Noserider?

Hey all.

After some opinions/ thoughts on the best design for me and what the critical parts are to get right if its going to do what I want.

I want to make a longboard that will noseride reasonably well if I’m not in Joel Tudors class (I’m light years away). If I do it, it will be the first board I’ve shaped.

I have a 9’2 mal that is a modern longboard, can sometimes get to the nose if I am quick! Also have 6’10 Thruster and 6’4 fish. Love them all.

I’m 6’3 and 98kgs.

The board would mainly be for up to 3 ft max mainly beach breaks, not to worried about manouvarabilty, want it to be my “cruisy” board.

love to hear your thougts.

Brenden

 

 

 

**You noseride yes, noseride no, you noseride so so, ska-wishe like bug in middle of road!**

**Best IDEAS put into a noserider !!****!**

**Aloha!**

I won’t even start.  I’m sure others will voice their disagreement.  So no need for me to compare a 422 to a Nuiihwa or a Penetrator or a UFO or a - G&SStretch etc. etc.  You know the old expression  " opinions are like-------".

**Hey I read you McDing! **

**From simple advise springs endless debate, bluebottle was asking about noseriders and me thoughtless.**

**Dale is responsible for putting  EVERYTHING possible into a board to be a "noserider" no disrespect to (ah) Hobie, Gordon & Smith, Gordie, Sweet, Weber, Bing, Con I'll stop cuz just about everybody was doing it. **

**Oh and me try to revise that quick!**

**Aloha! **

Ok, not wanting to split the atom, or care if people think that noseriding isn’t worth pursuing. I was hoping someone on here migt be able to give some info on what the design should be  if they have knowledge of shaping them.

Thanks

bluebottle

I’m your size and a ten foot ish single fin does well for me as a cruiser. I don’t know a thing about nioseriding besides the times it is functional for keeping the wave and beachies don;t really lend themselves to it either. I’d recommend starting out with a shorter board though as your first but by all means go for it. 

i took a hack at it, since its your first board i wouldnt try to go for to many features. I did a 9’ 6" for mine i am around 5’ 11" my self but the height i dont think would make to much of a diffence. it has the typical concave on the nose but i went alittle to drastic and it made the board kind of pushy on the nose so you have to have a faster wave to hangout for long noserides, so be carefull of this. i personally like a square tail on mine but its personal preferance. dont go to crazy on the rocker either becasue it will make the board less stable on the nose. i by no means am a profesional shaper but i have had some success with my boards and thought that i could maybe help replay if you have any questions ill also add a picture of my board.


from Dave Parmenter’s Surfboard Design Analysis:

BOARD ONE

Kingdom: surfboard

Phylum: longboard

Class: classic longboard/neo-traditional longboard

Description: The surfboards of the classic longboard era were a drag – literally. No, they were (and still are) great to ride, it’s just that virtually every component of their design intentionally or unwittingly contributed to the forces of drag. The bottom contours, the templates, the rail shapes, rocker and fins all served, for one reason or another, to slow the board down.

Classic longboards of the '50s and '60s, as well as the modern replicas of such boards, have a clear design link to the wooden olo boards of ancient Hawaii. These boards had basically rounded, convex bottoms that attempted to reduce the drag on their enormous lengths by pushing the water aside from the centerline as the board plowed through the water. This application of a shape known as the “displacement hull” shows that in earlier times, board-builders had only canoes, and later, boats to draw their inspiration from.

The inherent drag and suction of this type of bottom granted the rider enhanced control and easier handling – there were no fins on boards prior to 1935 – if not contributing much in the way of planing speed. By the '50s, turning ability was further improved by placing more pronounced hips (the peak or wide-point of the board’s one-dimensional outline curve) farther back toward the tail. The resultant contour drag acted as a sort of power steering that let surfers of the day – at a further cost in drag – to pursue tighter turns and hotdogging.

Rails on the classic longboard were mostly of the 50/50 variety, completely round and bulbous with little or no release or breakaway edges; the water had no choice but to wrap completely around the rail onto the deck. Once again, user-friendly but slow.

Another feature of the classic longboard that relied on drag forces was the rocker profile, which usually had its peak, or apex, well behind the center of the board, and employed a heavier tail kick with a flatter nose lift. When the rider pulled the board into a tight trim along the top of the wave and moved onto the nose, this rocker design – along with many of the other previously mentioned features – created a counterbalance of drag and suction that allowed a full-grown man the ability to perch indefinitely on the very tip of the coasting surfboard.

The length, width and comparatively flat bottom rocker of the classic longboard overcame many of its drag-inducing features, giving these boards their distinctive Cadillac glide and stability, but there was a relatively low terminal velocity: these boards would only go so fast before they’d shimmy, hum and basically try to buck the rider.

