i see lots of people riding, for lack of a better term (my vocabulary seems to be diminishing – like the eskimos surfers seem to have a zillions descriptive words for surfboard) retro eggs. i know plenty of people ride them but no one seems to be getting as much coverage as joel tudor. when i see him ride this small single fins seemingly inspired by wayne lynch et al the dude looks super smoothe, fast, with nice glide etc…I must assume it is 90% rider and 10% board (maybe more). Here is my question to the shapers out there: if someone came to your garage and said how much they like the retro style, wanted to ride a single fin when the waves got shoulder high plus…what would you recommend?
i see lots of people riding, for lack of a better term (my vocabulary > seems to be diminishing – like the eskimos surfers seem to have a > zillions descriptive words for surfboard) retro eggs. i know plenty of > people ride them but no one seems to be getting as much coverage as joel > tudor. when i see him ride this small single fins seemingly inspired by > wayne lynch et al the dude looks super smoothe, fast, with nice glide > etc…I must assume it is 90% rider and 10% board (maybe more). Here is my > question to the shapers out there: if someone came to your garage and said > how much they like the retro style, wanted to ride a single fin when the > waves got shoulder high plus…what would you recommend? Great question, Tim! But please allow me to sidestep this one a bit: “…I must assume it is 90% rider and 10% board (maybe more).” Although it
s often true that the best surfers can successfully surf the worst things, I deeply admire the school of thought that believes if a board is functionally and aesthetically tailored to a particular rider, and is used in suitable waves, that equation you mentioned actually begins to reverse itself, i.e. when all elements are in place, the riders presence of effort DIMINISHES and the value of the boards intrinsic nature increases, until culminating (under ideal circumstances) in an inspiring synergy of wave, rider and board. The same philosophy is present in much of historic music (or art, literature, etc.), the idea being to let the music speak for itself, to be set free... with the listeners focus carried beyond the instrument and its musician to a higher place. To those true believers, less is still more. Dale
Great question, Tim! But please allow me to sidestep this one a bit:>>> “…I must assume it is 90% rider and 10% board (maybe more).”>>> Although it
s often true that the best surfers can successfully surf the > worst things, I deeply admire the school of thought that believes if a > board is functionally and aesthetically tailored to a particular rider, > and is used in suitable waves, that equation you mentioned actually begins > to reverse itself, i.e. when all elements are in place, the riders > presence of effort DIMINISHES and the value of the boards intrinsic > nature increases, until culminating (under ideal circumstances) in an > inspiring synergy of wave, rider and board.>>> The same philosophy is present in much of historic music (or art, > literature, etc.), the idea being to let the music speak for itself, to be > set free... with the listeners focus carried beyond the instrument and > its musician to a higher place.>>> To those true believers, less is still more.>>> Dale As a tried and true devotee to single fin “egg” type boards I will tell you, as Dale alluded to, it is more like 85% board and 15% rider.I know the type of eggs I ride are designed such that they essentially do all the work-with very little input from the rider.To be sure ot looks good and feels even better!
while i still havent seen one in person, i think the Good Karma Egg looks pretty damn fun and if i could have any single fin egg, it would be one of those. -steve
This is a good question and one that I’d like to hear the answer to. But as far as the other observations regarding board vs. rider vs. performance – this is something I think alot about because I also “experiment” alot with single fins. This is an impossible topic because how well someone rides a wave is ultimately a subjective evaluation. But here goes my observations. There is the school of thought from some readers in this forum that anything less than three fins is a drastic step back in board design progression and ultimately performance. To NOT use a thruster is a compromise of performance. Then there’s the ride what you like as long as it’s fun school. Finally, there’s the school which postulates that each wave/rider combination has an optimum craft for optimum performance. Personally, I kind of fall into all three schools – and I think this is largely because I can’t see myself surfing. I think that single fins have a learning curve and that they require a modification of surfing style from that of a thruster. Given these things it’s my contention that within that style, single fins are smoother and faster and freer than thrusters. Ultimately I think its an apples and oranges question – and a style choice. If you want to eat oranges and surf within a particular style single fins are the highest performance craft out there. But then again the same thing can be said for bodysurfing. Not sure if this was a ramble or I’m making sense.
