I did my first RR epoxy lamination today on a shortie Im reworking. I peeled the bottom lam off, removed the fin plugs, filled the holes with foam block (shaped to size) and reshaped the bottom from double-con/vee to single deep concave to lower centerline rocker for added speed in small surf.
After drapping a 4oz cloth and cutting, I mixed a small batch, 1/2 pint or so of slow epoxy and poured onto the cloth. I gently spread the epoxy across the bottom for about 60% coverage. Mixed a second smaller batch to cover the rest leaving the short rail laps dry. A third tiny batch was used to help wet the laps - I squeegee’d the epoxy from stringer to rail laps.
I estimated about two dozen drips on the floor (with builders paper) so almost all of the epoxy I mixed went on the board. Overall easy stuff to use with less stress and floor mess. Stoked!
Low drip lam only means high pinhole content to fill later with spackle. Also, lamination is less overall, as you fill the pinholes with spackle, not bonding agent epoxy.
What’s your time worth? What’s a few drops or half a cup of dripped resin?
I’ve had the same experience with epoxy. I got two drips from the whole board, no pinholes no nothing. I took around an hour to lam each side of an 8’ HWS and each side finally hardened after 5 hours.
The difference is in the working time. With poly its a rush to get things done, epoxy is laid back and does its stuff when its ready.
Spackle pin air? Why not just hotcoat it like normal? Pin air is minor, Some of the best and lightest lam jobs I’ve seen had pin air… big frigging deal. Cosmetics. -Carl
Basically, pinbubbles in your lam job means VOIDS in the material that attaches the cloth to the foam, leading to an easier chance of delams over time.
EVERY major epoxy board manufacturer seals the lam coat with some sort of pressure spackle add on step.
Styro likes to breathe, and the better you seal, the longer your board lasts.
The second sentence coming from working for years consulting and brainstorming with Cobra and Kinetic boardmakers.
Mike Zaicheck is the leading epoxy styro glasser in the world (windsurfing), lives about 10 miles from me, and I sail with him about once a week. He leaks me some of his secrets…sometimes.
I put on two hotcoats instead of just one…that way pin holes are not an issue…plus longtime durability is not an issue with this particular board…I use boards about one season and build replacements to satisfy my shaping addiction.
My main motivation for keeping waste drip to a min was not having to setup my lamming stands and the whole drama associated with lamming…I did this job right on the shaping stands in my garage and I just wanted keep the floor and stands sort of clean.
Im curious…if a lam/lap is fully wetted, whether its drippy or not, how can there be a difference?
LeeDD, EPS foam and epoxy resins have changed significantly in the past four years. That doesn’t mean ALL of it has changed; there’s still a ton of poor materials out there.
Proper EPS foam and epoxy resin with a surfacing agent (like Resin Research Additive F) leaves a wonderful lam with very little resin wasted. You can do this in your kitchen with some newspaper! Freelaps disappear quickly and the sides lay down nicely.
Even the super experienced epoxy glassers have to spackle after the lam, even if it’s vacuum bagged.
Long cure time is a lousy excuse to use any resin. Takes about 7-9 minutes to lam any board, double layer deck included.
5 hour cure time = that much time fumes keep coming, even if you can’t smell them.
What you can’t smell CAN harm you.
LeeDD, I strongly disagree with some of the above. Long cure time is an excellent reason to use a resin, if you’re doing a tint, a pigment that’s not opaque, you don’t want to hurry, don’t want to waste material, AND to get rid of those fumes you reference - volatiles do not add strength to a lam, so let them escape!
I’ve been making my own, and a few other people’s boards for decades. I can get a single longboard lam done in less than an hour, from placing the board on the rack, cutting the glass, mixing, lam, tuck, cleanup tools and hands, and walk away. But I would nowadays much rather use UV cure, which allows me to decide when to set the resin, than working subject to the chemistry. And I keep a catalyst ratio chart on the wall; I measure resin closely, and catalyst to the quarter of a cc. Can’t beat the cure time control of UV resin. Only need a UV flourescent bulb for evening/rainy day work now.
I agree that emissions aren’t good for you, but neither will you avoid them. So let’s concentrate on the intent of glassing, that being to get a strong board. Evaporative emissions are part of the deal.
Lee - I’ve never had significant problems with pinholes although every board, no matter what resin you use, has some. Also, having time to make the laminate right doesn’t seem to be an issue to me. Some people like lots of time and use slow, others use fast. It depends on your proficency and technique. With polyester a very fast laminator will oftentimes make a weak board by overcatalization while a slow laminator will make a very heavy board. This isn’t the case with epoxy (at least not ours). It’s designed to stay where it’s put and speed has nothing to do with the finished product only how fast you work and what the laminator is comfortable with. We also make an extra slow for very big projects which has a pot life of 200 minutes, which I’ve even seen used on boards although I never could see myself needing that. My goal is to make easy to use, high quality, safe materials that fit certian criteria and then let each person decide what’s best for them. There is no right or wrong if the end result is what you aimed for.