- Of Limited Interest…
- It’s hard to NOT come to the conclusion that nearly all longboard surfers these days are just dressing up in the same old, tired costume…
- Their boards are so generic, so retro, so focused on cosmetics, so unimaginative, so truly NOT custom…Not that they realize this of course... What the average Joe is riding is so disheartening…In many ways it’s only hurting them, but at least they don’t know it, proof that God is kind…
- So, what is the problem...?…
- An insightful friend pointed out to me that most surfers today have some sort of ‘X’ length formula burned into their brain. It states something to the effect that they feel ‘OK’ about riding a 9-0 at age 35. It’s safe, not too prone to ridicule…All based on what the ‘culture’ tells them is OK... At age 40, they compensate upwards to a 9-6, and continue upward… Just add 4” for every birthday over 40...
- This is the most basic situation in the ever-aging surfing population…
- And even with that being the case, do you EVER see anything different for this huge mass of surfers…? Never… What is culturally acceptable, not personally interesting, is what determines personal board choice... If you step outside this culturally accepted ‘norm’, watch out… Wha…?! A guy with something different…?…
- Take your average aging surfer, liking longer boards but not really having the skills to ride like David N. on the nose...I fall into that category…I love the glide and trim of longer boards, but I’ve never hung ten, rarely five…How about you…???…Anyone else want to raise their hand…???…
- So, why is it…???…
- There are few forward thinkers in the surfing world, maybe even less so in the ranks of your common shaper...Unimaginative shapers, all replicating someone else’s tired ideas from 10-30 years ago…If left to the shapers out there, your average 45 year old will be riding the same board in 2045 as he is today…If the surf culture en masse started experimenting, the average guy’s surfing would improve… So too, would shapers be forced to begin a sort of design quest, and you might have 500 shapers making improvements and contributions…
- Read any sailing magazine and realize how skilled and educated even your basic boat designer is, and the difference between him and a surfboard shaper is almost cosmic in the distance between the two…Look at all the truly innovative boat hulls coming out, and witness an industry that is truly led by change, and willing to move forward and try new things…
- There’s little that’s even close in the surfing industry…
- There is obviously some experimentation going on with materials…but the shapes themselves are about as refined as they’re ever going to get...
- Back to the ‘challenge’…
- For me, over the years, after experiencing that feeling of ‘the glide’, I fell in love with it…The sensation of being so in trim, not outrunning, not falling behind the wave…Just locked in to the waves speed…
- Where I surf, we have a lot of beach breaks…When the seasons change from summer to fall we get a lot of swell…Combine that with some stiff offshore winds, and you have excellent conditions…One of the drawbacks to those conditions is the expanded playing field…Paddling power is paramount to getting good waves, with shifting peaks up and down, inshore and out …Shortboarders sit inside, duckdive and get quick rides…That’s fine if you like to duckdive and get quick rides...With a more powerful paddling board, I have the vehicle in which to sit 50 –75 yards outside and get in the waves way early…I’m able to catch a cresting unbroken wave, drop in, set a line and speed, high and tight through where the shortboarders are and fly way further down the line, due to the speed achieved from a longer set up area…Ride fast and kick out and use the paddling advantage again to get back outside before the next waves catch you inside…The key is paddling speed…
- How can you ride one and NOT see the benefits of it all...???…
- The “average” longboard has just too much width in the nose and middle…On waves with some juice, that width just gets in the way…If you’re not gonna really ride the nose, why have that width…???…It just doesn’t fit the waves as well as something more streamlined…
- The board I’m riding I shaped a few years ago…It sat mostly unridden for a long time…But I broke it out early this summer for some very clean, empty point waves in this region…That session has hooked me on the undeniable quality of the ride these boards offer…The more I ride it, the more it makes sense…
- I’m not talking about 17’ boards or anything in that range…Human scale here…
- What’s got me so stoked is a 12’ Surf/ Paddleboard…I envisioned a board that had the qualities of both genres, without compromising the better aspects of each…A tough balance, but do-able…Out of a custom cut Clark 12'3", I templated a narrow, fairly parallel outline…Maximum width 20”…The maximum thickness is 3.75”… I shaped a typical paddle board entry, rolled vee for the first two feet or so, running to a gentle belly roll for a few more feet (we are talking lots of board) and ending in a harder edged pulled in round tail, with a flat vee panel running up about three feet from the tail…Single fin box, thank you…The key to combining the best of both aspects of paddle / surf, is having a generously domed deck to carry the thickness, and a bottom with moderate belly that rolls out to a rail that’ll still wrap water and hold in…A full length chine can add some more bite if you need that…The rolled bottom and the large flat vee panel keep it loose rail to rail… The boards length precludes most sudden direction changes, but the early entry, and the speed available through that, allow plenty of set up time for what’s ahead…With practice some mind bending right go left ( and visa/versa) takeoffs are achievable and repeatable…
- It is a great riding board, it can get around falling sections and of course has a lot of drive (what would you expect from 12’ of rail)…Besides, you can catch a ripple with it…
- Finally…
- Because of their stubbornness to expand their minds, other surfers might look at my board and laugh, think I’m a wannabe big wave hero, and misunderstand the principles behind the design choice…yet at the end of the day my wave count is almost always higher… And I guarantee that I’m the one smiling when I leave the water…
- You can argue it is all fun, and it all works, but it is a lot more fun when you catch more waves and at this age that is all I really want to do...
