http://www.star-board-surf.com/technology/
Basically a multilayer sandwich board with EPS core, carbon stringer, EPP and corecell sandwich with glass and carbon used for reinforcement.
The local action magazine have had it for testing and sent it between Bali and Lombok with no bag, no damage.
The big con is the price, rumored to be 12000NOK which would be something like $2000
At That Price Coil has nothing to worry about.
Carbon stringer??. Wouldnt that fatigue??
At 2K a pop I reckon you could buy every bagage handler from Lombock to Bali many times over . LOL.
Beerfan Carbon has a lot of structural memory. Don’t forget that they use a lot of Carbon in jet aircraft constutuion as well as things like racing yachts.
Very similar to Bert’s vacuum bag thread, where Bert used Corecell skin over EPS. The problem with those build was they were too stiff.
Starboard changes the core by using EPP foam over EPS, and installing a carbon/ Corecell stringer that doesn’t touch the skin. The floating stringer, in theory, won’t do anything until the board is under extreme flex.
But exchanging EPP for 1 pound EPS won’t change anything, since 1 pound EPS is still really floppy, yet Bert’s build was still too stiff.
It will be pretty indestructible, but will still be really stiff. That stiff is going to feel like a board that is a foot longer than it really is. Is $2000 worth the price for a board that lasts 4 times longer than a regular board? Yes. but only if it rides as well as a regular board.
There are cheaper ways to get the same durability and have a better riding board.
And “testing” a board by shipping it without a board bag is just silly. Instead, test it by dropping a known weighted load onto the board. If it dings less than an other board, and still rides as well, it is better.
And on another note, their board size to rider weight chart is so far off, it is plain stupid. According to them, I should be riding a board a full foot shorter, and 1/4" thinner than my best HPSB
Jim Richardson at Surflight has been EPP stuff like this for decades
Mike Croteau with Jim invented the tech. I’m surprised no one has truely grasped what they had come up with.
Maybe the whole “soft” thing went against everyone’s grain
MIke Olson (LibTech) followed what Jim was doing back in the 1990’s-2000’s owned several of JIm’s boards and validated the tech along with collaborating with him on materials.
Jim’s materials are not the typical surfboard materials, including his fibers, and resins
Tom Morey understood the concept with his “swizzle” by basing it off a Nidacore structural center member surrounded by EPP that Mike Olson clued him onto from the aerospace industry when Tom was consulting with Boeing in the northwest.
Seems that now Coil and Gary Young seem to have moved away from an external fiberglass skin onto some other type of film. Some big secret while Drew is pusing his woven carbon railed cork skinned EPS boards and other are doing imilar things with this carbon/kevlar netting in place of cork, hd foam or bamboo veneer… Seems like just a decade ago starboard was pushing their “bamboo or wood skinned” designs
Interesting that Firewire has done the same with its paulownia skinned options following what Chris Garrett tried to promote previously
Seeing what George Gall and others are doing with Marko’s iFoam makes me an even stronger believer in what Mike Croteau envisioned 20-30 years ago which was to make the core your engine and then protect it with the shell/skin which was the exact opposite of what all the monoque hollows and surftech like monoque skinned epoxies failed to understand.
one you lose seperation between the skin and core on a normal or shell style build you lose everything but if the strength comes out from the core then it doesn’t really matter what happens to the skin especially if the core is 100% water resistant and doesn’t gas out.
…as usual, no custom orders available…ya take what ya get.
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Very similar to Bert's vacuum bag thread, where Bert used Corecell skin over EPS. The problem with those build was they were too stiff.
But exchanging EPP for 1 pound EPS won't change anything, since 1 pound EPS is still really floppy, yet Bert's build was still too stiff.
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Hey ES,
I would love to know which of Bert's boards you surfed that you felt was too stiff.
