Bert, I checked this out and it is actually that you can buy surftech online from the Becker site and it is shipped to you direct from Becker (USA) I guess this only works from the states as freight to Aus would be too expensive. However these guys were also the official seller for merchandise for the Pipe Masters as well so it simply looks like they are becoming one of the first major online retailers.
Not from Thailand just yet!
Maybe the surfboard market will become like the fine art market.
The masses by mass produced posters (ie tuflites).
The savvy, but economically challenged, will buy limited edition prints ( computer shaped boards).
And the Cognoscenti, the true lovers, and those with deep pockets, will continue to buy custom made, hand shaped, true works of art, which, when their uselful life is over, will find their way into surf museums.
For the record------------I agree completly with Bert’s comments on Surftech. Thoughtful and , provocative and right-on the MONEY. Interesting that they(RF) make this move at this particular point in our"Industry’s" (Lifestyle) history. I have a friend (customer and landlord) who owns a surf school here on Maui and buys “Soft-tops” and Surftechs, both manufactured in Thailand by Cobra for Surftech. Prices have been inching up most notably on the Surftechs. To the point that they cost more than a PU/PE board shaped by a local shaper. My friends reasoning for buying the Epoxy Surftech is that as a rental board they last longer and make fewer trips to my repair shop(currently out on my lanai). The solution to the higher costs of the Surftechs came along when the same factory in Thailand started manufacturing “Southpoint”. A cheaper Epoxy brand of boards. This stuck in the craw of the local Surftech Distributor who has been doing eveything he can to get my friend to place another Surftech order. McDing
As a side note, does anyone know what Becker is doing to get new blanks (if anything)? Or where they are getting them from?
Quote:“Surftech now offically owns the marketplace as far as I’m concerned. said Dave Hollander, co-owner of Becker Surf and Sport, a Hermosa Beach-based surf shop operator that recently struck a deal to sell Surftech boards online.”
Do you think this is good for the real dedicated designers? in our sport and their shapes ,that put their life’s work in to what they do best and offer us all. But can now put it into their own molded production models,then sell them to us as surfers ,to really compensate them for their hard work and money that they have put in to designing them. That we all have and do knock off in the back yard shaping rooms and surfboard building shops of the world .Or is it finely their due as professionals in their know how and art .Now returning to them in real compensation for work done ??and not to sweet it out in the shaping room to make a living just to compete with the knock offs . “Of their own designs”, by those that don’t think or spend the time or money of their own in designing ,but just make their living off others. Who are the leaders in the sport? This is Just a different thought of molding and what it offers the ones who we all follow in designing boards. That we all have lived and bled off, their real ability to make a good living ,for them self and their families. ok , so how is this comment to be interpreted ???
now you can get a surftech , straight from the factory in thailand to your door anywhere in the world ???
can it get any worse ???
now even middle men and retailers are getting shafted …
was there ever rules ? or is it every man for himself …
the worst part is , randy probably has a made in thailand robomower , just so he doesnt have to make eye contact with an ex surfboard building mower man …
hey randy no offense , on the mower comment , but , i can say your really raising the bar …
if others go in this direction as well and we have china direct , vietnam direct, the customer just choosing there slater endorsed model straight from the surfer magazine catalog , to be posted within 2 weeks to your door …
randy just did alot of ex surfboard builders a favour …
now another potential post surfboard industry job , the delivery driver …
knock knock !!!
your new surftech has arrived sir …
shall i unwrap it for you sir ??
" yea and while your at it you can wax it to " " hey biolas , before you get back in that van , make sure you pick that wax wrapper up " …
???well , whats the real story ?
regards
BERT
I remember reading the article in surfing about Surftech…in that article those involved with surftech said that that tech. was mostly for beginers (who are suckers to a sales pitch) and weekend warriors (who are bigger suckers than beginers). I think this still holds true for the most part. When you paddle out with one of those things anywhere outside of one of the little Bubble areas with limited surf…everyone knows exactly where your going to fit into the lineup or if your a pro eating out of the surftech trough.