Dimensions (in decimal inches):

Length: 9’8"

Nose: 16.5 inches (at 12 inches down)

Widepoint: 23 inches

Tail width: typically 15 to 16 inches (at 12inches up)

Thickness:

Nose: 1.7 inches (at 12 inches down)

Thickest point: 3 inches

Tail: 1.9 inches (at 12 inches up)

Foil: Thickness usually peaks a little behind center, with the main volume pooled around the behind-center hips and rocker apex. Thickness tapers down to a fairly thin nose and holds a medium volume as it meets the fin/tailblock area. This conjunction of foil, rocker and outline creates the characteristically slow feel of the board when turned from the tail and provides for the marked increase in speed when the rider moves forward to the optimum trim position (usually in the front third of the board), changing the whole angle of attack of the planing surfaces.

Rocker:

Nose: 3.5 inches

Tail: 3.75 inches

The apex, or peak, of the rocker curve is placed much farther back than modern boards and is centered back at the thick-point/hip area. The amount of nose-lift tends to be a lower measurement than the tail. Once again, a feature that shows the separation of the trim position of the board and the sweet spot for turning.

Bottom shape: Bottom is basically convex, as is the deck. This rounded, displacement hull-style bottom fades to a slightly flatter surface near the nose and behind the fin. This tubby hull design has its roots more in boat design – and one method of dealing with pushing a large surface with a weak power source through the water – rather than the modern, flatter planing hull-type of surfboard that skims on top of the water, but requires more power to keep it up on step and planing.

Rails: Rails are the classic 50/50 shape, with the apex at the center of the rail. Some 50/50 rails were completely round-shaped and others were more elliptical or almond-shaped. It’s a user-friendly, soft and stable rail shape but, being edge-free (water-flow wraps around rounder rails but doesn’t do so as easily around a sharp edge or corner), it’s slower and almost impossible to surf with modern body English.

Tail shape: Rounded squaretail, which carries the rail line to its maximum extension, providing the greatest amount of tail area and thus allowing for more flotation and speed in slower, weaker waves.

Stringer: .375 inches redwood/spruce/redwood T-band

Glass specs: Two layers of 10 ounces. Volan cloth top and bottom.

Fin setup: The classic longboard fin is a crude affair, little more than a stabilizer. These squarish, clumsy rudders were designed when the sciences of aerodynamics were still just so much unfathomable mumbo-jumbo. Tips were as wide as the bases, had near-vertical leading edges and were poorly foiled. So much drag was created that you can see them throwing off rooster tails in the old surf films taken at faster waves like Sunset.

Performance envelope: 1 to 4 feet

Optimum generic example: Any early to mid-'60s Hobie production board, or similar brand of that era

Thanks guys.

very much appreciated. Expect it to be fun board in crap small surf. Would you have a concave in  the nose? First board so gonna stuff it up :slight_smile: mose well go out in a blaze of glory!

 

Thanks again.

Bluebottle

I’d go with a flat bottom and toilet seat rails in the nose. A proven concept on boards like the Peck Penetrator and others. For one thing, it’s easier to shape.

WTF is that???

For first board I think less is more.

Less concave than what you see on some extremes, just enough that you get a bit of concave at the nose but also lets the water travel through easily (i.e. no rapid changes in rocker profile, nice and smooth).

Rails 50/50 or 60/40 reasonably rounded (not too pinched) make for more forgiving turns.

Rocker pretty flat through front 2/3 of rocker with more kick in the tail to help ‘suck’ the back of the board to the wave. Depending on your break you may need less or more tail kick but best copy something that works for first board.

In my limited experience I found the following good rules of thumb.

If you have a slow, fullish break you will need a wider nose and staighter rails, this helps you catch weaker waves and helps hold you up on the nose all the way into the white water.

If you have a faster break then a more piggish outline and foil works better as it helps you slot into the pocket on take off and your tail kick does most of the work when nose riding and in forward trim. With the nose and rails not so wide the board is easier to turn in more critical sections. These boards are harder to ride on the nose but the rides are more rewarding I think as you are really ‘out’ on the nose.

You then need to work out your balance between the 2 as no 2 beaches are the same or conditions vary day to day, this is where some of the more famous boards hold their own in most places and one of my fave’s is the Model-T by Takayama (glassed model), there’s nothing too exagerated and it’s a very usable board in most conditions. This would be a good starting point IMO anyway :slight_smile:

good luck.

 

 

Down rails, fairly hard edge. My noserider has that and it works like a charm. It’s an 8’0".

For an 8 foot board to be used in smaller weaker surf No concave. Concave in the nose is in-fact a stalling device. the shorter the board the more that concave area will be in the water as you paddle fora wave. slowing you down and making it more difficult to get into weak surf.  I’m not even a fan of wide nose fun boards for small weak mushy surf.  Sammy with the down rail nose is a valid design.  Tom Morey made down rail nose riders and they worked.