spackle on e. p. s. ????

General Discussion
1

wh7y do you spackle the blank before glassing??? and how do you do it? completely covered??? thanks

2

topic gone over about a million times its in the archive

3

The spackle is to give the board a smoother surface and to seal the foam so it sucks in less resin.

I strongly suggest not using spackle. I’ve done it twice and have had delams both times.

There is another method of using resin and microballoons or other filler to get the same results. I even saw a post from someone who lams the board as soon as the fill goes off and starts gelling. I think that’s a great way to do it.

There is a lot of information on previous posts. Just do a search of spackle.

4
Quote:

I’ve done it twice and have had delams both times.

gregs done it thousands of times no worries

maybe you had the wrong spackle or used to much

5

I’ve never had a probem with the “Fast n Final” spackle.

I am concerned about sucking water into the blank from the spackle. My first boards I thinned the spackle with water and noticed how it seemed to dry as you worked it …The blank was sucking water out of the mix.

Now I thin with acryllic…it goes on smoother and gives a great finish when sanded with 150#

The acryllic hardens and seals with the silica in the spackle…leaving no moisture trapped in the blank…

This moisture is the posible cause of delams …SO…dont put it in there in the first place…

Micro balloons and resin also works well after you get the hang of it.

After using several different brands of resin I will attest to Resin Research…It is the best I’ve used.

Thanks Greg!

Krokus

6

Many dozens of boards. No delams. Plus, I think Greg has build a handful of EPS boards with spackle, and he recommends it.

7

ROFL!!!

This thread exists in many shapes and forms in the archives… Spackle? no Spackle? Microspheres? no Microspheres…

In a nutshell, abunch of folk have good results with spackle. A bunch don’t. Those who don’t (get good results with spackle) use microspheres and get a good result with that. Arguments?

For Spackle:

  1. Cheap

  2. Easy to use, fast turn around, water based.

  3. very esthetic (really white finish)

For Microspheres

  1. Bond to laminate (epoxy) is super, a chemical bond if done within short period of time

  2. No water involved so no risk of contamination on foam or wood bits

  3. Strong end result, chemically and mechanically.

I’ve probably forgotten one or two things…

Personally I got for spackle… um Nope doh! Microspheres… yeah, personally I go for microspheres…

8

Krokus,

I also thin with acrylic (Future floor sealer) when spackling. Much better results. I have also noticed that using white pigment in the epoxy/microballon mix is better aesthetically, but still not as good as the spackle.

I am not very good at grinding/surforming laps carefully, so I prefer epoxy/microballoons/white pigment if I am time-limited, as the spackle is not very strong and I have cut right through it and into foam when cleaning up bottom laps, unless I baste the laps lightly with epoxy, but the basting adds a step in the process. The epoxy/microballoon/pigment mix is strong enough to take the abberrant surform or sanding/grinding pass, but you have to be good at squeegeeing when you apply it so that you don’t have to sand much (if at all) after sealing, because it is easy to sand into the surrounding foam when cleaning up any lumps/drips squeegee marks left behind. You also have a smaller timeframe to work with the epoxy/microballoons/pigment.

I have had no delam issues with either method, though.

JSS

9

Hi Surfer Dave -

What is funny (and confusing) to me is how the terms have morphed over the years. In the interest of clarification, I thought I’d chime in here…

“Spackle” (upper case “S”) was (is) the brand name (starting in 1926) for a specific plaster patching compound that became so popular the brand name eventually became used generically… like Kleenex, Xerox, etc. You really have to look for the specific brand “Spackle” anymore but at one time, it was the leader. Not all plaster patching compounds (spackles) are the same.

Silicate (not phenolic) “microsheres” or “microballoons” in addition to being available in bulk form to mix with your own epoxy or polyester resin base, are in fact the filler used with an acrylic base in at least two different patching compounds on the market today. One brand is by “Custom” and is known as “Patch and Paint.” Another brand is DAP “Fast and Final.” Both are super light and seem to work for finish coating EPS blanks.

The labels read something like “Acrylic Copolymer/Amorphous Silicate” but actual communications with company rep confirmed that “Amorphous Silicate” is what they put on the label to describe microballoons.

I’ve seen some other lightweight patching compounds that are probably similar but haven’t actually read the labels or spoken with the companies.

I’ve also read of model airplane guys using epoxy mixed with DAP F&F as a sealer on EPS foam models.

In any case, I’d think that after all Mark Spindler and I went through on this subject, the conclusions we finally agreed on should be shared.

10

i wonder if diaper filler and rr epoxy will work to cover eps . . .

11

i just dropped off a couple of boards (eps) to my glasser. he said he isn’t using spakle anymore because of delams, bla, bla, bla. so, I assumed he was switching to micro balloons as stated above, but he said he is using cabosil. I know cabosil and microballoons are similar, but should I be worried??? more wieght???

12

i just spackeld a board

im positive it wont delam

if your boards are delamming you are prolly using to much to fill bad shaping divots

be more careful shaping so you dont have to use much

mix it with water so its a bit runy and squegee it in

it doesnt take long and its a thin coat

you should still be able to see eps in places possible

you squeze it down into the holes and it fills up the space between the beads

you dont paint it on really thick

its a seal coat not a filler coat

pretty straight forward really

13

If you use a EPS blank around 2.5# density then you shouldn’t have to spackle. 2.5# is a bit overkill for a shortboard though so I don’t know if that’s whats you’re making.

14
Quote:
Krokus,

I am not very good at grinding/surforming laps carefully, so I prefer epoxy/microballoons/white pigment if I am time-limited, as the spackle is not very strong and I have cut right through it and into foam when cleaning up bottom laps, unless I baste the laps lightly with epoxy, but the basting adds a step in the process.

JSS

Not sure if you’ve tried using a pocket plane surform for cleaning up laps. I find it much easier to work with than a regular surform as it pretty much fits in your hand. Also are you getting a little bit of resin past the bottom lap? This will help protect the foam from getting damaged when you sand/surform.

15

Perfectly stated, silly.