I am outspoken against them for various reasons, but if not for the hype, I could admit they have their place. Department store surf shops. Shops that want and need inventory to push their hype machines. Custom shops rarely deal with loads of inventory on boards, because they mostly work closely with their customers on custom orders. Just different ways of thinking about selling boards. It’s walmart mentality vs the specialty store mentality. Walmart trunks work as well as many by Quik and the like, but you rarely see anyone that knows how to surf wearing them…wonder why.
I have no particular loyalty to one type of surfboard material technology over another. As a hobbyist, I’m playing around with some new (for me) stuff. I have no particular problem with imported products. I’ve heard so many general derogatory comments about Surtech that I’ve on occasion jumped in and tried to set the record straight. That’s kind of what this post is about… after a check of the pics in this thread is anybody gonna try and tell me that Carve Nalu is a kook?
I definitely do not think everyone riding a Surftech or the like today is a kuk. I do think in the begining it applied though. I still think it mostly appeals to beginers and weekend warriors. The only person in my home beach that rides the popouts that surfs good…sells them with a hefty markup. Nothing against the tech at all. Nothing against Randy on a personal note either (though he does play the same distribution bullcrap as Quik and Volcom, which kisses up to bigger stores) My issue with them is the same as it’s always been…they are not made in a country where people have helped to put surfing where it is today (mostly Oz and America) and I don’t like the hype surrounding them; selling them as if they are an improvement on poly or even handshaped epoxy. I also think if they are able to grab and maintain a larger market share, it will be bad for surfing itself in the long run. I actually like the tech, but in the hands of someone like Bert, not mass produced as S.T. is.
who’s a kook?
we all are !
just diffrent kinds.
Lunchmeat called protzka a glue foot kook one time when
he capped on lunchmeats long board advantage.
yep call anybody a kook you want.
But Qualify it propperrlie
they are all kooks cept fer me and mellor and rooster and maybe baliff
they,none of em could ever turn
they are all jerky
even dora and phil
I see em all fall
they snake me they are a kook
they cant do the mat
they cant maintain my respect or thwart my personal best?
I am entitled to call em all kuk.
then forgive them their short comings and go surf somplace else
where they wont bug me.
…ambrose…
struggling with my own personal growth
keep tthat plastic junk
over by you.
I think they are
f–ked
and the f–king
whole deal stinks
and they deserve their own planet
and the guys that sell em and make em
and design em will regret it
and I wont be sorry for them when
it comes to bite em in the ass
them and the time share car salesmen
that move to the phillipines after
"they pave paradise and
put up a parking lot"
may they rot
may the hand crafters prosper
that’s where we are aligned
It’s such an easy stab in the back, hypocrites, all of them.
Now they are willing to get supplies from anywhere they can get them.
BTW: To me a kuk is not someone who is not skilled, but someone who is either skilled or non skilled at surfing, but arrogantly gets in the way of others trying to have fun. Someone who does not add to the fun, but actually takes away from it with attitude or shear careless ways. Can also be and usually is…the walking billboard. In skeet shooting it would be the guy who peppers you in the back of the head trying to get the first shot, before learning the basic safety techniques in handling a firearm.
I also think if they are able to grab and maintain a larger market share, it will be bad for surfing itself in the long run. I actually like the tech, but in the hands of someone like Bert, not mass produced as S.T. is.
hm interesting …
hyperthetical ???
if i grew my business and attempted to gain larger market share and by doing so moved into mass production techniques , would that be bad for surfing ???
i think surftech has broken alot of new ground , even as the title of this thread insinuated , its a case of standing out …
to date surftech hasnt even had a challenger …
they have a solid product by status quo standards , consistent quality , reliable delivery times , endorsed by known name brands , endorsed by pro surfers …
in some areas they have raised the bar , in other areas they have condidtioned people to except a lowering of the bar …
but they have there place …
i say ,except they are there , i believe randy has actually done more good than harm …
he opened up a global awareness of the potential for composite construction …
so now a new industry can emerge to tackle the areas where the bar has been lowered …
namely custom and a focus back on the individual and his specific requirements , both colour and shape …
i know weve all done a little surftech bashing …
most of mine has been in regard to how randy has set up a global business while the industry was caught sleeping …
so ive always taken the opportunity to highlight the good , along with what the differences are in regard to what i do …
without surftech i would never have had an opportunity to even take my current direction …
so be grateful for what surftech started and the direction its taking the surfboard industry …
love em , hate em , they have made a difference …
i believe time will change the perception of surftech , and in years to come randy will be hailed for the pioneer hes been …
but there are still many who do have valid reasons for not supporting the surftech ideal …
so i for one give credit where its due ,but like so many products , it cant be everything to everyone …
they have there place ,they are what they are , were wasting our time bashing them for what they arent …
regards
BERT
Quote:Quote:hm interesting …
hyperthetical ???
if i grew my business and attempted to gain larger market share and by doing so moved into mass production techniques , would that be bad for surfing ???