How many times have you seen someone out in the water who just seems to be clashing with their equipment. Whether it is your buddy out there with his 9’ modern longboard chip trying to ride 2’ windswell like he was Andy Irons out at overhead log cabins, or the guy next to you who is 225lb., out on his 6’6" - 19 1/4" shortboard, getting pissed he isn’t catching any waves. I feel your choice of equipment helps you to get the most (or the least) out of the waves and yourself. Why else would you have a quiver. Although I do have friends who have 4 or 5 - 6’2" thrusters (with the same dimensions). You can play 18 holes of golf with the same club, but you are not getting the most of the experience.
never seen a good karma but have wondered what board for say a 175 rider of a variety of breaks who will take it out when it gets punchy and puts his longboard away. how long? how thick? how wide? nose? tail? rocker? fin size? rails? glass? bottom contours? not looking for someone’s recommendation on a takegushi or bustie or blewarts – just a generic surfboard
I think those are one in a million. You always have trade offs in design. We set up an office one time and bought the all in one - fax, scanner, answering machine, and printer. It did all of these, but each function was mediocre. Design conformity to a variety of conditions, breeds mediocrity. My two cents.
mike d., Someone who has been riding a longboard that is interested in an all purpose short board for “more punchy conditions” probably isn’t interested in getting 3-4 different short boards…yet. So, I would recommend since he’s coming from a LB he should keep abit of length say 6’8" 19-5/8" X 2-5/8" mild rocker with a mild single to double concave bottom squash tail. Get Red X in it and you will be able to make the same board tighter like a 7’0" or looser like a 6’5" by adjusting the fin positions and/or templates.
Point taken, I just don’t think there is such a thing as an all purpose board, or if there is the “all purpose” what are you giving up in exchange.
Point taken, I just don’t think there is such a thing as an all purpose > board, or if there is the “all purpose” what are you giving up > in exchange. I agree that there is no single shape that out shines all other shapes in any given condition. But, I don’t think that’s what the Riddler was asking. Just something that will work well in general. I’ve got a couple boards that work great in everything from Knee high to double overhead.
mike d.,>>> Someone who has been riding a longboard that is interested in an all > purpose short board for “more punchy conditions” probably isn’t > interested in getting 3-4 different short boards…yet. So, I would > recommend since he’s coming from a LB he should keep abit of length say > 6’8" 19-5/8" X 2-5/8" mild rocker with a mild single to > double concave bottom squash tail. Get Red X in it and you will be able to > make the same board tighter like a 7’0" or looser like a 6’5" by > adjusting the fin positions and/or templates. Personally, I think anyone who loves surfboards can’t ever seem to have enough of them. There are just too many intriguing designs/theories out there to not have a diverse quiver.
It is a good question and one that I think we all share a common interest in. Whether it be simply an equipment issue or one which we try to address from the point of view of a shaper/designer. I’m looking at single fin hull type shape in the 7’0"-7’4" range. Aside from the basic design questions regarding rail design, volume and outline I’m puzzled over the fin layout. I think what I’m going to do is put a long single fin box in and 2 adjustable (RedX or F.U. thruster) boxes and spend some time deciding what works best for my average surf conditions and style. TS>>> This is a good question and one that I’d like to hear the answer to.>>> But as far as the other observations regarding board vs. rider vs. > performance – this is something I think alot about because I also > “experiment” alot with single fins. This is an impossible topic > because how well someone rides a wave is ultimately a subjective > evaluation. But here goes my observations.>>> There is the school of thought from some readers in this forum that > anything less than three fins is a drastic step back in board design > progression and ultimately performance. To NOT use a thruster is a > compromise of performance.>>> Then there’s the ride what you like as long as it’s fun school.>>> Finally, there’s the school which postulates that each wave/rider > combination has an optimum craft for optimum performance.>>> Personally, I kind of fall into all three schools – and I think this is > largely because I can’t see myself surfing.>>> I think that single fins have a learning curve and that they require a > modification of surfing style from that of a thruster. Given these things > it’s my contention that within that style, single fins are smoother and > faster and freer than thrusters.>>> Ultimately I think its an apples and oranges question – and a style > choice. If you want to eat oranges and surf within a particular style > single fins are the highest performance craft out there. But then again > the same thing can be said for bodysurfing.>>> Not sure if this was a ramble or I’m making sense.
seems like mike was the only one with any suggestions. for all you know i could have 8 boards – fish, thrusters, hulls, longboards, guns – but that should be pretty irrelevant – i am asking – if i walked into your shaping bay and said i want a board sorta like the kind i saw wayne lynch ride in evolution – sorta like i see joel tudor riding – i want glide, i want to be able to paddle, i prefer single fins, i don’t want a disposable board, i will surf it in chest to 1.5 times overhead beachbreak, and weigh 175 — what would you shape me? i don’t want to hear theory about boards and quivers and whatever(when i said generic i meant NO NAME, not all purpose) ok, maybe i am being harsh – but seriously i am sure lots of you ride a similar board or have ideas about it?
i would shape you a less abrasive personality, with a little V in the last 1/3rd>>> seems like mike was the only one with any suggestions. for all you know i > could have 8 boards – fish, thrusters, hulls, longboards, guns – but > that should be pretty irrelevant – i am asking – if i walked into your > shaping bay and said i want a board sorta like the kind i saw wayne lynch > ride in evolution – sorta like i see joel tudor riding – i want glide, i > want to be able to paddle, i prefer single fins, i don’t want a disposable > board, i will surf it in chest to 1.5 times overhead beachbreak, and weigh > 175 — what would you shape me? i don’t want to hear theory about boards > and quivers and whatever(when i said generic i meant NO NAME, not all > purpose)>>> ok, maybe i am being harsh – but seriously i am sure lots of you ride a > similar board or have ideas about it?