- Some might figure that I ‘went big’ to compensate for my age, when in fact that has never figured into my formula. My fitness level is well above average for my years…I’ve got witnesses…
- My inherent surfing skills are about as refined as they are ever going to be (realistically, I've passed the peak of my inherent refined surfing skills, and at this point of my life it’s mostly refinement)...
- As has been said before " If you can't out surf em, out think em." …
- CAUTION: Anyone with such a powerful wave catcher MUST NOT over use such an effective tool in even moderately crowded conditions…. It’s just not cool to be a wave hog…Instead, smile, encourage and share…
?? A convergence of thought, between Paul, a moderator, and Roy, the banned?
Could it be? Could it?
…Hi Paul, you never did a longboard hang ten or h five???, man…
…i can do h fives and practically H T in my 6´!!..
…your point about age and whats acceptable is excellent…
…most of us board builders or shapers dont have enough money for R&D like the boat builders, who earn tons of money…in the surf industry the only ones who make solid money are the surfwear brands…
…still i dont understand the “always something new psychosis”…i think its inherent to the “occidental world mind”(you aussies too)…man think martial arts like minds…
…your point about the most longboards nose is correct…i always try to shape narrow and thinner noses( 9´), also its really better to maneoubrability…
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?? A convergence of thought, between Paul, a moderator, and Roy, the banned?
Could it be? Could it?
Had that post been approved by the ‘Fair Shake and Full Credit Commision’?
the life cycle as with the surfboard attention span is constantly morphing…yea though ye have the board the mind set must slowly be prepared to expand into the “next Dimension” every increment of change in length and width opens options and shuts down other options…I.E. the day I sold my 9’4 yater paddle out entries were not accessable because paddling the shorter boards would not plane to surfing “hull’ speed…the 12’3” sure but the 12’8" is another set upwards…the actual application to spots where other dimentional surfboard activities are conducted is stifling to pure access of the 12’+ demension…length is only a narrow guage…thickness and width combined make for earth shaking changes…a set of 12’8" renditions is my ultimate goal to access tandem dimentiion to streaking paddlability dementia , catching waves is the cream all of these surfboard things catch waves…the wave ride access of the paddle board shape accessed by the out of production clark 13’= naish iggy blank is truly out of control on a ‘regular wave’ the “glide ’ parameters are way outside the accepted box, contemporary surf wisdom does not include long protracted proning on the brink of disaster on a two foot wave thats slow and mushy and straight off…another dimensional surfing mindset cannot begin to appreciate the difficulty involved and would likely pass the quest off as a waste of precious time and waves…yes the scope of contemporary surfing is very narrow and the opening up of this scope is like dental surgery{pulling teeth] but in time all the teeth become a memory with age and the mat quest as well as elongated surf craft are becoming to us as our expectations change … us to hopefully higher minded organisms capeable of compassionate mining of the zen ocean wave resource … ambrose …aloha Aliomanu light onshore two of us out twelve miles north close quarters 10’ and heated exchanges in the contemporary arena…an hour and a half on the mat then two waves on the 9’ 2” board enough to make an old guy take a nap oh yes 1/4 mile paddle with the rip 8 minutes
of much interest to me, as my opinion of surf craft are green sticks, bendable yet and unrigid or polluted as such by the attention deficit disorder of modern surf media. Paul, are you talking about the 12 foot monster three stringer gun-like beauty that was a favorite at the SA in big sur? what a cool board, that one. i heard it was a joy to ride. i would ride in a bath tub or on a piece of plywood if i thought it would bring me more readily into trim or fun or speed … yes, i like this train of thought. not forward or backwards in time, but sideways and diagonal in time. the ego interferes {perhaps} with our freedom. what holds people back from outrageous surf design? money, sure. time, ok. what more? i would like a hefty board with elegant lines, too. maybe i add this to the psychic shopping cart of shape ideas… nellyda
Good insights Paul. My own personal observations of the “aging” surf population (of which I am in the middle of), is that I’ve been seeing a lot people switching to Surftechs this past summer. These are ex-highend LB riders; Cooperfish and Webers mostly. They say that the Surftechs allow them to do things they haven’t done in 10 years. Maybe it’s because they’re way heavier now and the increased floation works for them. This isn’t a plug for Infinity, but Steve Boehne has been quietly addressing some of the design issues you’re talking about. He has a paddle/surf combo board with much the same rail, deck, and bottom you mentioned. He also has a sit-down board (single or tandem) that you paddle. This board allows older guys with back or leg problems to still surf. Handicapped people also ride these. Some of examples are on his website www.infinitysurf.com. Maybe the real measure of success in this business is when you can pursue different designs without regard to marketability, which is basically what most of us here at Swaylocks do all the time.