Yes, in my opinion for surfboards and the culture as it is…it would be bad. I don’t like globalism and I never will. regardless of whether it becomes the status quo. On a larger scale is takes advantage of people who live in countries where the standard is low as well as the pay. Regardless of how many jobs it provides no pressure is applied to these countries to raise their standards and take the money out of the hands of the Monarchs, goverments and or dictators.
Thailand is run by a so called contitutional monarchy. You guys take a guess at what that means and who gets all the wealth.
Quote:i think surftech has broken alot of new ground , even as the title of this thread insinuated , its a case of standing out …
to date surftech hasnt even had a challenger …
they have a solid product by status quo standards , consistent quality , reliable delivery times , endorsed by known name brands , endorsed by pro surfers …
I don't think they have broken new ground at all. They are using 25 year old windsurfing tech and old and proven hype advertising techniques. Not to mention the, "I'm too cool cause I am from California, so I can only deal with certain people," aspect of the whole thing. I think it's fairly typical surf industry stuff really. Same as Merrick did a few years ago. No, I don't think Merrick as added much to surfboard design. I do think he produced a consistent product, just as Randy does. There is something to be said for that.Quote:in some areas they have raised the bar , in other areas they have condidtioned people to except a lowering of the bar …
but they have there place …
i say ,except they are there , i believe randy has actually done more good than harm …
he opened up a global awareness of the potential for composite construction …
so now a new industry can emerge to tackle the areas where the bar has been lowered …
namely custom and a focus back on the individual and his specific requirements , both colour and shape …
I tend to disagree half and agree half here. Awareness is fine, but like the Clark foam closing there is also alot of ingnorance. Many think all epoxy construction or sandwhich construction is the same. So did I, until I was show all the many different additives and ways of making the stuff. It's extremely diverse and takes alot of talent to do it right.Quote:know weve all done a little surftech bashing …
most of mine has been in regard to how randy has set up a global business while the industry was caught sleeping …
so ive always taken the opportunity to highlight the good , along with what the differences are in regard to what i do …
without surftech i would never have had an opportunity to even take my current direction …
so be grateful for what surftech started and the direction its taking the surfboard industry …
love em , hate em , they have made a difference …
i believe time will change the perception of surftech , and in years to come randy will be hailed for the pioneer hes been …
Again, I am not wild about any globalism, but I have no issues with Randy setting up a sucessful business. The bottom line with me, as I have said, it the stuff is well made, but still junk as far as I am concerned. I don’t like the way it rides or the way it looks. Thats just a personal opinion. I don’t like the way it’s sold nor the politics and worship of whose the most important man in surfing thats been pushed about it. Again only a personal opinion. As for him having no competition. It’s only a matter of time, but with Quiksilver and others being more than willing to step in if need be, I am sure taking over the industry will not be that hard. Until the next falling apart. Nothing holds up the surf industry as it is, but hype. This is why it’s gone up and down over the years. Quik as been one of the few who can hand through most any change, but you have to wonder even about that. Op was big as well at one time. I could simply be lamenting the passing of times gone by with regards to boards and how they are made, but if I know my surfers and shops. It will not be long before the next latest greatest is here and surftech gets put on the back burner.
"I remember reading the article in surfing about Surftech…in that article those involved with surftech said that that tech. was mostly for beginers (who are suckers to a sales pitch) and weekend warriors (who are bigger suckers than beginers). I think this still holds true for the most part. When you paddle out with one of those things anywhere outside of one of the little Bubble areas with limited surf…everyone knows exactly where your going to fit into the lineup or if your a pro eating out of the surftech trough. "
"I definitely do not think everyone riding a Surftech or the like today is a kuk. "
“BTW: To me a kuk is not someone who is not skilled, but someone who is either skilled or non skilled at surfing, but arrogantly gets in the way of others trying to have fun. Someone who does not add to the fun, but actually takes away from it with attitude or shear careless ways. Can also be and usually is…the walking billboard.”
