Man, let me say I have had my fill with some of my accounts this summer. One Orange county retailer that sells his own lable, that I shape, took it upon himself, to pay me half my invoice for finished shapes and half for the foam I had purchased on my account, twice. I had to inform him he had just gotten 2 strikes, a third and he was out of the game, no do overs. A major lable that I shape for has had a hissy fit on how long it is taking for ME to order foam from Clark for THEM, get the rockers, correct blanks, stringer patterns,have them delivered to KKL, shape them and deliver to the glass shop. Today I hear from the Bahne bothers that he was at the shop asking “what the fuck does Phillips do all day”. I ran into him later while I was delivering his blanks, he said I didn’t need to yell, I told him he had about 5 more seconds, until he was flat on his back on the pavement, knocked out. Somebody need to work hard for 10 or 12 hours a day 6 days a week for shit pay, I do do my job well
Now if we can just transport you to 7’ G-land, make all the other surfers watch for two hours, and bring your favorite quiver to you out in the water…
Just why are we working so hard and deligently?
For the luv of surfing?
Is that why I dropped out at age 19?
Hey Jim,
This guy you’re talking about is little more that a bank teller.
It seems to me that the guy that knows how to make something with his hands and do a primo job gets less and less respect in this modern age of foreign labor sold as domestic product and imported products that are seldom superior, though there are exceptions, to what we make here. I have to admit that there are a few guys that have no hands on experience that will give craftsmen respect but when it comes to retailing and manufactures all they care about is production. How fast and how much is all that matters most of the time for them.
You know the old saying, "good fast and cheap, you never get all three, just two off the list the third is never available when you demand the other two, but that’s what they want. The word custom is very difficult for them to understand not having any first hand experience with what it takes to not only make something from start to finish but design it as well.
It’s real hard to produce a fancy cake with a cookie cutter but to hear some of them talk that’s all it takes.
The boys that want to buy and sell everybody want to do things this way. Tell everybody it’s great whether or not it is and once you’ve got the money who cares. As a result they have to live off the ignorant. We both know there’s no shortage of that, ignorance I mean. So when they figure they’ll just cut you short and is it real a surprize when so many people grow up accepting planned obsolescenc and it dictates how most of them treat their customers ~ here today gone tomorrow. A little service as possible and take as much as the market will allow. I hate it. I saw it happening when I first started in the trades. Expecting two days work in 5 hours and complaining all the time that things weren’t done fast enough when if they tried to do what I did in two days it would take them two weeks and it still wouldn’t be done right. There comes a time you have to thumb you nose at production work and demand what you’re worth or just get up and walk.
Hell man you’re boards are in the 99th percentile of quality. I sure hope there’s a way you can get tip top dollar for them and forget the rip off artists. We all gotta make a buck and you oughta be making your share with out having to deal with
with a bunch of $^*&^?&**heads.
I hope someday I can give you an outline to work from and have you build something for me. Someday, when I’ve done enough homework.
Hope you work it out Jim.
Mahalo, Rich
Me too Jim. I normally give my “name” accounts 30 days to pay, and I send them a polite reminder right at 30. If the check isn’t there in 30 but they finally pay before 60 days, I put them on net 10 days. The next strike and it’s COD. If they flake out on the COD with some lame excuse, I keep the boards and put them on cash up front. This deadbeat attitude towards paying bills combined with nasty personal remarks is happening everywhere with this crazy economy. Everybody (businesses and consumers alike) is living deep in the red; $10-15K credit card debts are very common. This is extremely apparent in here in south coastal OC. Operate in a business-like way, and don’t change your work ethic and sense of quality. Don’t get pulled down to the level of these other guys; they want you to lower your standards of quality and craftmanship so they can justify a lower price and then bad mouth your work.
Jim,
I think Rich has it right. You know, I remember a time when we were actually respected for what we do. One time Bruce Walker hired a non surfing manager for his retail shop. The guy used to pressure us to get the boards done quicker and quicker. One day he was harassing me about a group of stock orders that I wasn’t getting done in time. I picked up the stack of orders, tore them in half and threw em in the trash. He was fired the next week. What has happened to us?
Howzit PeteC, I’m strictly C.O.D., no cash no board. I keep in touch with my customers and tell them if they have a money problem that I’ll hold off on their board until they can pay. It’s amazing how fast they will find the bucks. On another note, are you familiar with how American Express credit card co works. You accept their card at your business and they charge you about 6% of the sale, now you don’t get your money from them for 60 days yet the person who used the card has to pay it off with in 30 days of getting bill. They get paid before they pay you, now that’s a scam and they never use a penny of their own money. Aloha, Kokua
so why do factories(glassing)make their small-time CASH UP FRONT paying customers wait so long??? the only ones i write a check to is clark, everyone else is cash.