Paul,
Maybe the people that you are watching and making judgments about are just surfing and enjoying themselves regardless of their equipments limitations…? When you have eggs, you make eggs, not steak. Sometimes you just need to be creative on what you have.
I’m glad you like your 12’er - sounds like fun - but it also sounds limiting. And imagine - alot of the short ride, duck-dive, crowd might be wondering how such an early drop and straight line could be any fun. Everyone’s ivory tower has a different view.
Shapers build via supply and demand. Creativity is great in shaping, but does it sell? - everyone needs to eat first, push the limits later.
Eric J
Hmm. I get where you’re coming from Paul. I constantly remind myself, while on a longboard, to stay active. I don’t care if I’m moving up, moving down, rising, falling, turning, cutting back, or walking. One thing that really helps is going smaller on the fin than the ‘industry standard recommendation’. FE, I surf a 28#, 10’4" Velzy '63 model (yes, pulled-in nose & tail, late hips, eggy rails) with a 9" Farberow flex fin. Most surfshops would sell a 10" fin with that board, if not an 11". I started with a 10.5" pivot, worked down to a 10" Farberow, and now the 9". Definitely helps with staying active.
You’re dead-on about nose & tail width, too. In fact, a narrower nose doesn’t hurt noseriding, either, especially with a little belly under the nose (or soft vee like yours), where the rail curve sets right into the wall of the wave and the tail holds you back.
There’s a reason Phil’s boards are magic, look at the nose & outline from a recent photo from right here on Swaylocks’:
Great post - really wish a lot of the fat ‘crutch’ longboarders remembered its a sport and not penis projection…
Well, I don’t know if I agree with all of that, or at least it does not apply to my view of longboarding or how my friends aspire to ride such boards.
33 years old, 5’11, 150 lbs, I eat well and do my best to avoid what happens to many surfers bodies / strength as they get older. I realize longboards catch waves well, but I’m not choosing to ride one because of that. In fact, I feel that many times those complaining are riding inappropriate boards for the conditions and / or their deteriorated skills and / or fitness level.
To me longboarding is an art, a sort of dance. As such, I rarely if ever ride with a leash, switching to a different style of board if conditions really warrant use of such. Cosmetically, I feel that visual aesthetics are important. Craftsmen-created tinted resins, polished gloss coats, glass-on fins, etc., all of these things are part of what makes surfing what it is to me. Surf Techs and utility longboards don’t really attract me at all.
When I ride a longboard, I aspire to create my own style within an historical and contemporary framework of reference…to me, David Nuuhiwa, Joel Tudor, Phil Edwards, Claude Codgen, Midget Farrely (sp), Nat Young, Alex Knost, etc., represent something apart from shortboard surfing but nothing to do with simply catching more waves.
As for riding a longboard, I’m not really satisfied unless I’m getting wrap fives. Tens are something else, and much harder to accomplish in the beach break I usually ride, but the constant challenge is exciting, despite it being a 40 year old plus move. I’m not saying i am a great noserider, but for me, it is an integral part of longboarding and, I agree with you here, rather neglected by 90% of people riding longboards.
Last weekend at the Manasquan old school contest, Alex Knost was riding a borrowed Nuuhiwa Lightweight pintail…Dora ankle flick bottom turns to smooth crosstepping to hang 10’s to lay back off-the lips. I consider this just as advanced as the backside 360 grab airs I saw being pulled by the visiting pro contingent when I got back home to Long Beach that evening. Different styles of surfing on different equipment being ridden to the fullest potential.
When not on a longboard, I’m on a 5’8 Lis style twin keel lately. Sometimes even when it’s longboardable. Perhaps some people limit themselves by choosing to rely on the longer boards, but then again, I think the same can be said for the typical ride only a thruster mentality.
In short, it’s not the board, it’s the rider’s mindset…
At some point, most aging surfers will face a crossroads: to surf, or not to surf… that is the question.
How do I continue that which I love? How do I optimize my physical condition without undue risk of injury?