"walmart mentality vs the specialty store mentality. Walmart trunks work as well as many by Quik and the like, but you rarely see anyone that knows how to surf wearing them…wonder why. "
[sharpen pencil, grab notepad]
Ok. Great points here. So, according to “the lineup”, you’re a kook and/or a billboard if you ride a tuflite. Oh, wait, no. Not everybody is, just someone who seems to be surfing well. No, wait, just someone who rides a Tuflite that has a logo on their board, and has non-Wal-Mart baggies on…oh wait, scratch that.
[scribble, scribble, erase, erase, scribble…]
If not living in bubble, need cool baggies, must not ride board with logo, must surf everyday to show extra stoke-commitment, must not say words like “stoke”, must not experiment, particularly if a logo is involved, unless on shorts, or rashguard.
[drink a sip of OJ and pat self on back for learning what is really required to go surfing]
[Aaahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh. Real Florida Orange Juice. Dat’s soooome good stuff. ]
Wait. What kind of rash guard do the “real surfer” people wear?
[scribble, scribble, scribble, erase, scribble]
Last note to self: Non-bubble-beings MUST surf everyday, or one becomes a sucker for surf industry marketing.
I’m assuming that you are a shaper and are thus a member of the surfing industry whether you like it or not. Here’s a suggestion from your customer base of non-industry professionals that dedicate up to and over 40 hours of each week to activities that are often not surf-related in order to make the money to buy your goods so that you can have enough money to buy ours. Stop complaining about Surftech, and catch up. Catch up to their search for better technology and catch up to their ability to do business effectively and efficiently anywhere in the world, while still allowing local surf shops to make a decent profit off of board sales for a change, and contribute more to the local economy. We don’t really care how you do it at this point, we’ve proven that over and over, and will continue to prove it no matter how much you complain.
Do you know what we really need?!
We (consumers) desperately need people who can provide us with hand-shaped epoxy boards (and/or other alternative technologies). Different surftech models may work wonderfully for different people, and some are not suited to anybody at all. I own 2 models, and they have their place in the quiver, but so do my hand-shaped epoxy board and my polyester board. Same can be said of most shaper’s stock boards. They may be excellent shapes by world-class shapers, but a stock board is a stock board, and not everyone will be satisfied. Furthermore, not everyone even feels the need to place custom orders to get custom shapes, all the time. But using your mentality, even if we do decide to go custom, right now, we don’t have to go far to look for polyester shapers for boards that don’t last much longer than a year. However, it is tough to do the same in finding knowledgable shapers that can deliver a quality hand-shaped epoxy board in a reasonable amount of time.
Scott West
“Buying Quality Surfboards since 1986”
Let us know when your job gets off-shored. You might have a different take on the matter.
Are you kidding me?! I’m in the Information Technology field. The global economy and outsourcing is a part of life. With giant companies like Nike buying significant stock of the surf industry, but slapping a cool, surf-acceptable label on it, why did you think the surf industry was immuned?
Again, provide good technology choices locally and we (the consumers) will buy your stuff. Remember, I’m not asking for mass produced, cheap polyester boards made in China. I’m willing to drop $600 for a decent board that won’t fall apart in a year, and so are many other people that are ready to drop dough on a Tuflite. That’s $600 that I’d like to give a local shaper for a good, hand-shaped epoxy board. I bought a stock hand-shaped epoxy board because the closest local source is 8 hours away, and is slammed with so many orders I’d have to wait until late Spring at earliest.
Can you provide good technology choices to your customers who are looking for lasting quality for their money or are you content to complain about outsourcing and how evil your possible, but not inevitable, successors are?!
A friend of mine works in in the IT field. The company he works for out sourced all their programing jobs to India. Luckily he’s in sales. He figures that his job is safe until the company figures out a way to out source that too. It’s mad race to the bottom. There will be plenty of Macjobs out there. Hopefully they will pay enough that one could afford to buy a Surftech.
