Plugging the holes… (re-posted correctly Nov 22, 2017)
By replying to your replies to yourself, the posts get distorted and the images smaller, as the replies get altered to a narrower width. Just sayin’. You want to click the green “post reply” button, not the blue “reply”, which is only if you are answering a question or addressing a specific point in a previous comment.
Curious to hear the weight post-chambering. You mentioned hoping for an 80% reduction, but most chambering projects seem to end up with a 30 - 50% reduction, 80% would be surprising.
50% weight reduction with chambering. Pre-chambering 106lb, and now post chambering and glued (but not yet glassed) 54lbs. Heavy, but I still think surf able and manageable. Nostalgic a la 1932.
I think I can drop 4 more pounds with drying it out as the Douglas Fir gets very heavy in the moist air. Then the glassing will add back this weight plus a little.
Ways I would work to lighten it next build:
- Use all Redwood (half the weight of Fir/Pine) and easier to cut and sand.
- Use a router to cut the chambers so the decks can be 1/8" or less everywhere. This was the biggest cause of extra weight (i.e. the jigsaw cut thickness quite erratically.)
- Use small 1/8" dowels to line up each rib for gluing, allowing the decks to be thinner and align perfectly with each one added.
- Maybe not have the board be quite as wide. 24" is very wide and should be very stable for a big-guy beginner, but shrinking it by one rib would save a couple pounds.
- Correctly engineer the fin-box strengths and make it a single fin. The extra weight from these large solid blocks of wood is significant.
- Foil the board more. It needs a proper continuous rocker and making the snout and tail thinner would save weight. (But I am curious to see how this current monster surfs.)
- Patience - take more time to trim out every necessary support and board thickness. Maybe weigh each rib before glueing it to the others as a way to double check progress and have a goal of less than 2lb per rib (which was the case for a couple of them.)
- Lighten the rails - maybe a router or be more brave with the Forstner bit. Overall, I began to chicken out of the thinning of the chambers for fear of cutting through the deck/rail, which may still happen during the final sanding - Stay tuned for updates on that.
i am still keen to finish the glassing and surf the board. I’ll plan on simple cruising, use a calf lease, and surf away from others so as not to send a 60lb projectile in their direction.
Video to come in the New Year.
Thanks again for all the kid words and tips.
Plugging the holes in the deck and between the ribs today. Redwood shims work very well. They have both red and white color variations for matching (or contrasting). Using a knife and sandpaper, they can be cut and shaped to fit any gaps. A bit of Titebond 3 glue and things are looking good. The plan is to let the plugs’ glue cure overnight, then trim them flush. Flip the board and do the bottom tomorrow. (Thanksgiving will interrupt the progress for a couple days.) Then sanding and I’ll get a post-chambered weight for everyone.
You may also think about this chambering method: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FUYI31tD_AE&feature=youtu.be
That is so slick! I love it.
I’ll finish up this 50lb hand-cut board and get my mental wheels turning on the next lighter and more refined one.
I really like the precision you have with your rig for chambering.
Thanks for posting it and letting me in on the technology.
After being away a few months, and then finding that the weather here in San Francisco was too cold and wet this winter to have epoxy cure or varnish dry, I am back at it. 60 degrees Farenheit all week, and summer has sort-of begun. So here is the first coat of spar varnish. Yep, I have decided to forego epoxy and fiberglass, against most advice. Here is the logic:
- The board is heavy and built like a tank so there is no need for extra strengthening.
- It may or may not be surfable, given everything I have learned along the way I would build and shape it differently, so I did not want to make a mess in the garage with epoxy, buying a respirator mask, sanding fiberglass (which years ago gave me a nasty eye swelling), and the cost is mounting for what was always to be an ‘every man’ project.
- I have time to put on a bunch of coats of spar varnish. It is available locally and easy to apply.
- Several coats should plug the pin holes in the board. If not, entering water should swell the wood and complete the water-tightening process.
First coat went on fine. No thinning on the first coat. Just keeping it simple. The raw wood soaked it up, as expected.
The plan is to spend a few weeks varnishing, then use two-part epoxy to secure the fin boxes, and give it a whirl.
I still recommend this type of project to anyone. It has been and remains a joy. I remain increasingly hopeful about its surfability.
Fins going on this week. Using a Forstner bit (1.25"), the inbox and FCS holes have been drilled. Later this week, fill the holes partway up with epoxy, sent the fins, let them cure, sand and touch up the varnish. Almost in the water.
Finished at last.
So, this project should have taken about 3 months if I had used my weekends and after work nights consistently, but life is life and here we are at last.