Is it still possible to be inspired, challenged and grow as a surfer? Are there any surprises left… can I still have fun?
The aging process is interesting. Many older surfers appreciate and seek out functional simplicity… less. Others strive for more than ever… to accumulate.
But eventually the aging process will have more influence on one`s personal surfing than board design.
Its not how you play the game... its how game you are to play.
…also i think that older people in most cases only view at the board like a float…float is one of the two aspects in boards, the other its the design itself…
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It’s hard to NOT come to the conclusion that nearly all longboard surfers these days are just dressing up in the same old, tired costume…
Just for the record, I don’t find this to be true in nor cal. Heck, even in Pacifica one is likely to see everything from vintage boards to surftechs to high performance longboards to modern wave-catcher boards and increasingly, more and more 40+year-old guys on fishes or ‘retro’ single fins in the 7’ range, and stuff like the Hobie retro egg. I’ve been surfing a wide 7’4" single-fin myself (Harbour spherical revolver).
Sure, there are probably ten Walden Magic model boards in the water at any given time here, but there is also a lot of variety in wave riding vehicles. Heck, even that Walden, with its hard rails and concave is not a tired-old design (unless you are comparing it to something way out there like Roy’s designs).
As an “older” (soon to be 50+) surfer, I’ve seen plenty of friends who are into various sporting activities drop out from death, injuries, job demands, etc. I consider myself fortunate to be out there at all even if I have adopted a more… “minimalist” style.
I hope there will come a day when I’m happy to be able to stand on a tanker doing the Duke pose on a 2 foot wave. That’ll mean I’m still doing it even when I’m a really old man!
John-
i suspect at some point, that’s where we will end up-totally stoked on just getting out in the water, standing and trimmin’ along(shit, what am i saying that’s what i do already-ykies!)nonetheless, it still feels good.it is a good thing we have our mats as well, for that will most likely be our saving grace(i am addicted to how it feels being in the water on a mat)
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yes, i like this train of thought. not forward or backwards in time, but sideways and diagonal in time
“Lateral movement at the line of scrimmage.”
-Thomas McGuane
92 In The Shade
Confuses them every time…opens incredible options for those with vision, as long as they don’t get killed in the end. Or maybe even if they do…
The interest seems to be not as limited as one might expect. I have made for myself and ridden two 10’ers, one with turned down rails, square tail, fuller outline, glassed on single (big) fin and one with soft rails, more parallel outline, pintail, single fin box with a 7" cutaway fin and both are great fun. I’ve also ridden a pal’s nearly 11’ glider and it was a sure thing once you got it pointed in the right direction. But I am actually finding more adventure on a 9’ tri-fin and am in design to build something around the 7’-7’6" range. Now the only reason I bring this up is that I just turned 55 and find there is a lot more I want to do on a wave. I’m not talking vertical lip rips and floaters and all that good stuff, but just cover some more of the face and play with it a little. I’m amazed at the variety at even my little ol’ local break not only in boards and riders. But the part about surfing that gets me is the room for all that variety, and that surfing remains that co-existence of the rider and His Wave, not anybody else’s. Some go bigger, some go smaller, but we all go. Ride on.
Tom
Duke pose = yes yes yes
feet stuck in the middle of the board squat stance = no no no
…at any age.
I’ve been having lots of fun lately taking off either parallel stance or with my ankles together and feet “duck foot”. Ride an entire wave that wave, it brings up interesting sensations of balance and history…
ankle knockers total commitment to point of trim ride entire wave and not neglecting to turn cut back and boogie down the line w/out compromising trim or stance…an alternate sense of accomplishment when flosters no longer count…ambrose… Dewey spread the stance and it rarely came back to erectile stance classisism…a leash on a longer board? crouching on a twelve+?
I rode the abovementioned board again yesterday, in small but very clean conditions…I was catching and riding waves that no one else was able to…It was all about the paddling advantage and early entry…Some guys commented on that I was riding waves they didn’t think were waves…Funny, the sure were fast and lined up once you get them…
One of the funnest aspects of a board like this, is the ability to just play with the wave…Some waves would have a steep racing pocket, that at times would call for a full race tight trim, with the lip hissing and falling over your shoulder…Other waves would allow for kick-stalls in the pocket, followed with a bent back knee, straight front leg, rear foot two feet up from the tail, front foot’s big toe the only other contact point…Letting the board’s tail vee roll from side to side with just the rear foot, with seven feet of narrow nose penduluming in front… 25 yards of unbridled fun…What a gas…!!!..
I’m gonna keep riding this board until I have a less than fully stoked session…That might be a while…
BTW…The fin I’m happiest with is a Liddlle flex fin, moved all the way up…
