Mike, thanks, I have had many other shapers walk into my room, look at a blank that I have’nt started sanding out and ask what program is it.
I try to make the planer work look like it is off the CNC, the planer doesn’t lie, it won’t suddenly take control and create gouges, dips, it rectifies those problems.
Before Tinker (BT), I used the planer in a crude fashion, made the first pass dead up the middle, you know how that works, kind of made some rail attempts, but the surform was the go to “tool” until I could go to a sanding block.
There was NO surform anywhere in Tinker’s factory, if I had brought one in, he would have broken it or tossed it.
Yes I have one, I use it to clean the last foot of the outline where the curve is tight.
Nothing like the surform with the sawblade teeth along one edge to ruin your day
Your planer work is probably cleaner than most CNC, haha. I strive for that, too. On flat or slightly convex bottoms, it's possible to leave almost no ''trails''. I've shown a few other shapers how to do that, always fun to watch their jaws drop. The 2-minute finesand is the payoff. I learnt dem tricks from you at the MSPMMSSD (did I get the acronym correct?).
Thanks for stickin' up for me. To each his own. When I was a kid I back yarded alot of boards with a Surfom and a sanding block. They turned out fine. I know quite a few guys that I have sold blanks too that were able to hack out their first shape and a few subsequent shapes the same way before they eventually went to a planer. I love my Skil and like my Hitachi as well. I've gotten to where I am pretty clean with the planer and don't have much cleanup afterwards. I generally go straight to the sanding block or power sand . There are times though as I said above when I see a high spot or need to clean up an outline that I go the Surform. Since I use it so infrequently it always has a sharp blade. I've actually got a collection of them going back forty or fifty years. Wooden handles and knobs. Remember; PULL not push. Not to go off topic; But I've also got 6 or 8 Nickolson rasp/files. Some of you may know what they are and what their original intended use was. You could practically shape a whole board with a large Nickolson, but I generally use them for rounding over stringers and foiling wooden nose and tailblocks.
I think a surform is a great tool. I wouldn’t want to have to use the surform as my only tool, but when it works really well. I have both the flat blade and the curved blade, and I use them all the time. I also like course grit sanding belts tacked onto wood blocks, or hard foam blocks. I think of the end product from a surform being no worse than a machined blank. It will get you pretty close, but you still need something else to finish it.
An electric planer will cut the work time down quite a bit, but you’ll need to learn how to use the planer, just like you need to learn how to use any other tool. Learn how to use it and how to be careful with it. If you’re only doing a few boards, an electric planer is a lot of money to spend. With a surform you will never cut your finger as badly as you will an electric planer.
My first “real” experience in a shaping room watching a pro do it was watching Skip Frye. He let me be a fly on the wall anytime I wanted. Skip used the Surform end to end a “zillion” times. I am sure his style has not changed much. He is getting close to $1000 for a shape. I than spent 13yrs shaping with Mike Eaton, Mike introduced me to 14" Surforms. Blade length. Mike had a very unique way of “cross hatching” the surform. Very difficult to do but very defective and accurate. He also taught me how to use it as a tool for taking down the stringer. I agree with using the planer as far as possible and use a power sander to to get it really close. Than I like to take my time and “feel” the board. The long, and unfortunately discontinued surform can really dial em in. I have not changed my blade in about 10yrs. One reason is because you can not get em anymore the other it cuts just right. I have a couple left hopefully a lifetime supply. I have an assortment of blocks files Microplane blades etc I still pull out the Surform and “channel Eaton”.
The new blades with the teeth on the side are absolutely useless.
I don’t quite get the whole “ dis the surform “ thing.Some sort of status deal maybe… I don’t know. They have good uses in the shaping process, though using one to actually shape a board or using it for a major portion of the job is not productive.That’s what planes are for, hand or electric.
For some of the detail work they are handy to have.But you do need to know how to use them, have good technique and have the right blades. The blades with the serrated edge suck.
Yeah Ace,the Big Daddy surform is nice!Wish I still had one.
The surform is a great tool, and like all tools, has its limitations. I'm with you, and Ace, I like using it. There is a feel that comes through the tool, that if you are sensitive to it, tells you a lot about the surface you are working on. Older worn blades can be ''Chemically Sharpened'' using hydrochloric acid. Just little trick I picked up along the way.
MD and I both threw ours away years ago. We both use blocks with 36, 40, 50, 60, 80, 100, 120 grit. The only surform I liked was the rat tail for swallow crotches. Some others do like em though. I just got a cleaner cut with a block.
I have access to 36 grit, with pretty strong backing. Only problem is, they are round shaped with a hole in the middle. Shame, because 36 grit takes off just as much foam as the surform. Still, im happy to rough out with the surform.
A lot of tools work if you stick to the basic "remove excess foam until your final shape is all that's left" approach. Chainsaws, circular saws, etc can all be used in the process. I know of a guy in Santa Barbara who used to flatten one side of a coffee can, punch holes from the inside, and use it as a rasp to shape some nice guns.
I guess a good eye and a steady hand are what you really need to make the most of a surform.
There is something nice about using a sharp surform. It slows down the process and allows more touch and (Heaven forgive me) something of a Zen deal. I know the production guys don’t have time for them, but when shaping for fun, I like to take it slow and really stare at the form. I stand back several times through the process and really check out the outline and the curves. And yes, I only use it for blending or removing bumps. Once the real sanding starts that thing gets put away.
Ace, you must be pretty good friends with Skip Frye. I’d pay money to be a "fly on the wall " in his shop. When he was at the pier, I asked Donna his wife, if he let people watch him shape and she gave me a look like I had two heads. His shapes have had a lot of influence on me.
The best thing about a surform is that you can shape all night with it and not wake the family or the neighbours. It’s too slow for the pros but what a great tool for learning how to hold a tool and work on your stance and learn how to do it left and right handed.
