

BTW I don't mind banging rails or running over any wave hogging jerks or shooting my board every now and then as a reminder. If you don't like it then go in or go home. 

I'm like Kendall and will give everyone the benefit of the doubt but if you come out and don't know how to share the ocean in a crowded situation then expect one of us to drop in not behind or in front but on top of you or kick out or eject our boards right through you.

I was taught by our beachboy surfing uncles and lineup veteran heroes that everyone should get a chance to catch wave beginner or veteran, if you can't share the ocean experience with a smile then you don't belong out there. Also learn how to ride the whole damn wave start to finish not just the best 25 yards of it and paddle back out cause its such a waste of one of nature's most fabulous creations. 

It's all part of the surfing learning experience in my book 

some folks just never learned these things.

So you teach...

Aloha comes in many forms and in the end hopefully it all ends up better

28

I always love this eternal type of question... not really a question, but you understand.  born in '70, am approaching my 40th in March '10, grew up surfing my older brother's hot buttered single fins, then onto tri's... skipped twins at that time... rode high performance shortboards most my life until the longboard resurge in early 90's (my early 20's), Jeff Kramer stuff... really a result imo of the Tom Curren fireball fish trip to Indo... really imo we're all still enjoying the ripple effects of this one episode in time; rode a 9'0 (or so) hp longboard, tri-fins and 2+1's, for almost a decade... I just wanted to learn how to ride them, now I know...and this permeates still in my surfing life... always open mindedness to new boards, new rides, new glides... have gone thru another shortboard phase, mostly hp fish type boards, CI Twin keel, Anderson quad physh, Greg Griffin 4/5 fin Modfish, Hynson BKQ... have only recently purchased (laid away) an hp Eberly longboard 2+1 (I say hp but its 9'1 x 23 x 3.125... not really hp nor do I ride that way) I just like the ride, the glide, trim, nose rides/cheaters, fade left go rights, taking closeouts and getting in early and getting a ride to closeout tube w the occasional made tube... have not owned an lb for about 4-5 years, really looking forward to having one again...there is really very little (maneuvers/types of waves surfed) that I have not done on a longboard (within reason) that I have not done on a shortboard... my pov is I want to know how to ride as many craft well as I can, and to be averse to experimenting/different craft pretty much goes against all I consider to be surfing...

Donkeys, idiots and wave hogs... they ride all models and shapes, short, long, paddleboards, kayaks, SUPS... it's an etiquette thing... if you are a douche, you are a douche, the board makes no entrance into the equation imo, I'll gladly (politely) tell you to paddle the other way, but really I'll paddle away first, you're ruining my session, the sooner I get away from you the better as far as I am concerned... but I must say in my local area, this happens very rarely, people know the rules, people are fairly low key, just wanting to have a fun surf and all boards and craft can be seen in the water...its actually a pleasure to be a surfer here imo, other than its north east coast Florida, but worse locations can be had... be happy with what you got, ride what you like, experiment, have fun, mind your manners, don't be a douche... what you ride is a zero matter to me  

Let’s not kid ourselves, many (that does not mean ALL) who knock the longboard, don't know how to ride them and have never tried...they speak from complete ignorance; or they did try it and couldn’t commit to learning how to becoming proficient at riding one so they resent them because of their own failure.

 

 

 

 

 

29

Overlooking Wrong Boards

 

                 As the seasons pass

with an enthusiasm

for surfing well, … as good is not enough,

the board diciplines remain the

specific challenge.

 

when mastery of a given design parameter

is achieved ,that becomes a boring no-challenge

 

The ‘masters’ of each era  were put upon to make an alternative 

choice of design.All others following suit on “Proven Designs”

are essentially following use and performance templates.

The comments of knowledgeable  students of surfing literature

and media infused hype can indeed be valid.

 The WORLD of surfing  and the use of 

ALL KINDS OF BOARDS and other surfcraft  is the dominion

of the hawaiian surfrider.

The fact that the buffalo K. longboard contest

adds another venue almost yearly

to the list of events is earth shaking.

Can you feel the earth move?

If you cannot feel the earth move

you will be forgiven your shallow 

state of grace. Perhaps you surf in a place

where ever bord design doesnt work well.

 

The joy of each and every wave

riding with whatever you choose 

is life changing. The angst amongst 

individuals in conflicting mindsets

is boring,and best left to adolescents

in need of validation.

 

 

Looking down on all this from far enough

above the male-strom we can be confident

that riding a wave is still way cooler than

rubbing out a high gloss ona hot rod

at Mels Drive-in … if you know how to swim.

 

 

…ambrose…

 

''hey man that was a great ride

you sure have the right board for today.‘’

 

 

 

30

The longest board i can fit is 8'0, otherwise i have to stick the nose/tail out the passenger window, and then i can't see. Also, i dont like the idea of leaving the board on the car, expecially if i surf before work ( a lot ), as i do 12 hour shifts. Probably wouldn't get stolen, but god if it did i'd be kicking myself.

When i get one i'll figure out a way hahah.

 

Cheers

 

 

31

While in the water yesterday I couldn't help but notice the diversity in surfcraft choices.  Literally everything from bellyboards to SUPs.  Maybe the spot was below the threshold of congested gridlock which exists at some spots but everyone seemed pretty tolerant of each other. 