Howzit greg, When you say small-time do you mean a person who walks in with a shaped blank once, or a shaper who brings them maybe 3 blanks a month. They may have enough business from big name shops that they don’t worry about the guy who shaped his own blank and just needs it glassed. The bottom line is they don’t want to lose big accounts, just like most businesses do. If somebody comes to me for a glass job I will tell them how long before I even want them to bring me the blank. Aloha, Kokua
Hey Kokua,
Im not sure how long ago amex was like that but my amex deposits in my account within 48 hours, usually next business day
when i’m doing about 20 or 30 per year with the same glassers and payin cash but i’m not bitchen and breathin down their neck like a bird dog…i can understand, and from what i’ve seen on swaylocks,the prices i’m paying for contract glassing isn’t bad.its just when i’m tampering with rocker or other dimensions it would be nice to stay with the flow.
Jimbo, that guy doesn’t deserve to have your boards in his place. If I was a retailer, I would wait however long it takes to get your boards, and educate my customers as to why it takes as long as it does for a handmade piece of art. Especially in summer. Wonder what he does all day? Fricken middleman. Apparrently hangs out a Bahne and talks sh!t.
Good on ya!
HowzitF1surf, That's good to hear, maybe AMEX got smart and figured out why a lot of businesses wouldn't use them. That was why I didn't use them when I owned my restaurant. But what interest rate are they charging you for taking their card.Aloha, Kokua
Well wouldn’t you know it, after I walked before before the payperview bout at the glass shop, the owner of the glass shop sat this donkey down and asked him why he thought he could talk this way to me. He was kind enough to inform him that he had one of the best craftsmen and shapers in the industry and was about to lose him, thanks!!!
I appreciate shapers. I really do. You guys are great.
Jim is a real professional.
Nobody is perfect, and if those guys don’t know it, screwem.
Hey, I thought the economy of the surf industry (boards) was red hot right now.
I’m right there with you, Jim. And maybe I can throw in my little rant-
I just quit a summer business I was involved in these past few years, working catering gigs for a bozo who had no idea of how to run it. In fact, I started getting grief for ‘trying to tell him how to run his business’ when I was doing just that last year ( as a favor, being a nice guy - and did I even get a ‘thanks’, let alone any cash for it? naaah ) while he was having a few issues plus trying to get back into pro skateboarding and wasn’t around. Of course, it probably really pissed him off that I ran the business smoother than he could, a happy crew and happy customers.
Well, this year it got worse. See, if you are doing jobs and paid by the job and not by the hour, it’s only common decency to schedule things so there is no hang time, no sitting around waiting and wasting the crew’s time, wasting it to the point where what could have been a nice gig becomes long, tedious and the hourly pay rate goes down to what I could get if I was pumping gas… Especially when it involves time that some of them can use to make a few bucks at other work. But Bozo the Skateboarder, he hasn’t quite figured that part out, even after a few years of all of us bitching about it. Let alone the interminable wasted time listening to Bozo the Skateboarder ( BS for short) on the bloody phone, pissing away 45 minutes to say something that could have been said in 30 seconds. Or the hours of free computer help after the tenth time he has opened a virus attachment of the kind I told him again and again to delete without opening or just plain screwed it up again, or needing help with this and that in general 'cos he has the mechanical skills of a less than bright blue-assed baboon. This neck of the woods, as you’ll remember, it runs on favors done and favors owed, and it’s a damned funny thing, all the favors I have done for the guy, it seems like I haven’t got any back. Zip, zero, when I do need help with something it’s a funny thing, BS-boy is busy.
So, I said screw it. I’ve got too many other things going. All of which either pay better, are more fun, more interesting or don’t involve working for idiots. Or ideally a combination of 'em. If I get the reputation of being something of a sonofabitch, well, that’s okay too, keeps the jackasses away.
Life is too damned short already, time too precious, to deal with third rate clowns who think they can walk on water and think that you should kowtow to whatever they want. They need you a helluva sight more than you need them.
doc…
So Jim do you accept custom orders in the slack times of Winter?
I take custom orders all times of the year, it just takes longer when 75 boards a week are rolling in and 20-25 is enough exertion to still keep it fun and do them right
jim i know what your going thru… i have tried to resolve things… i have done 100 boards all of my own designs with the aps3000 and have never been happier with my boards… the longboards ive done have come out awesome and the customers are absolutly stoked… it takes be around 20 minutes to completly finish one… it took 2 goes to get a really good one and about 6-10 hours learning the software… doing 3 in an hour and cruising is great for the body and mind!