Looking to expand my board quiver, need advice

Hi,

I’ve been surfing for almost 3 years (3 years this september). I started on a 7’8" Jeff Alexander Speed Egg. Spent some time on a 7’2" hot dog shape and tried various other short board designs until I found one that worked for me. I sold all of my boards and bought a used 6’4" Firewire Dominator and that has been an awesome board (6’4" tall x 21" wide x 2.75" thick). When I bought it, I was looking for a “do-it-all” board that would be good in most waves I surfed. This was about 5 months ago and I was planning on using it mostly for waves from 1’ up to 6’.

While I can catch waves in that range, on the low or high end of that range the board does not perform all that well. With small waves, 1-2 feet I stand up and lose power, even if I pump the rails. On bigger waves, the board just feels to wide (at 21"). Since I don’t have the balls to commit to a 6 or 7 foot wave most of the time, I’m not sure if the board can make the drop and get me out of there in time.

I went out in 4’ to 7’ at Tourmaline on Saturday and the board definitely wasn’t right. I went there because the waves are softer and gentler so I had more confidence, but also the waves are slower and flatter. When I did catch one, I turned right out of it because it wasn’t steep enough for the turn I was trying to do.

So here’s the challenge, I now want a longer board, 7’6" to 8’ that will do well in small surf (1-2 feet) as well as work on those bigger days 5’+. Does this exist? Will an egg type shape with a pointier nose work in overhead waves? Or will I get killed? I’m looking at this board which looks like an interesting shape, but I’m still learning, so have no idea where to go with this…

http://sandiego.craigslist.org/nsd/spo/3856127765.html

Thoughts?

I’d go for a fish. Mine works in tiny, longboard only type waves, on up to head high very well. Considering your level of experience, I think you’ll be very happy with one. Mine is a retro style, twin keeled fish, with a few subtle modern tweaks… slight single to double out the back concaves, and a touch of added flip in the nose. Other than that, it’s short, wide, and thick, with wood glass-ons, down rails, and a beaked nose. Even did the resin tint bottom/swirl inlay deck, with resin pinlines. You’d never guess it was (GASP!) EPS/Epoxy! But just those little changes opens up the performance envelope considerably.

Thanks NJ,

Does a fish paddle as easy as a longboard? I only rode a longboard for the first time recently, after I’d been surfing for two years, and I was amazed at how easy it is to get into a wave. Actually more fun than I expected, but lacks turning ability. Would a fish have the same ease of getting into the wave? So far I’ve tried spud designs and short fat boards, not an actual fish, and I didn’t think it was that easy to paddle. Somewhat easier yes, but not as easy as a longboard.

i think its more about technique than anything else…

how big are you?

I’m 5’8", around 200lbs and almost 60 and my 6’4" Firewire Potatonator(Mix of a Dominator and Sweet Potato) has way more floatation and paddles better than anything I’ve ridden in that small including my new 6’4"x 23"x3" HP big boy shortboard

I’ve seen guys ride 5’6" Dominators at Hanalei and just rip the snot out of that wave while I’ve ridden mine in 1’ White Plains wind slop and was able to skip the board along fast enough to get air if I wanted or knew how to.

I think these boards are wide stance backfooters especially as quads so if you are a heavy front footer it could lead to the bogging and performance issues. I had the same problem on my first couple of rides on the Potatonator where I kept catching my outside rail trying to cut back because of the width of that beast. But once I adjusted my stance way back on my stomp pad and widened my stance the board really flew and sliced and diced. I grew up in the 70’s surfing beak nose narrow tailed single fins like Terry Fitzgerald so all this quad/thruster shake and bake is foreign to me.

Over time though I’ve become less and less a fan of funsized or boards with too much length and an advocate of trying to get as small as possible without losing my ability to paddle into a wave.Maybe I’m channeling Cheyne, but I believe to truly “mind surf” you should never have to worry or move your feet once you get going. You body and board should just follow what ever you mind what to do with the wave. It’s a rare occasion but once it happens to you you won’t forget that wave or that session.