Cheers
6’0 x 24 , 6’4 x25? pretty whacky dimensions on their small wave boards
http://www.star-board-surf.com/products/boards/ultra/
oneula, your quote about croteau, marko ifoam, gall and the core being the engine vs a hollow shell is really interesting. comparable to ski/snowboard ideas which makes a lot of sense if you’re trying to build something with flex and handling characteristics beyond shape alone.
Hi wouter,
Not one of Bert’s boards, but Bert’s vacuum bag thread design.
In the famous thread, Bert said thet even he didn’t build them like that anymore. 1 pound EPS, with Corecell rails and one piece corecell skins, top and bottom are stiff. His modern Sunova design is a thinner skin, in multiple pieces.
An easy guess why everyone who makes composite boards either went to thin wood skins, a different foam, or multiple pieces of foam. If speedneedle is still around, it would be nice if he could jump in as to why his composite boards have foam skins cut into so many pieces? (expansion joints is the answer)
Ever ride a Surftech? An example of a foam cored eps board that no one likes how they ride. Too stiff.
Was Croteau a crazy man or a genius? Maybe a little of each. i had a Croteau in the mid 70s when he was working with Pat Flecky in Carlsbad. Great board with a tail that we are seeing on a lot of todays boards, a kind of a squired off hard edge swallow tail.
Pat spent a lot of time in Hawaii. He made some really nice gun shapes. After working with Mike his Boards became insanely good. Mike was a head of his time.
Listen to oneula… Read his post again and gain until you get it…
huie said it many times…
Core is king… Start with the core… end with the core… The rest is just aesthetic and hocus pocus and good intentions based on theories
When you look at the video on the home page, when the guy do the “flex test” you can see that those boards are really stiff. May be good in glassy conditions. the first full compsand Bert style i made with wood under over and rails, prelam skin Pu glued, was stiff like hell. Lot of guy walk and jump on it on sand but it’s still usable but infact nobody really want it after the first surf, they all like more my epoflex build.
Well, I think the construction have some merrit. Remember Bert saying that the core had to be spoongy to get good flex, like .75lbs EPS? Here the EPP does the spongejob, allowing the construction to flex and compress, giving it the trampoline effect that bert and greg loehr have been talking about. It might also provide a dampening effect that provide a similar feel to a PU board. It probably also give the construction better resilience, improving ding resistance. And EPP holds up better over time than EPS and doesn’t soak water. The stringer stops the board from overflexing, preventing breakage and buckling. I would think the layup is very lightweight, the inner glass is probably 2oz or less. Say the outer glass if 4oz and then the carbon fiber is layed up at +/- 45 degrees to not affect flex so much. It’s likely noncrimp so it lays down flatter then normal woven glass to have less effect on flex. Might even be a hybrid cloth with carbon and some plastic fiber since they claim it’s some sort of high flex carbon fabric.
I think it’s really hard to jugde the flex of a board from those videos, they seems to be stepping very carefully on it. On the other hand, it’s brings us back to the old discussion of how much flex is enough flex. If 2" of rocker is considered low and 3" of rocker is considered alot, then maybe 1" of flex is enough? Having a stringer that stops the rocker dead when the rocker is just optimal seems like a good idea.
On the other hand, the price is ridiculous and the construction is not exactly easy…
"If 2" of rocker is considered low and 3" of rocker is considered alot, then maybe 1" of flex is enough?"
I think that's the first time I've seen an attempt to quantitate flex distance. For a 'standard' shortboard, those numbers sound about right to me.
For me flex of surfboards is an vibration aspect like Benjamin Thompson explained. I understand that epp is only over carbon stringer, and rails are wrap with sandwich “monocoque” nothing like bert but more a surftech tuflight with a stringer and carbon. Certainly strong.
Well they look like shit, cost as much as 3 Coils, nothing even close to being able to create a custom, and will probably ride like shit
There’s a reason why MD and the Brasingtons are tight lipped about what they are doing, they have invented the ultimate way to build a surfboard and everyone else is playing catch-up.
This company shows how their construction process works for marketing reasons to convince someone to pay $2k for a board