I used a 1 1/8" foster bit to drill the FCS plug holes and plumber’s out to make dams around the holes when I filled them with epoxy. The epoxy and plastic that protruded above the board surface sanded easily with 150 grit on an orbital sander. The finish with the black plastic, and the spacing around it did not look that great, so I used redwood shims and made housings for the fin boxes and FCS plugs. Yes, not very hydrodynamic, but this is an experimental board and it looks OK for a first attempt. The fins are little asymmetric in terms of toe-in, but given the weight of the board and my beginner status, I think this will make little or no difference. I can always re-drill the holes and reset the FCS plugs.
The countersunk vent plug screwed in perfectly and I am quite pleased with it.
I used an old-school leash method instead of a leash plug and drilled through the fin box, filling the larger hole with epoxy then drilling a smaller hole for the leash cord. I am going to use a 9’ calf leash. Not sure my ankle could take the 50lb board pulling it around.
As soon as I get a chance and a bit better weather (blowing 35kph today) I’ll take the board out and see how it performs in the water. Stay tuned for a video if all goes well.
Stoked for you mate!
First trip to the surf this morning. The board floated quite nicely. With the weight (about 50lbs, 25kg) it cut through the waves on the way out like a tank. Easy to the line.
While getting into position, the board started to feel heavier. But I thought, maybe I am just out of shape and tired from the paddle out. Over the next ten minutes, the board seemed to be gradually floating lower in the water. I paddled back in to catch some white water and coast to shore. As waves came by, the board just bobbed up and down, barely moving forward, and it felt too heavy to glide or catch a wave, at least with the paddling power I could achieve.
Pulling the board out, I opened the vent, and watched water pour out for what felt like five minutes. There was one major leak point near the nose where water also squirted out.
Still a fun day out.
The plan is to dry the board out, focus on the major leak, plug it up with wood filler, and paint the board with a few more coats of marine varnish. I’ll use my bicylce pump in the vent to pressure test the board, and if it is watertight, take it back out.
It is heavy and a beast to lug around, but after carrying it with a couple gallons of water inside, the empty and dry weight feels light in comparison. Using the leash wrapped around the tail as a handle, the board can be dragged along the sand without any risk of dammage to it.
The joy of paddling out your own wooden board just cannot be beat, regardless of the outcome on the first experimental day. Big smiles all day.
Thanks agian for the encouragement along the way.
Excuse me , but is that your normal attire ?
We get about seven warm days a summer a year here in San Francisco. The sarong is from when I was in Bali and Kalimantan, and it was one of those rare warm days here. Rare day, rare attire.
The surfing attire was a 4/3 wetsuit, and it was a perfect day to be out.
Fellow pinewood board fans, I am back at it on the original board with a new plan to make it lighter and water-tight. We’ll see how it goes.
In short, I am now drilling 3/4" holes with a Forstner bit in the decks and plan to fiberglass over everything to make it water-tight. Some of the drilling cuts into the over-built support struts and the heavy rails. Just finishing up the bottom, and looking at the deck thickness (future pics to follow), the board is significantly over built so should be OK with some of its structure removed. At the same time, because I used hand tools in the backyard, there are deck sections that are also very thin, so here’s hoping things work out regardless.
I have left the stringer line and some other lines (such as those around the fins) without holes to provide additional strength. Whether these areas are needed or not is uncerrtain, but I felt that the minimal weight saving from drilling them would not be worth the risk of an overall weakend structure.
Yes, we’ll have to see how much sag there is in the fiberglass mat over these holes, but maybe slight dimpling will be an interesting feature, or a top coat may fill it in.
As a recap: Solid wood weight 106lbs. Chambered weight 52lbs. We shall see what the drilled weight ends up being.
Finished drilling top and bottome decks. It took about 5 hours total time and three forstner bits (they do get dull). Only one small section of deck cracked out like a jigsaw puzzle piece adn is easily glued back in. Next will be to sand it agian, then glassing.
Weight before holes 52 lbs. After holes 43lbs.
I am hoping to lose another 3-5 pounds with drying, then likely add that back with glassing. So, 45lbs (23kg) all completed is the predicted weight.
Enjoy making noise and sawdust, and have a dremel?
Rotary rasp/burr. They work better than carbide bits do on wood
These remove a lot of wood quickly, but leave a very rough surface which will then soak up a lot of resin. follow with sanding barrells to smooth.
Aim for under 40 Lbs, in my opinion.
What’s the plan of attack to glass that?? Hope it’s a good one