The line posted by Ambrose is perfect... just substitute "mainland", "East Coast", "Australian", etc for "Hawaiian." 

 

"The WORLD of surfing  and the use of 

ALL KINDS OF BOARDS and other surfcraft  is the dominion

of the hawaiian surfrider."

32

I don’t look down on longboarders, but I look down the beach at them when it’s small, and I’m out numbered… I don’t care…

One thing around these parts -  I’m sure I’ve said this before -  There are lot’s of folk who only long board, so when it get’s bigger/heavier most of them are not in the water.

I’ve confessed this before too - I ride an 8’er most the time: Semi-gunnish, w/tail kick for performance… So, in a way, I’m my own one man kook club… Ha!

33

Classic Kendall

F___k you, get off my board

34

I used to be a longboarder, now i’m just a surfer…

 

I love longboarding, big heavy noseriders that make you cross step &  drop knee to make the wave, boards that beg you to fade left pivot right & scamper to the nose to hang five, ten, heels foot drag whatever. I happen to live 5 minutes from on of the best logging waves in our country & when it’s under head high there’s not as much fun in riding anything else.

 

But… it’s a hell of a good wave on a fish, quad or keel, it does a good enough impression of a point (its a beach break) to make a hull a hell of a lot of fun. There’s a heavy barrelling beachbreak just round the corner that is a true modern day performance wave that will snap your 6’1 thruster if it’s in the mood

 

So i guess my point is this, true there are plenty of people i know that use the extra length as a crutch but there are plenty who surf a shortboard equally as well as a longboard and choose their ride based on the conditions at hand or the particular feel they fancy on a given day.

 

hell it’s all surfing, as long as you’re having fun & not ruining anyone elses thats all that counts right?

35

 

That’s a funny story!! When I lived in SC you could drive from the lighthouse to Capitola and not see more than 6 longboards, total. This between '79 and '81. Doc Scott and a few older guys were the only ones who rode them.

Oh, and some punk kid who used to surf P Point. I had words with him, once. Too much attitude, not enough ability.

36

 

I bet I know where… A spot where you can see the “OM” from the water? A place that has bands (lots of reggae).

 

And, for the record…

Young attractive females get no more slack than anyone else. There’s a woman who lives in my area who constantly drops in on people.  She will then say something like:  “I’m a girl, don’t yell at me”. Tough shit. She is from the W Coast and has been surfing long enough to know better. Some guys think she’s attractive. I think they have low standards.

The only people who get slack from me are little kids. Adults are subject to the three strike rule. I don’t care who they are, where they’re from, what they ride, or what they look like.

37

Quote - “I’m like Kendall and will give everyone the benefit of the doubt but if
you come out and don’t know how to share the ocean in a crowded
situation then expect one of us to drop in not behind or in front but
on top of you or kick out or eject our boards right through you.”

 

Regardless of what’s going on in the water, I will never understand people acting proud or “in the right” about intentionally running people over or “shooting” their boards at people.

38

[quote="$1"]

 Young attractive females get no more slack than anyone else. There's a woman who lives in my area who constantly drops in on people.  She will then say something like:  "I'm a girl, don't yell at me". Tough shit. She is from the W Coast and has been surfing long enough to know better. Some guys think she's attractive. I think they have low standards.

[/quote]

 

There's a particularly hideous broad who surfs First Point Malibu.  Last time I was out on a crowded day, she was taking off way deep towards the Kiddie Bowl and not making any waves.  People naturally started taking off on her since she had no chance of making it.  She started getting irritated, and on one wave yelled "myyyyyyyy waaaaaave!!" at the top of her lungs while taking off.  She didn't quite get off the word "waaaaaave", as she did a stand-up pile-driver vertically towards the bottom on takeoff. 

She tried calling people off the next wave, too. 

You'd better know what the hell you're doing before calling people off set waves. 

39

Yes, right out in front of the O.

I was making a joke, not asking for slack. I rarely surf there anymore because the localism has gotten to a ridiculous degree and I don’t like dealing with cocky aggro guys who feel entitled. I always surf with respect for everyone in the water, that is until you cross me more than once. I always yield to the older guys, don’t take more than my fair share of waves during the session, and I make a point to not drop in on anyone (to a fault really, I’ve had guys take advantage of that). I knew someone who almost got his ass beat by a couple of the guys because he was surfing a longboard and taking every wave. I still think he should have gotten knocked around because even with that threat he’s still a wave hog. He gives longboarders a bad name and I don’t associate with him anymore.

What happened to this being a community of people who shared a common goal and passion? I don’t care what you ride, as long as you treat me with the same respect I give you.

40

 

Bad manners are not attractive.  I give waves in this order:

  1. old Hawaiians

  2. old anyone else 

  3. girls and ladies - the polite ones

  4. stoked groms

  5. people who aren’t getting any waves

It’s like holding the door open for people.  When is it a bad idea to be polite?  

Aggro surfers get aggro back.  I can kick an ass (or a few) if need be, although you have to try really hard to get me there.  I try not to be a wave hog.  Some people may think I am.  I get my share.  I also spend a lot of time bobbing and watching.