I’ve had a 7’2" Patagonia Mako (high performance Rocket Sled), a 7’ and 7’6" Parmenter Stubb Vector and 6’8" Malolo fish, a 6’8" Keone Downing Slippah fish, a Randy French Surftech 8’ hybrid, and a 7’11" Surftech McCoy Nugget and a the same time have a 6’4" Mandala quad, a Greg Griffin 6’2" 5-Fin Fish and 6’4" Modfish. All these boards do something well but none of them do everything well.

The problem with slop is in catching the waves and then maintaining forward momentum when’s there’s no “push” behind them. The problem with juicy waves is first of all getting out without getting destroyed, paddling in early into thick walls and then controlling all the speed, severe curves and turbulence from the foam ball. Hard to find a single shape that does all that well.

Your Dominator should work in all the conditions you’ve described if not maybe going to an “Advance” model for similar FW feeling and a more front foot attack. Try changing your fin setups as well depending on conditions. In junky waves I’d probably ride it as a quad with 4 smaller flat sided or inside foiled fins while on bigger waves I’ve beef up the fins, switch to double sided rears and maybe even switch to a thruster setup with bigger side fins.

If had to live with only a single board for the rest of my life it probably would be a fairly thin pulled in nose high performance 9’2" longboard with a bonzer or simple vee bottom and a 2+1 fin setup (kind of like the ones from the early 90’s). Decent nose and tail rocker to handle the drops and faces but not so much so you could still run the flats. Get one of these made strong but not too heavy and you’ll be set for a long time no matter the conditions.

 

These are just all observations, you’ll have to find out what works best for your style and kind of waves you prefer. No one here surfs like you and no one here knows exactly what you are trying to get out of it all only you do. Sometimes if you pretend that your current board is the last board on the planet you’d be surprised what you’ll find your self capable of doing with it in any conditions

 

Best of luck with your pursuit

Nice write up, Oneula, very spot on, and you’d be wise to read it carefully, 007, lot of info there. 

Board selection is totally subjective, variables of experience, age, size, style, and local conditions = no one size fits all.

You’re early in your surfing progression, and a common mistake for a newbie to make is jumping from shape to shape, looking for that special board that will suddenly accelerate their advancement, whereas in reality only water time and commitment will improve your surfing.

And you actually had the right board for the small and overhead range.  A speed egg is perhaps the most versatile single board with a great range.  Lots of paddle and glide for the smaller days, with plenty of top end speed and long driving turns for well overhead waves.

It’s weakness, however, is in waves in which the shorter rail line of a HPSB allows you to carve off the bottom and top much more vertically, and fit the board into the pocket easier.

the best choice is a quiver.  Longboard for small days, as nothing beats their glide, standard HPSB for midrange waves, and a step-up for bigger waves.  If not ready for a full quiver, however, think about a return to another speed egg like you had.

 

The problem with slop is in catching the waves and then maintaining forward momentum when’s there’s no “push” behind them. The problem with juicy waves is first of all getting out without getting destroyed, paddling in early into thick walls and then controlling all the speed, severe curves and turbulence from the foam ball. Hard to find a single shape that does all that well.

Yes nice write up indeed, I think this is exactly my problem right here, although I’ve never put it into words so well. The front vs back foot idea is new to me as well and something I had not considered. I’ll have to think more about my footing and hope that one day, I won’t think about it and just ‘mind surf’, LOL. All of that fin talk, I’m still pretty new and not fully following what you’re saying… I’ve learned a lot about board shapes, I guess fins is next. Funny what you said about pretending my board was the last board on the planet. I actually sold all of my other boards and commited to learning this one. This was the only board I’ve had for the past few months, specifically so that I could not try anything else. It seemed to work pretty well. I’m sure I have further to go, but I get the concept.