We (consumers) desperately need people who can provide us with hand-shaped epoxy boards (and/or other alternative technologies).
Scott West
“Buying Quality Surfboards since 1986”
How many Codas do you want. I can have them shipped to you in three to four weeks. From one of the best in the business.
I appreciate that, but it kind of helps me make my point. It seems that the industry hub for good hand-shaped epoxy guys is in Central Fla, which is about 6 hours away. In fact, I got my last board at a local shop here that does business with a guy down there that makes excellent boards for the local conditions (Dave Deitrich, Davo Surf Designs). It was the second one of his boards that I’ve owned and I wanted to do a custom, but was informed that it would be a long time as he was slammed with orders and wouldn’t be dropping off anymore boards until the Spring. So, wanting semi-immediate gratification (within a month) instead I got something that was close enough off the rack at the local shop I’ve been going to for the past 20 years. The board works very well, so I can’t complain about not getting a custom to my specs, and the shop owners are friends of mine and I have trusted their judgement for a long time. In fact, I bought my first epoxy board there 13 years ago (Greg Loehr), so it shows that the choice to stock such boards and offer this technology alternative to Surftech has been around longer than Surftech or Boardworks. I’m not sure it predates Cobra, but I’m sure Cobra was pre-occupied with windsurfers during most of that time, anyway. As far as I’ve seen, that shop is the only local shop, out of 7, that even sells hand-shaped epoxy boards as part of their regular inventory, even though I know a lot of local people that still search out epoxy shapes. Those folks usually wind up settling for off-the-rack Surftechs over PU boards due to a lack of immediate, or even sort-of immediate options for epoxy. On the other hand, we’ve got at least 2 shapers to go to locally for polyester boards, and most local stores are chock full of plenty of local (within 200 miles), national, and international PU board brands.
This thread starts off complaining about the fact that Surftech is selling directly off the Internet, thus bypassing the purchasing process of talking to the shaper or local surf shop, and forming that personal relationship. And whille I appreciate you giving me more options to get my hands on new hand-shaped epoxy boards, you are essentially doing the same thing that Surftech is doing in asking me to bypass my local shops and/or shapers to go through you to get a board of a brand that I have never seen any local surfers riding from someone I don’t know. I’m telling you that I’m like a lot of other people that would like to see more choice in the shops/factories owned by people we’ve already made relationships with. Just for clarification, that’s also not a bash on Steve Forstall or Coda surfboards, which have gotten rave reviews in Florida, I’m just trying to illustrate the point that the more hand-shaped epoxies are stocked in local shops (wherever they are), the better the chances are that people will be asking for them over Surftechs.
Wave,
YOu make some good points. The reason is not that guys like Steve won’t sell to shops. He is in some good shops. The main reason is Steve is going to command a good wholesale price and shop owners want to make $300 to double their money on popouts or boards from china. The shops in our part of Florida, take other peoples designs, put their name on them, buy the moulds from boardworks, send the templates to China and load up on Surftechs. They double their money on boardworks and chinese boards and make a chunk on Surftechs. Thats the reason you see shop owners loading up with that junk instead of using shapers. It’s going to get worse for them, when these companies, with all the builders templates in hand simply go around them and go direct to their customers. Quik is doing it, Rip Curl, Billibong and most of the rest are going direct. Why not Surftech.
I will stick with shapers, because I like dealing with the many personalities and expertise and I don’t like to play surf industry politics with Reps and company owners that have no sack and would sell their children for a buck.
Look at the shirts Surftech had at the Trade show. How arrogant. Totally within their rights to make a joke at Clarks expense, but they have given you and I a look at their blade hidden beneath their claims of looking out for the industry and blah blah. It’s not in any business best iterest to look out for their competition. The bottom line is always…the bottom line. Surftech needed the shops to get out their and be accepted. 90% of surf shops today are in bed and play the same hype game as the industry giants. The reason you don’t have hand shaped epoxy at your local shop is probably because your local shop does not want it there and can make more money with the sellout popouts.
In 20 years…who is going to want a popout found in a garage like they do a mint condition Da Cat (not my favorite old board, but an example).