seems like mike was the only one with any suggestions. for all you know i > could have 8 boards – fish, thrusters, hulls, longboards, guns – but > that should be pretty irrelevant – i am asking – if i walked into your > shaping bay and said i want a board sorta like the kind i saw wayne lynch > ride in evolution – sorta like i see joel tudor riding – i want glide, i > want to be able to paddle, i prefer single fins, i don’t want a disposable > board, i will surf it in chest to 1.5 times overhead beachbreak, and weigh > 175 — what would you shape me? i don’t want to hear theory about boards > and quivers and whatever(when i said generic i meant NO NAME, not all > purpose)>>> ok, maybe i am being harsh – but seriously i am sure lots of you ride a > similar board or have ideas about it? You know I recenttly shaped one of those for myself for those type of conditions but a friend saw it in my shaping bay and bought it to take to Costa Rica—so the anwear is I would probably shape ya 7’6" to 7’10" 141/2-15tail and a 15"nose light roll “v” under the feet with a thin 70-30 rail and a ight roll under the nose put in a 8-81/2 flex fin glassed on of course and there you are egg heaven
7’2" long, 14 1/2" nose, 20 1/4" wide (2" up from center), 14" tail, 2 3/4" thick. Round pin or diamond tail. Beak nose and full rails. 6/4 deck and 6 bottom with a gloss & polish. When do you want to pick it up? Cheers, Scott
seems like mike was the only one with any suggestions. for all you know i > could have 8 boards – fish, thrusters, hulls, longboards, guns – but > that should be pretty irrelevant – i am asking – if i walked into your > shaping bay and said i want a board sorta like the kind i saw wayne lynch > ride in evolution – sorta like i see joel tudor riding – i want glide, i > want to be able to paddle, i prefer single fins, i don’t want a disposable > board, i will surf it in chest to 1.5 times overhead beachbreak, and weigh > 175 — what would you shape me? i don’t want to hear theory about boards > and quivers and whatever(when i said generic i meant NO NAME, not all > purpose)>>> ok, maybe i am being harsh – but seriously i am sure lots of you ride a > similar board or have ideas about it? >>>>>> 7’6" to 8’0", nose 15", wide point 21 3/4", tail 14", thickness about 2 3/4". Center fin (box)8 3/4" to 9", with a bit of flex in the last 1/3 of the tip of the fin. As far as placement from the tail, start around 8 1/2" to 10" up from the tail. If you would prefer to ride it as a 2 + 1 set up, I would use FCS or Red x system along with a center box but come down in size for your center fin to 6 1/4" or 7 1/4". sk
seems like mike was the only one with any suggestions. for all you know i > could have 8 boards – fish, thrusters, hulls, longboards, guns – but > that should be pretty irrelevant – i am asking – if i walked into your > shaping bay and said i want a board sorta like the kind i saw wayne lynch > ride in evolution – sorta like i see joel tudor riding – i want glide, i > want to be able to paddle, i prefer single fins, i don’t want a disposable > board, i will surf it in chest to 1.5 times overhead beachbreak, and weigh > 175 — what would you shape me? i don’t want to hear theory about boards > and quivers and whatever(when i said generic i meant NO NAME, not all > purpose)>>> ok, maybe i am being harsh – but seriously i am sure lots of you ride a > similar board or have ideas about it? I just made myself a 7’3" single fin semi gun rounded pin 12.5 n by 20 by 12.75 t I use a fins unlimited 8" egg fin. The box set 4.5 off the tail with slight v running out the last 3rd of the board. I used a 7’3 eaton blank natural I put the wide point 3.5 inches up from center it’s 2 7/8 thick. I had it glassed 6/4 top 4 bottom I’m 5’10" 155 and It friggin rips. I wouldn’t want it any fuller you don’t need it especially if your going to take into some heavier beach break surf.
I just made myself a 7’3" single fin semi gun rounded pin 12.5 n by > 20 by 12.75 t I use a fins unlimited 8" egg fin. The box set 4.5 off > the tail with slight v running out the last 3rd of the board. I used a 7’3 > eaton blank natural I put the wide point 3.5 inches up from center it’s 2 > 7/8 thick. I had it glassed 6/4 top 4 bottom I’m 5’10" 155 and It > friggin rips. I wouldn’t want it any fuller you don’t need it especially > if your going to take into some heavier beach break surf. ps thanks sk for the semi gun tips. The board came out so good I was shocked on every level .