Icc, I think this is what I’m doing, you’re right, I’m expecting to find that ‘magic’ board.

You’re early in your surfing progression, and a common mistake for a newbie to make is jumping from shape to shape, looking for that special board that will suddenly accelerate their advancement

Damn, shouldn’t have sold my speed egg. How do I tell the difference in a speed egg vs. a regular egg?

“Damn, shouldn’t have sold my speed egg”

here’s one that looks to be a good replacement for you:

http://sandiego.craigslist.org/csd/spo/3862866528.html

 

I don’t think there’s any do-it-all board to cover the range and conditions you’re talking about.  At your stage I think you’ll need at least two boards and they’ll likely have some overlap.  

 

The Dominator should handle the middle and upper ends of the conditions you’re talking about.  For the conditions prevalent in this region it is probably the most versatile shape Firewire does.   And as shapes go it will most likely outsurf your personal capabilities for some time to come.    My guess is that the problem you’re having is not being back far enough on the tail to take advantage of the fin cluster and move the tail around.   Run it as a quad and get your fins right - that makes a big difference on quads.    

For the lower end a typical San Diego egg in the 7ft+ ranges is pretty versatile for smaller sized surf.  It’s not so long that the length will get in your way in short period beach break and yet it still retains the extra length and paddle power to get you into the small stuff.   I don’t think most people who surf the eggs have the skill it takes to make a thruster work so I think a 2+1 or quad setup on those is better for most people.  A single fin works well on those but that requires a very different approach and most people aren’t trying to learn different ways to surf a wave.  

The Dominator was designed locally and the eggs were refined locally to fit the conditions we see around here.   You could get away with one or the other as a one-board quiver, but having both will make it easier for you to handle the entire range you’re talking about.    And be mindful of your foot placement.

 

That’s a good buy from a legend shaper

They say a picture is worth a thousand words so here is my anthology

To serve as a final warning since your are new to this all and have been bitten by the diseased bug of “hmmm, what’s next”

and before you spend tens of thousand of dollars like I have in search of the next “thing”,

 

save your money and just stick with one or two as mentioned above and do your best to learn them and surf them into the ground before you go out and get another. Learning to patch and keep your stick in shape to last is an art form long lost in today’s disposable age of buy sell or trade… At most buy different fins to try as they used to be cheaper and I think in the long run you will be happier and a better surfer for the experience

There is nothing you can buy that will bring you greater results than allot of water time and practive in waves of all types and the learning of proper technique for each and every condition you are faced with. With that knowlege and acquired “muscle memory” you will have more fun and rip on just about anything that you are given to ride. That is the holy grail which we refuse to see that’s sitting right in front of our eyes. 

otherwise you will pursue a similar misadventures like many of us already have

this represents perhaps just 1/4-1/3 of a wasteful investment to find a surfing panacea since I restarted surfing full time in 1990

its starts at a young age and can become a financial nightmare (unless you can afford it) over time

take heed…

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Keith, well it doesn’t get any more obvious than that, what with the word “speed” on the board.

gdaddy, thanks for the tips on foot placement

Wow, oneula, that is a lot of boards… some really beautiful ones in there too.

Great advice all. I’m going to look into that tony staples board, I did see that on there, especially if you say he’s a legend shaper (still not familiar with all the names)

What is a 2+1 setup? Isn’t that a thruster? Yeah, not interested in single fin.

this board looks interesting

http://sandiego.craigslist.org/nsd/spo/3863012548.html

it’s the 4th and 5th pics down, got a neat shape, not sure what he’s selling it for though

-7’4" Corey Davis Hybrid Funboard (5th and 6th pics)

speed egg - just a streamlined egg shape.  More upper end range then a ‘standard’.

 

Oneula - hella nice collection over the years, as impressive as I have ever seen…think I even saw an Arakawa quad picklefork in there…

That Corey Davis one has some Delam, i sit worth 175$? I’ll need to fix it and not sure how much that costs.